Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Several days ago, Rep. Spencer Bachus (R-Ala.) stated, "Some of the men and women I work with in Congress are socialists," putting the number at 17 (without naming names). His words echoes the statement of Joe "Tail gunner" McCarthy, when he said, "The State Department is infested with communists. I have here in my hand a list of 205 (or 57 - depends on the historical source)—a list of names that were made known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping policy in the State Department." Even during the presidential campaign, people were echoing McCarthy's sentiments, claiming Obama is a "communist" and "working and shaping policy" to the detriment of the USA, in addition to accusing Democrats of being "traitors." Is this our future? With all of the rabid reaction to the Obama administration and its policies, will history repeat itself in America? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I doubt it. According to the GOP, Rush Limbaugh, and most everybody else on that fringe, every single Democrat in government is a socialist. And a terrorist supporter. And a Communist. Who wants to shove the homosexual agenda down your throat. In fact, according to the GOP, the last three D presidential nominees have all been "the most liberal member of Congress." (Curiously, every one of them earned this title just days after the GOP figured out who the nominee was going to be.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Judges Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Hey Baculus, I was wondering where you have been. Glad you're not gone. I think the McCarthy element never completely left American politics. In a poll a few years ago, I forget what the number was but something like 15-20% of the population thought McCarthy was a good man who didn't get a fair shake. I wouldn't be surprised if one of our ES Republicans comes in this thread and makes that claim. Anyway, I do think it is McCarthy-like when folks throw around these terms without the slightest clue as to what they mean or how they will affect the public. But it's not likely to receive the level of support and power it did in the late 40s and early 50s. McCarthy was truely out to ruin people, and he had the power to do it. These recent congresspeople would probably be more than happy to ride the wave of misguided rage to politica prominence, but none of them are quite able to harness it the way McCarthy did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACW Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I hate socialism. I strongly disagree with Obama's economic policies. I think McCarthy was a scumbag and Bachus is an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Oh, I'm not certain I'd go that far, either. Remember the last eight years? How long would you say it took, on average, between when somebody came out with some piece of information that the White House didn't want people to know, and when that person got smeared? How long did it take, to discover that the reporter's sister's husband wrote a term paper in college that said that communism wasn't entirely evil, or something equally relevant? Look at the election campaign. A volunteer for the Obama campaign volunteers to become the campaign's Muslim outreach coordinator (a position which did not exist). One day later, he's resigning because it's revealed that this person once worked for a law firm, and a different employee of that same law firm was once on the board of directors of a charity, and another member of that board was (something evil, I forget what). (I'm often reminded of Monday Night Football, where they'd reveal that Eric Dickerson averages 6.9 yds/carry on MNF, on turf, outdoors, against AFC opponents, in September, and that he leads the NFL in this stat.) I also remember in the early days of the Bush admin, reports of people being denied permission to enter Bush speaking engagements for which they had tickets, by people who wouldn't identify themselves. One story I remember involved a High School student who's bus was diverted away from the facility, and the student put off the bus, supposedly because he once wrote a letter to the school newspaper critical of the administration. I'm convinced that both political parties have created their own databases keeping track of the political loyalty index of every citizen of the country. I don't have a problem with, say, the DNC keeping track of who gave them money. But keeping track of who's written a letter, to a High School newspaper, that your Party doesn't like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I hate socialism.I strongly disagree with Obama's economic policies. I think McCarthy was a scumbag and Bachus is an idiot. I like Honey Nut Cheerios. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I never heard a good word about McCarthy till I visited right wing forums. Nutters love them some McCarthy. Right now I welcome anyone who makes those McCarthy esque claims. Lets us spot the crazies in Congress. I mean who really knew who Michelle Bachmann was before she wanted to investigate members of Congress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I never heard a good word about McCarthy till I visited right wing forums. Nutters love them some McCarthy. Right now I welcome anyone who makes those McCarthy esque claims. Lets us spot the crazies in Congress. I mean who really knew who Michelle Bachmann was before she wanted to investigate members of Congress. I dunno. The track record for Congressmen who say lunatic things on the floor of Congress getting kicked out of Congress for saying lunatic things isn't all that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 I doubt it. According to the GOP, Rush Limbaugh, and most everybody else on that fringe, every single Democrat in government is a socialist. And a terrorist supporter. And a Communist. Who wants to shove the homosexual agenda down your throat. In fact, according to the GOP, the last three D presidential nominees have all been "the most liberal member of Congress." (Curiously, every one of them earned this title just days after the GOP figured out who the nominee was going to be.) I guess if everyone is the "red threat," it is pointless to have committee meetings to root out the traitors when you just need a clean sweep, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Hey Baculus, I was wondering where you have been. Glad you're not gone. I think the McCarthy element never completely left American politics. In a poll a few years ago, I forget what the number was but something like 15-20% of the population thought McCarthy was a good man who didn't get a fair shake. I wouldn't be surprised if one of our ES Republicans comes in this thread and makes that claim. Anyway, I do think it is McCarthy-like when folks throw around these terms without the slightest clue as to what they mean or how they will affect the public. But it's not likely to receive the level of support and power it did in the late 40s and early 50s. McCarthy was truely out to ruin people, and he had the power to do it. These recent congresspeople would probably be more than happy to ride the wave of misguided rage to politica prominence, but none of them are quite able to harness it the way McCarthy did. Heya Midnight - yeah, I have been busy with RL and mostly lurking occasionally here and there. You're probably right, and your words mirror my own: It would probably take a rise of populism sentiment for such conditions to arise again. But, after this last campaign cycle, I was wondering if the sentiment really was possible, and perhaps right around the corner. Folks such as Ann Coulter do believe that McCarthy was a hero, which probably explains her sentiments. If anything, a neo-McCarthyism would probably be more subtle without the TV trials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 I hate socialism.I strongly disagree with Obama's economic policies. I think McCarthy was a scumbag and Bachus is an idiot. I can understand any disagreement with Obama's policies, but please espouse further on "socialism." Are you an anarcho-capitalist? And why are you bring up Bachus? What does Dionysus have to do with McCarthyism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 being against socialistic policy is not the same as a red-scare and witch-hunt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeaconBlue Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 The scary part is these guys have it BACKWARDS. What kind of crazy world has the folks in the controling party acting like theyre being persecuted? Take this weak crap out of here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 being against socialistic policy is not the same as a red-scare and witch-hunt. I never said that. But, these days, socialism is used in place of communism (which is quickly merging with accusations of "fascism" and "anti-Americanism), which, in turn, is used to describe Democrats or anyone to the left-of-center, or anyone perceived as pseudo-liberal. These are all push button terms in this day and age. As I said before, populism sentiment has a way of snow beyond just "being against" something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I never said that. But, these days, socialism is used in place of communism (which is quickly merging with accusations of "fascism" and "anti-Americanism), which, in turn, is used to describe Democrats or anyone to the left-of-center, or anyone perceived as pseudo-liberal.These are all push button terms in this day and age. As I said before, populism sentiment has a way of snow beyond just "being against" something. the redscare was a product of the cold war. Right now, we don't have any big-time socialist enemies to "infiltrate" us. Communists were the enemy back in the day of the redscare/McCarthy. Not quite the same circumstance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 the redscare was a product of the cold war. Right now, we don't have any big-time socialist enemies to "infiltrate" us. Communists were the enemy back in the day of the redscare/McCarthy. Not quite the same circumstance. Perhaps the red scare would be long term sleeper agents of the old radical communist movements in the 60s... infiltrators positioned over the years by their entrenched cronies to be in positions of political power... Nothing is impossible. A good propagandist can invent any enemy. History has proven time and again that people are gullible as hell. I believe it was Hitler who said that if you told the same lie long enough people will inevitably believe it, and the bigger the lie, the easier it was to do. It worked for him rather well. there's plenty of people in this country ready to believe all sorts of whoppers who are way too eager and willing to fight. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I rarely listen to anything that is uttered from the mouth of a member of the House of Representatives. Half of those people are functionally brain dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 the redscare was a product of the cold war. Right now, we don't have any big-time socialist enemies to "infiltrate" us. Communists were the enemy back in the day of the redscare/McCarthy. Not quite the same circumstance. Obviously you have a different position then some of the "red scare" folks, but there's a certain crowd that believes we were infiltrated at that time, during the 50's (and earlier), and what we see in the Obama and Democratic policies are a result of that infiltration. In short, the Reds really won, and they are all around us. Obama is supposedly the ultimate end result of this communist organizational infiltration - the Manchurian Candidate that will destroy the USA. BTW, this isn't just some fringe idea - go to many right-leaning websites and communist/Obama is used quite a bit. At the tea parties I saw this sentiment readily open for display. Of course, these folks cannot tell the difference between social democracy, communism, and all the nuances of leftist politics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Perhaps the red scare would be long term sleeper agents of the old radical communist movements in the 60s... infiltrators positioned over the years by their entrenched cronies to be in positions of political power...Nothing is impossible. A good propagandist can invent any enemy. History has proven time and again that people are gullible as hell. I believe it was Hitler who said that if you told the same lie long enough people will inevitably believe it, and the bigger the lie, the easier it was to do. It worked for him rather well. there's plenty of people in this country ready to believe all sorts of whoppers who are way too eager and willing to fight. ~Bang You mirrored my exact thoughts, Bang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Good to see the prince of the undead back among us, I am noting of course, that Baculus chose to appear at night... ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 interesting takes. I suppose I shouldn't underestimate the ability of people to create and follow a conspiracy theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Good to see the prince of the undead back among us, I am noting of course, that Baculus chose to appear at night...~Bang Mwahaha - only the Shadow knows! Oh, BTW, Bang, since I know you are an AD&D fan (I loved your D&D story from that Gary Gygax thread), have you ever seen The Gamers and The Gamers: Dorkness rising? They are two really fun movies of guys playing the game and all sorts of funny, goofy adventures. It sounds dorky, but they are really fun little films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 interesting takes. I suppose I shouldn't underestimate the ability of people to create and follow a conspiracy theory. Oh, trust me, I know from first hand experience. Once you go down that rabbit hole it can be hard to come back out of there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Nope, haven't seen them, I'll have to check them out. I do like that cornball crap. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baculus Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Nope, haven't seen them, I'll have to check them out. I do like that cornball crap.~Bang You can torrent them, and I think you will definitely enjoy them. (I am one of the people seeding them right now.) They are all sorts of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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