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WPC: We need the rest of the story


JimmiJo

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http://www.warpathconfidential.com/?p=896

We need the rest of the story

By John Pappas

Warpath Confidential Editor

A funny thing happened on the way to the 2009 season. While we are all debating the play of the Washington Redskins offensive line and quarterbacks, the Washington Post declared war on the owner and his ticket office.

With a zeal usually reserved for Republican presidents, the Post this week launched a multi-part investigative series examining ticket sales to brokers before fans and the team’s practice of suing those defaulting on premium seat contracts.

These stories are just the thing the Redskins want to avoid in the midst of hard economic times. The articles are generating a lot of discussion among fans, little of it positive. They are probably generating interest around the league as well.

While it appears the Post did their homework on the stories, it is probably fair to say that the articles demonstrate some bias.

The initial story on the team selling groups of tickets to brokers, even before offering to fans of the team, seemed to confirm what some have suspected for years; that the fix is in on ticket sales to fans of opposing franchises. The team however, states it discovered the issues and disciplined the employees responsible months ago. It is debatable whether owner Dan Snyder was aware of the transactions while they were occurring. And the ratio of Pittsburgh and New England fans seemed down significantly in the preseason games this year than in past seasons.

Click on the link to read the full article...

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I don't even see why that matters. The list is what it is...does its existence or non-existence really matter to the fans?

For those that want GA tickets I imagine it does matter.

If there is no waiting list then why not just tell people and sell those tickets?

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For those that want GA tickets I imagine it does matter.

If there is no waiting list then why not just tell people and sell those tickets?

Well, I must have misspoke. There obviously IS a waiting list for GA tickets. My point was, who cares if it's 160K or 40K?? When your turn is up, you'll get a call.

The fact that the Redskins aren't blacked out means there are more people who want GA tickets than there are GA tickets to be sold. I don't think the Skins are hording tickets for ****s and giggles.

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Well, I must have misspoke. There obviously IS a waiting list for GA tickets. My point was, who cares if it's 160K or 40K?? When your turn is up, you'll get a call.

The fact that the Redskins aren't blacked out means there are more people who want GA tickets than there are GA tickets to be sold. I don't think the Skins are hording tickets for ****s and giggles.

There seem to be just enough holes to argue that there is not a waiting list, though. I'm not saying that I believe that personally.

I'm simply stating there is enough cloudy information out there for someone to think there might not really be one. That's all.

:2cents:

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The real issue is manipulation.

Waitlist or not, the Skins have been denying upper deck fans the opportunity to move down for years. All the while "scalping" prime seats to all comers, usually opposing fans.

As soon as fans realize that they need not buy season tickets to go to all the games, is when Danny is in real trouble. I am not even talking about Craigslist or Stubhub or Ebay. I am referring to the hundreds and even thousands of tickets circulating outside the field before each game to be had for next to nothing. This issue has barely been touched on in any debate.

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Well, I must have misspoke. There obviously IS a waiting list for GA tickets. My point was, who cares if it's 160K or 40K?? When your turn is up, you'll get a call.

The fact that the Redskins aren't blacked out means there are more people who want GA tickets than there are GA tickets to be sold. I don't think the Skins are hording tickets for ****s and giggles.

Wouldn't you be upset if you were given the great myth of tens of thousands in wait, if you were an upper-deck ticket holder who wanted an upgrade... ? They clearly have enough available seats that upper-deck holders can upgrade, but they also know they won't make the same money from a season ticket holder. Not an illegal thing, but a pretty ****ty thing.

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The article yesterday said the reporter was allowed to inspect the waiting list, which was printed out and assembled on several large three-ring binders.

Of course, they could have gotten a computer to print out random names from the phone book.

As someone pointed out in another thread, there is a list. Every company has a marketing list that they go down and try to sell their product. Not everyone on that list is willing to buy the product just because they are on the list. Saying there is no list is kinda silly when most of us probably get mail from the team. I know that the Skins have offered to sell me club seats a couple of times via mail, asking me to call the ticket office. Course, I don't want club seats and I'm not sure if I'd take season tickets if they were offered to me. Things are tight with one income and a 3 year old at home.

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Wouldn't you be upset if you were given the great myth of tens of thousands in wait, if you were an upper-deck ticket holder who wanted an upgrade... ? They clearly have enough available seats that upper-deck holders can upgrade, but they also know they won't make the same money from a season ticket holder. Not an illegal thing, but a pretty ****ty thing.

Sorry, I'm slow today.

I would certainly be upset if there was no waiting list and I was an upper deck fan and there were available lower deck seats. If that's your question, then yes.

I wouldn't be upset if there was a smaller waiting list than has been stated and everything else was the same.

To me, whether there are 9 or 90,000 people ahead of me, it wouldn't make a difference.

Again, maybe I don't understand your question or the process.

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I don't even see why that matters. The list is what it is...does its existence or non-existence really matter to the fans?

As I have attended games and seen more and more fans of the opposition, it has bothered me. I've never sold any of my tickets to somebody who will root for the other team. (If I can't go to a game, I do give or sell the seats to loyal fans, aka my friends.)

I always wondered why the Redskins didn't set up a system through which fans on the waiting list could buy tickets from season ticket holders who couldn't attend. That would be a great way to keep the interest of those on the waiting list and also keep the fan base strong at games...to help the team win. The FO could play a key role in keeping Redskin Country Redskin Country.

But, if the waiting list really isn't what I thought it was, well then that type of idea would have no merit.

This broker thing does bother me, too, as it is an attack on Redskin Country.

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As I have attended games and seen more and more fans of the opposition, it has bothered me. I've never sold any of my tickets to somebody who will root for the other team. (If I can't go to a game, I do give or sell the seats to loyal fans, aka my friends.)

I always wondered why the Redskins didn't set up a system through which fans on the waiting list could buy tickets from season ticket holders who couldn't attend. That would be a great way to keep the interest of those on the waiting list and also keep the fan base strong at games...to help the team win. The FO could play a key role in keeping Redskin Country Redskin Country.

But, if the waiting list really isn't what I thought it was, well then that type of idea would have no merit.

This broker thing does bother me, too, as it is an attack on Redskin Country.

You know there is no requirement of being a fan of the team to own season tickets, right?

I have a coworker who is a Cowboys fan who owns season tickets. He sells most of them.

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I always wondered why the Redskins didn't set up a system through which fans on the waiting list could buy tickets from season ticket holders who couldn't attend. That would be a great way to keep the interest of those on the waiting list and also keep the fan base strong at games...to help the team win.
There are literally thousands of tickets to be had each week. Ask anyone who ever had or does currently have season tickets and they will tell you it is easier to unload a dead dog than tickets. You wind up calling 50 people and advertising on CL or here (here is a complete waste of time) and maybe you get a reply. You try Face Value, then you lower your price, finally you try to give them away. I have come to the conclusion that waitlist people either do not exist or absolutely refuse to go to games until they have season tickets.
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Here is the issue I think, that the ticket broker from asc mentioned yesterday. He is given the right to buy GA seats because he's buying premier ones. So, basically you jump to the front of this waiting list if you buy something of more value. If the list is that long, then some people have been waiting since before FedEx, right? Before there was their premier seats available? Plus, what average fan/family buys two sets of seats in different locations, with a contract to the more expensive ones?

How often has that happened? I'm sure a handful of times for the rich. But not often.

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While I highly doubt that the Skins are totally innocent here, the fact is that everyone's accusing them of manipulation, when in fact the Post is doing the same thing. Snyder and the Post have a well documented feud, which goes back to when he yanked many of their tickets because they were selling them (most of the time to opposing fans). I'm sorry, but I honestly can't fault Daniel Snyder there. Regardless of how many gazzilions of dollars he has, he was giving something away for free and someone else was making a profit on it.

I find it very ironic that the initial story seemed to concern the employees in the ticket office that were selling these seats to brokers, and then suddenly out of the blue it turned into a story about the Redskins suing their fans. The front page of the Post this morning was that 72 year old grandma sitting on a Redskins couch with a tissue on her eyes crying. I don't know about any of you, but I think that's yellow journalism at it's worst. "How dare the Redskins sue their fans!" seems to be the attitude of the Post, and they're trying to stir up that same sentiment in the fanbase in the form of hatred towards the Redskins and Snyder. I would agree that suing your clients should be a last resort, and from the sounds of things it truly is with the Redskins. But ultimately, when you sign a contract, that contract is set in stone. One thing I can't stand is someone that doesn't honor their agreements. If you have a customer that's signed a deal and you've tried every which way to work something out for him, you have two options: 1) Write it off and accept that the guy's word means nothing 2) Do something about it. The Redskins obviously decided upon option two, and I can't say I blame them. I don't buy the adage that "they can afford to eat the money." Maybe they can, maybe they can't, but the fact is that when you sign a contract, you're making a committment. These people should have taken into consideration that things might not be rosy forever. (Now having said that, when the Redskins went to court and won those decisions, they should have issued the tickets to those fans as opposed to re-selling them.)

Folks, the fact is that we're being led to believe that Daniel Snyder is using all of us. Maybe he is to a certain extent, as does every professional sports owner. But the Post is also trying to use us...against the Redskins and against Daniel Snyder. Let's just say that their little attempt of a mutiny went somewhere, and the Redskins one day failed to sell out a game because people got fed up. Do you think that wouldn't be a huge story, worthy of a lot of ink in the Washington Post? Wouldn't they love to be able to say that they broke that story? What they don't realize is that the Redskins are special in this town and to their fans worldwide. And I understand what some people are going to say..."someone should tell Daniel Snyder that as well." I don't like Daniel Snyder, but I can't say that I think he's totally behind this; he should have had better control over his people, but I believe that he really was as "livid" as they say he was in this case. But if the Post succeeds, they'll take Daniel Snyder down, along with the Washington Redskins. It's up to the consumer to decide if Daniel Snyder's ruining the Redskins, or someone/thing else. But it's obvious to me that this is being done for political and vendettive reasons, and being disguised as just "protecting the population." GO SKINS!!!

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Lol. To those defending the skins let me tell you. Something is going on. Tickets are all over the place except in the hands of us on the waiting list.

I do not get to go to many games but I can always find tickets and there agree tons of scalpers at the games.

The system is broken. Something is not right and no matter the post's motives we the fans are the losers.

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You know there is no requirement of being a fan of the team to own season tickets, right?

I have a coworker who is a Cowboys fan who owns season tickets. He sells most of them.

I know, but I remember many games over the years that I didn't see any opposition fans. But, that was at good old RFK.

Move the team to Maryland, add on an additional 25,000 + seats, and what do you get? Fans who yell out "O" for the pathetic Orioles during the National Anthem.

Hail to the Redskins! All others, hit the road.

(Nothing personal about your co-worker.)

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