Oldskool Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Time for your daily dose of the game we all love to hate to love: The Race Card! -------------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/09/15/congressman-people-don-white-hoods-wilson-rebuked/ Rep. Joe Wilson's outburst last week is drawing new recriminations from his colleagues, with a member of the Congressional Black Caucus suggesting that a failure to rebuke the South Carolina Republican is tantamount to supporting the most blatant form of organized racism in American history. In an obvious reference to the Ku Klux Klan, Rep. Hank Johnson, D-Ga., said Tuesday that people will put on "white hoods and ride through the countryside" if emerging racist attitudes, which he says were subtly supported by Wilson, are not rebuked. He said Wilson must be disciplined as an example. The charged comments come as the House is preparing to take further action against Wiilson. House Democratic leaders decided to formally discipline him Tuesday afternoon for jeering President Obama during last week's joint session of Congress. Wilson bellowed "You lie!" as Obama delivered his address. The punishment is expected take the form of a "resolution of disapproval," which is a milder version of other more traditional means of congressional discipline. Wilson can avoid the slap on the wrist by apologizing to his colleagues on the House floor, but Wilson -- who already apologized directly to the White House -- has said that's not going to happen. While he has been widely condemned by colleagues on both sides of the aisle for breaching protocol, some have gone a step further and accused Wilson of being racially motivated. Johnson seemed to reference the protests held in Washington, D.C., on Saturday in making his claim. While many protesters were there to demonstrate against big government and federal over-spending, Johnson argued that a "fringe" element is motivated by race and that Wilson's behavior is a "wink" to that fringe. New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd wrote in her column Sunday that Wilson's outburst convinced her that racial angst is the underlying motive among Obama critics like Wilson. "I've been loath to admit that the shrieking lunacy of the summer ... had much to do with race," she wrote. "But Wilson's shocking disrespect for the office of the president -- no Democrat ever shouted 'liar' at W. when he was hawking a fake case for war in Iraq -- convinced me: Some people just can't believe a black man is president and will never accept it." Dowd wrote that Wilson "clearly did not like being lectured and even rebuked by the brainy black president presiding over the majestic chamber." Asked about the claim, White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said race is not the factor. But it is against House rules to call the president a "liar" or accuse him of "lying" when the House is in session, which is the basis for the punishment Tuesday. "We're not the British parliament for a reason," said Kristie Greco, spokeswoman for House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn, D-S.C.,."Ignoring the issue sets a precedent for bad behavior." Greco described the resolution as "direct" and "non-partisan." "It goes directly to conduct on the House floor," Greco said. Most Democrats in the House appear poised to sanction Wilson. But many Republicans argue that since Wilson has already apologized, this step is unnecessary. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., opposed punishing Wilson until Clyburn and other Democratic leaders persuaded her to change her mind. Critics say Democrats are only prolonging the issue and hurting themselves by pushing for further action against Wilson. Republicans may use the Wilson resolution to try to embarrass Democrats Tuesday, by bringing up the alleged ethical lapses of House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Charlie Rangel, D-N.Y., or Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., or others. The resolution is "privileged," meaning whenever it is introduced the measure goes to the front of the legislative line. It is unclear who will call up the measure. A "resolution of disapproval" is not one of the four forms of discipline typically meted out in the House. The most commonly used means of punishment are expulsion, censure, reprimand or fine. For instance, in 1997, former House Speaker Newt Gingrich was both reprimanded and fined for his book deal. Rep. Barney Frank, D-Mass., was reprimanded in 1990 for ethical breaches tied to a male prostitute. Republicans tried to censure Rep. Pete Stark, D-Calif., in 2007 for comments he made on the House floor about President Bush. But Democrats voted to set aside that effort. A simple majority vote is needed to approve the resolution against Wilson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Congress is the short bus on the Hill. Ignore what comes out of that house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wantarace17 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 So stupid...what Wilson said was completely disrespectful but don't play the race card thats stretching it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I suppose every disagreement with this president will result in a charge of racism from somebody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilmer17 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 The GOP would love nothing more than the Dems to go this route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 The GOP would love nothing more than the Dems to go this route. I'd have to agree with you on this one. Dems should really let this go. Obama accepted the apology so that should be that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Lets start with the Grand Wizard of the democratic party, the Exalted Cyclops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 The GOP would love nothing more than the Dems to go this route. Seriously. Painting this with the Racism brush won't help Obama, and might end up hurting him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayH81 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Okay, here goes- I don't often agree with my elected Representation (or for that matter, the past 3 and current Presidents) on policy or actions. Much of the time, I believe that what comes out of a politicians mouth is a direct lie, a lie by evasion, or a lie by misrepresentation. However, when I exercise my right and responsibility as a citizen, and communicate with them, I make my points as factual and polite as is possible. My rights and responsibilities and beliefs do not trump the shared human right/need for courtesy. In a deliberative body, shared courtesy is the only way in which compromise may emerge and consensus be gained. If this guy violated House rules or protocols, he should be punished as such rules or protocols be allowed if his peers wish to maintain decorum and have a deliberative body. I passionately disagree with many things, but, even if I am right/correct, I have no right to be rude and disrespectful to the office when directly interacting with it. There seems to be a growing belief in American Society that if you are "right/correct", you can do anything you wish to do with impunity (and in many cases, an expectation of admiration). This seems the path to chaos and anarchy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuvtheSkins428 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I suppose every disagreement with this president will result in a charge of racism from somebody. That's certainly the way it seems... remember the first Tea Parties and that Janine Garafalo or whatever the hell her name is calling everyone who attended racists? Just because we don't agree with Obama's policies or speak out against his proposals - as is our right to do so as Americans - doesn't mean we are racists. Where is this country going with free speech? It's distressing to see this? Was what Wilson did disrespectful? Yes, it would have been disrespectful to do that to anyone. But not racists. Can we call Kanye West a racist for what he did? What about that? Was that racist?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Where is this country going with free speech? It's distressing to see this? Was what Wilson did disrespectful? Yes, it would have been disrespectful to do that to anyone. But not racists. Can we call Kanye West a racist for what he did? What about that? Was that racist?? Neither was racist. And "free speech" has nothing to do with the discussion, really. Everyone is legally free to say whatever they want, but sometimes there are practical consequences for saying something stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Okay, here goes-I don't often agree with my elected Representation (or for that matter, the past 3 and current Presidents) on policy or actions. Much of the time, I believe that what comes out of a politicians mouth is a direct lie, a lie by evasion, or a lie by misrepresentation. However, when I exercise my right and responsibility as a citizen, and communicate with them, I make my points as factual and polite as is possible. My rights and responsibilities and beliefs do not trump the shared human right/need for courtesy. In a deliberative body, shared courtesy is the only way in which compromise may emerge and consensus be gained. If this guy violated House rules or protocols, he should be punished as such rules or protocols be allowed if his peers wish to maintain decorum and have a deliberative body. I passionately disagree with many things, but, even if I am right/correct, I have no right to be rude and disrespectful to the office when directly interacting with it. There seems to be a growing belief in American Society that if you are "right/correct", you can do anything you wish to do with impunity (and in many cases, an expectation of admiration). This seems the path to chaos and anarchy. This isn't really about whether or not the guy was being rude or not...it's more about whether or not his rudeness should be seen as a clear sign of racism and if fear mongering about the KKK riding over the countryside is an appropriate response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stadium-Armory Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 I suppose every disagreement with this president will result in a charge of racism from somebody. To be fair (and I think this is WAY overboard), the problem isn't with the disagreement, its with the way in which Wilson expressed his disagreement. Don't change the argument please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldskool Posted September 15, 2009 Author Share Posted September 15, 2009 Neither was racist. And "free speech" has nothing to do with the discussion, really. Everyone is legally free to say whatever they want, but sometimes there are practical consequences for saying something stupid. Very true. Everyone from Rep. Wilson, to Maureen Dowd of NYT to this Congressman playing the race card needs to STFU and let cooler heads prevail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhoRUSupposed2Be Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 This is taking a weird turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 .it's more about whether or not his rudeness should be seen as a clear sign of racism . Can you provide any REASONABLE substantiation as to how this can be remotely construed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 This isn't really about whether or not the guy was being rude or not...it's more about whether or not his rudeness should be seen as a clear sign of racism and if fear mongering about the KKK riding over the countryside is an appropriate response. Right here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Can you provide any REASONABLE substantiation as to how this can be remotely construed? Since the idiot(idiots) introduced race as a motive it becomes part of the issue Is accusing a congress man of racial motivated actions any less disruptive than 'you lie'?...Both cause distraction and are rather rude;) Much less the hoods and countryside bit,which expands the bs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stadium-Armory Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Watching outside the lines on ESPN.. they're donig a piece about "civility in America". Given the recent incidents: Serena, Joe Wilson, Kanye. They even put Michael Jordan's recent acceptance speech in there as being too ****y. Interesting to see this conversation get more traction in the national discussion, and I am happy to see us talking about it. I believe we need to be more civil to each other (its part of what seperates us from animals). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 It doesn't exactly help that people are treating Joe Wilson as a hero, either. And it probably doesn't help that Rep. Wilson is a member of the Sons of the Confederacy, either. People are asking the question: Would this person had yelled if such a manner if the President were white? It doesn't come across good for the GOP, either, especially when you have Tea Partiers marching around and yelling "You lie!" to the president over an issue . . . that he wasn't lying about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurrayH81 Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 This isn't really about whether or not the guy was being rude or not...it's more about whether or not his rudeness should be seen as a clear sign of racism and if fear mongering about the KKK riding over the countryside is an appropriate response. Ahh, okay, well, in the absence of information on how this man has conducted himself publicly (which I don't have) as a pattern of typical behavior, I have to assume that he was responding to the issue and the President's comments more than to the color of his skin. Perhaps others have tied his historical public and private behavior and conclude that the only reason he allowed his rudeness to be expressed in this way was motivated solely by his lack of respect for the Presidents skin color. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Watching outside the lines on ESPN.. they're donig a piece about "civility in America". Given the recent incidents: Serena, Joe Wilson, Kanye. They even put Michael Jordan's recent acceptance speech in there as being too ****y. Interesting to see this conversation get more traction in the national discussion, and I am happy to see us talking about it. I believe we need to be more civil to each other (its part of what seperates us from animals). Apparently Wilson thought he was at a Town Hall meeting where he can scream whatever he wants. And apparently since so many Republicans supported this Code-Pink style "debate," this will become the norm in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 It doesn't come across good for the GOP, either, especially when you have Tea Partiers marching around and yelling "You lie!" to the president over an issue . . . that he wasn't lying about. Umm, since there are what 5 or so contemplated bills out there, in fact what both Wilson & Obama said COULD be true. They are not mutually exclusive at that point time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 It doesn't exactly help that people are treating Joe Wilson as a hero, either. And it probably doesn't help that Rep. Wilson is a member of the Sons of the Confederacy, either. People are asking the question: Would this person had yelled if such a manner if the President were white? It doesn't come across good for the GOP, either, especially when you have Tea Partiers marching around and yelling "You lie!" to the president over an issue . . . that he wasn't lying about. Being a member of SOC is racist now?...Is calling someone out for lying? What if it appeared he was lying? (see WH clarification that they WILL use some screening program,which was rejected before) I do agree treating him as a hero is out of good judgment,what he did was rude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Ahh, okay, well, in the absence of information on how this man has conducted himself publicly (which I don't have) as a pattern of typical behavior, I have to assume that he was responding to the issue and the President's comments more than to the color of his skin. How is yelling during a Presidential speech "responding to the issue" ) Especially since H.R. 3200 specifically forbids federal funding going to non-US legal residents)? To me, the "yell" represents the sort of disrespect from the right-wing that many of us believe is race-based, especially all the stuff we have seen and heard over the last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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