LB Dizzle Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Look, I don't want to trade multiple picks to move up and draft ANYONE, BUT sometimes it is necessary if you are trying to get your franchise QB. If it doesn't work out then you are screwed. If it does then you truly have a chance to build a dynasty. Below is the list of every superbowl winning QB... 1 Bart Starr 2 Bart Starr 3 Joe Namath 4. Len Dawson 5. John Unitas 6. Roger Staubach 7. Bob Griese 8. Bob Griese 9. Terry Bradshaw 10. Terry Bradshaw 11. Ken Stabler 12. Roger Staubach 13. Terry Bradshaw 14. Terry Bradshaw 15. Jim Plunkett 16. Joe Montana 17. Joe Theismann 18. Jim Plunkett 19. Joe Montana 20. Jim McMahon 21. Phil Simms 22. Doug Williams 23. Joe Montana 24. Joe Montana 25. Jeff Hostetler 26. Mark Rypien 27. Troy Aikman 28. Troy Aikman 29. Steve Young 30. Troy Aikman 31. Brett Favre 32. John Elway 33. John Elway 34. Kurt Warner 35. Trent Dilfer 36. Tom Brady 37. Brad Johnson 38. Tom Brady 39. Tom Brady 40. Ben Roethlisberger 41. Peyton Manning 42. Eli Manning 43. Ben Roethlisberger The great majority of these QBs are thought of as the best ever, Hall of Famers. I know that there are some that seem out of place like Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer (the most recent two), but I think this list really shows that having a GREAT QB is one of the main ingrediants to winning a superbowl and is pretty much a must if you hope to win multiple superbowls. The only reason I wouldn't go insane (or want to hurt Snyder as my friends say) if we trade up and draft Sanchez, is because he is at least a HOPE to become one of the guys on this list. In my opinion, and I think in even most of the Campbell supports' opinions, Campbell's absolute best case scenario is to be one of the odd balls on this list that snuck on because their D was great and everything just fell into place. We have won three superbowls and some would argue that all three of our QBs on this list are the "odd balls" that are lucky to be there. Wouldn't you like to possibly have that QB that is expected to be there, and hopefully multiple times. I think that is why you need to at least consider drafting a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aston Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 In my opinion, and I think in even most of the Campbell supports' opinions, Campbell's abosute best case scenario is to be one of the odd balls on this list that snuck on because their D was great and everything just fell into place.As it stands, your absolutely right, but also understand that most on that list weren't putting up HOF numbers in their first 3 seasons. Bradshaw, for example, didn't have a QB rating higher than 65 until his 6th year. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Bradshaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB Dizzle Posted April 21, 2009 Author Share Posted April 21, 2009 As it stands, your absolutely right, but also understand that most on that list weren't putting up HOF numbers in their first 3 seasons. Bradshaw, for example, didn't have a QB rating higher than 65 until his 6th year. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Bradshaw That is a good point. But I guess I just don't think he will become one either. Just my opinion. If he is still our QB this year, then I sure hope I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhouse Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 To the people that are warming up to the Sanchez idea or are already driving the bandwagon, I ask you one question? Why the rush? Campbell has been mediocre and I agree but he is in his contract year, just one more year to try to duplicate that 6-2 start and keep it going. If that doesn't happen you just move on and look for next year's top QB prospect. In my eyes, there are better prospects coming out next year anyways. This way you can focus on filling other needs (OL/DL/LB) this year and just try to support JC one last time. That seems to be the more sensible and less risky route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 As it stands, your absolutely right, but also understand that most on that list weren't putting up HOF numbers in their first 3 seasons. Bradshaw, for example, didn't have a QB rating higher than 65 until his 6th year. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Bradshaw So you are trying to reason with this? lol... Fact is, many thought Bradshaw was a bust and were wanting to replace him is first few years in the league. Plunket was a bust for a few teams untill he won a superbowl. Doug Williams was thought of pretty badly in Tampa... He didnt have "it" and couldnt win a game by himself. Steve Young's experience there wasnt too good either. Phil Simms wasnt too highly thought of in New York his first few years if my memory serves me correctly. Almost every QB that has success early in the carreers are ones who happen to have good team in place around then when they got there such as Flacco. Ryan is one of the few exceptions to this rule. But hey, Lets draft a QB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 To the people that are warming up to the Sanchez idea or are already driving the bandwagon, I ask you one question? Why the rush? Campbell has been mediocre and I agree but he is in his contract year, just one more year to try to duplicate that 6-2 start and keep it going. If that doesn't happen you just move on and look for next year's top QB prospect. In my eyes, there are better prospects coming out next year anyways. This way you can focus on filling other needs (OL/DL/LB) this year and just try to support JC one last time. That seems to be the more sensible and less risky route. Just cut and paste this into every Sanchez thread, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd421 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 THIS WEEK IS AWESOME! :thud: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB Dizzle Posted April 21, 2009 Author Share Posted April 21, 2009 To the people that are warming up to the Sanchez idea or are already driving the bandwagon, I ask you one question? Why the rush? Campbell has been mediocre and I agree but he is in his contract year, just one more year to try to duplicate that 6-2 start and keep it going. If that doesn't happen you just move on and look for next year's top QB prospect. In my eyes, there are better prospects coming out next year anyways. This way you can focus on filling other needs (OL/DL/LB) this year and just try to support JC one last time. That seems to be the more sensible and less risky route. I guess the "rush" in my opinion is because you and I disagree on a few things. #1 - I don't have as much confidence in next years prospects. I think Bradford is a stiff, Colt has potential but seems small, and they both play terrible defenses all the time. I don't think Tebow will work out either in the NFL. Some people say that next years class will be better, but alot of the draft analysts keep saying that if Sanchez stayed then he would possibly be #1 overall next year. I agree with that because I don't have faith in the other prospects. Also, while unlikely....I don't think it is a guarantee that if we draft Sanchez, that Campbell won't still be starting here next year. If it truly is for competition or to push Campbell (like Brees a few years back) then maybe he will stay and perform well. Then we decide who to trade/resign in the future. I think the worst case scenario is if we stay as is and Campbell sucks this year and then we need to start over looking for a QB, possibly with a mid-first roudn pick that won't even land the top QB prospects and all of our stars get a little older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB Dizzle Posted April 21, 2009 Author Share Posted April 21, 2009 Just cut and paste this into every Sanchez thread, please. I don't think this is a Sanchez thread. This is a thread on why any QB should be considered. People react too quickly to say "draft Oline" and "We don't need Sanchez". I think this tread can at least discuss the reasoning by your decision, and at least provides an argument against the "we don't need a QB" group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skull1669 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 One thing you forget to point out is all those QBs on that list were given at least 3 years in a stable offensive/organization. But hey what do the Washington Redskins know about "stable". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewCliche21 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 I don't think this is a Sanchez thread. This is a thread on why any QB should be considered. People react too quickly to say "draft Oline" and "We don't need Sanchez". I think this tread can at least discuss the reasoning by your decision, and at least provides an argument against the "we don't need a QB" group. I'm not saying that this is a Sanchez thread. I'm saying that the poster's argument should be applied to every Sanchez thread because those threads are inherently related to picking up a quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhouse Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 I guess the "rush" in my opinion is because you and I disagree on a few things. #1 - I don't have as much confidence in next years prospects. I think Bradford is a stiff, Colt has potential but seems small, and they both play terrible defenses all the time. I don't think Tebow will work out either in the NFL. Some people say that next years class will be better, but alot of the draft analysts keep saying that if Sanchez stayed then he would possibly be #1 overall next year. I agree with that because I don't have faith in the other prospects.Also, while unlikely....I don't think it is a guarantee that if we draft Sanchez, that Campbell won't still be starting here next year. If it truly is for competition or to push Campbell (like Brees a few years back) then maybe he will stay and perform well. Then we decide who to trade/resign in the future. I think the worst case scenario is if we stay as is and Campbell sucks this year and then we need to start over looking for a QB, possibly with a mid-first roudn pick that won't even land the top QB prospects and all of our stars get a little older. I guess that's always arguable, we can't say for sure prospect X will turn out to be the best QB. My point is really driven by the fact that we have so few draft picks and the idea of picking a QB at #13 (let alone trading up :doh:) is not something we can afford. Plus like you said Sanchez will probably hold a clipboard at the start of the season. Is this something we have a luxury of doing? We're not an elite team where we can groom first round QB's....we need them to make an impact right away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 To the people that are warming up to the Sanchez idea or are already driving the bandwagon, I ask you one question? Why the rush? Campbell has been mediocre and I agree but he is in his contract year, just one more year to try to duplicate that 6-2 start and keep it going. If that doesn't happen you just move on and look for next year's top QB prospect. In my eyes, there are better prospects coming out next year anyways. This way you can focus on filling other needs (OL/DL/LB) this year and just try to support JC one last time. That seems to be the more sensible and less risky route. I agree. For a couple years, I was a blind Campbell-supporter but have come around and realized that he just might not become a franchise QB here. I'm certainly willing to give him his last year to figure that out. At worst, we'll improve the team in other areas (OL, DL, LB, etc.) and give the next QB that comes in a better starting point. At best, he improves and becomes a QB that is good enough to take a team to the next level (especially with the improvements we make). Good post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB Dizzle Posted April 21, 2009 Author Share Posted April 21, 2009 I guess that's always arguable, we can't say for sure prospect X will turn out to be the best QB.My point is really driven by the fact that we have so few draft picks and the idea of picking a QB at #13 (let alone trading up :doh:) is not something we can afford. Plus like you said Sanchez will probably hold a clipboard at the start of the season. Is this something we have a luxury of doing? We're not an elite team where we can groom first round QB's....we need them to make an impact right away. I agree that our lack of draft picks make picking (or even worse, trading up for) a QB undesirable. I also agree that it would be frustrating to watch this QB hold a clipboard all season. The reason I think it might happen and is possibly the correct decision is because I think this is the most important position to fill. I think the list above supports that. And finally I think that if Zorn, Scott Campbell, and unfortunately for us, Vinny and Dan think that Sanchez has the potential to make that list, then I can see where they are coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HA1LV1CT0RY Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 We need another QB like I need another assh0le. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derekc4 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Brian Hoyer 5th round. Get it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhouse Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 I agree that our lack of draft picks make picking (or even worse, trading up for) a QB undesirable. I also agree that it would be frustrating to watch this QB hold a clipboard all season. The reason I think it might happen and is possibly the correct decision is because I think this is the most important position to fill. I think the list above supports that. And finally I think that if Zorn, Scott Campbell, and unfortunately for us, Vinny and Dan think that Sanchez has the potential to make that list, then I can see where they are coming from. I don't trust Vinny and Dan. It's their knee-jerk moves that keeps this team from having consistency. They see something bright and shiny and it's like a moth to a flame. If we draft a QB, Zorn will definitely have his say (Sanchez or Stafford) and that will be "his guy". Guess what, when Dan and Vinny decide to hire the next big name coach, Zorn's guy will be in the same situation JC is in now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDOZ84 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Look, I don't want to trade multiple picks to move up and draft ANYONE, BUT sometimes it is necessary if you are trying to get your franchise QB. If it doesn't work out then you are screwed. If it does then you truly have a chance to build a dynasty.Below is the list of every superbowl winning QB... 1 Bart Starr 2 Bart Starr 3 Joe Namath 4. Len Dawson 5. John Unitas 6. Roger Staubach 7. Bob Griese 8. Bob Griese 9. Terry Bradshaw 10. Terry Bradshaw 11. Ken Stabler 12. Roger Staubach 13. Terry Bradshaw 14. Terry Bradshaw 15. Jim Plunkett 16. Joe Montana 17. Joe Theismann 18. Jim Plunkett 19. Joe Montana 20. Jim McMahon 21. Phil Simms 22. Doug Williams 23. Joe Montana 24. Joe Montana 25. Jeff Hostetler 26. Mark Rypien 27. Troy Aikman 28. Troy Aikman 29. Steve Young 30. Troy Aikman 31. Brett Favre 32. John Elway 33. John Elway 34. Kurt Warner 35. Trent Dilfer 36. Tom Brady 37. Brad Johnson 38. Tom Brady 39. Tom Brady 40. Ben Roethlisberger 41. Peyton Manning 42. Eli Manning 43. Ben Roethlisberger The great majority of these QBs are thought of as the best ever, Hall of Famers. I know that there are some that seem out of place like Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer (the most recent two), but I think this list really shows that having a GREAT QB is one of the main ingrediants to winning a superbowl and is pretty much a must if you hope to win multiple superbowls. The only reason I wouldn't go insane (or want to hurt Snyder as my friends say) if we trade up and draft Sanchez, is because he is at least a HOPE to become one of the guys on this list. In my opinion, and I think in even most of the Campbell supports' opinions, Campbell's absolute best case scenario is to be one of the odd balls on this list that snuck on because their D was great and everything just fell into place. We have won three superbowls and some would argue that all three of our QBs on this list are the "odd balls" that are lucky to be there. Wouldn't you like to possibly have that QB that is expected to be there, and hopefully multiple times. I think that is why you need to at least consider drafting a QB. Good point but, you can not forget that all of the names on this list had a great supporting cast and won not just because they were the franchise quarterback. Their overall team is what allowed them to win superbowls, we will never be in that discussion because our team is never strong enough to win anything. All of the qb's on that list had at least a great defense and a great offensive line together. The qbs/organizations who won multiple superbowls had great recievers and a great running game to compliment their great o-line and great defense. (with the exception of the Patriots, who won all of superbowl on last minute field goals) The bottom line is the Bengals and Dolphins have or had a franchise qb in Carson Palmer and Dan Marino yet they haven't or never won anything, why, because their overall team top to bottom sucks. Our team sucks too! Yeah we have some great players here and there but overall we suck. We can't win our division. We aren't even in the discussion to win our divison. We can trade away our future to get a great qb, throw him out there with the OLD unathletic o-line protecting him, give him only a No. 2 wide receiver (89) and Chris Cooley to throw to and we will still be complaining about another losing season because our FO doesnt know how to build a franchise. They always try to patch things up or just leave a giant whole left unfilled. They need to be reevaluating the o-line and d-line the way they are evaluating our QB position and commit to rebuilding both of the lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregpeck99 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 If Theismann, Williams and Rypien could do it ... so can Campbell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregpeck99 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Brian Hoyer 5th round. Get it done. Good suggestion derek ... but afraid Hoyer won't last that long ... the lousy record and performance MS had last year masked how good he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAFGA Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 I don't think this is a Sanchez thread. Yes it is. It doesn't deserve it's own thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 As it stands, your absolutely right, but also understand that most on that list weren't putting up HOF numbers in their first 3 seasons. Bradshaw, for example, didn't have a QB rating higher than 65 until his 6th year. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Bradshaw correct, plus look at the supporting cast around them, just about all had at least 1 or more great receivers/TE, solid run game, and a pretty good OL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gymratfwp Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 #1 - I don't have as much confidence in next years prospects. I think Bradford is a stiff, Colt has potential but seems small, and they both play terrible defenses all the time. I don't think Tebow will work out either in the NFL. Some people say that next years class will be better, but alot of the draft analysts keep saying that if Sanchez stayed then he would possibly be #1 overall next year. I agree with that because I don't have faith in the other prospects. And the defenses Sanchez faced were any better?? The best defense USC faced was at practice. Outside of USC, the PAC-10 absolutely blows. Tebow is using this year to develop his skills so I am on the fence and willing to wait until the end of the season next year to make any statements concerning his NFL prospects. Bradford I agree with because he can't read defenses...which is critical at the next level. Colt McCoy is, in my opinion, the best of the bunch right now. Since when is 6'3" undersized? The guy is blazing fast (4.5 40), and accurate as hell (76.7% last season). He was robbed of the chance to play in the National Championship and should have won the Heisman last year. This si the guy we should be targeting if JC doesn't work out... I have posted this before but Sanchez's (and arguably Stafford's) reasoning for declaring for the draft this year is purely economical. Next years QB is class is stacked...whatever you think of Bradford, Tebow and McCoy...they would hands down be rated above Sanchez and Stafford. Both of them want their pay day and at least a chance to start in the NFL. If they waited until next year, that would be a little less likely. Next year, not this year, is the time to be targeting Quarterbacks. This is the year to solidify our O-line, allow JC another year (as much as that disgusts some people) to develop into the possible franchise QB that we all desire. This is the year to strength our Defense and get some play-makers to capitalize on the pressure that Big Al is going to bring on whoever lines up against us. This is the year to allow our receivers (Kelly and Thomas) to develop into the play-makers we need. This is the year to allow Zorn to refine his schemes. I understand the desire to find the franchise QB, but lets be smart about this...not rash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No l Gravity l Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 correct, plus look at the supporting cast around them, just about all had at least 1 or more great receivers/TE, solid run game, and a pretty good OL Santana Moss+Devin Thomas+Malcolm Kelly/Chris Cooley, Portis, and #4 defense to support your offense... Obviously Jason Campbell doesn't have anything going for him. No wonder the Skins can't score touchdowns! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCMONEY Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 The Skins need to shore up the O-line. Rypien was a perfect example of a QB the benefited from protection and talent around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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