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Anyone See Any Good News Out There At The Moment?

bulldog

By bulldog
in The Stadium

If you had to do it all over again?  

92 members have voted

  1. 1. If you had to do it all over again?

    • Abstinence only! My spouse is the only one I should have slept with.
      14
    • More partners! I left a lot on the table.
      44
    • Less partners! There are a few I should have avoided.
      13
    • Same thing. I wouldn't change a thing.
      33
    • Cake. Fatties don't worry about sex nearly as much.
      3

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SiestaBob

SiestaBob

Posted
Posted

Finally, someone that makes some sense. Some of our fans are acting like the draft and free agency are over and we did nothing to improve the team. Let's at least see what they do over the next two months before some people bury them. Let's hope Zorn has a more active roll in the player selection than he did last year when he was a rookie head coach and was trying to get caught up because of his late hiring. Give him a chance.

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turbodiesel#44

turbodiesel#44

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What do you base this on? Zorn's job was in question until week 15, now he is a quasi GM? I call BS. Vinny and Dan will make all of the calls and Zorn will continue his role as a yes man.
I can only hope. I don't see Zorn as a yes man. Not yet anyway. The paint on his name on his office door wasn't even dry for last years draft. Nobody can envision the personnel better for the system in his head better than he. If push comes to shove, I hope Vinny will acquiesce. And I can only hope Danny will intervene if necessary and back Zorn. So I'm basing this on hope and hope alone.
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SoCalSkins

SoCalSkins

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I can only hope. I don't see Zorn as a yes man. Not yet anyway. The paint on his name on his office door wasn't even dry for last years draft. Nobody can envision the personnel better for the system in his head better than he. If push comes to shove, I hope Vinny will acquiesce. And I can only hope Danny will intervene if necessary and back Zorn. So I'm basing this on hope and hope alone.

How does knowing the type of personnel you envision for a scheme translate into an ability to evaluate college talent to fit those requirements? There is nothing to suggest that Zorn has any ability to evaluate anything football related with any level of competence that would be expected of an NFL head coach.

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turbodiesel#44

turbodiesel#44

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How does knowing the type of personnel you envision for a scheme translate into an ability to evaluate college talent to fit those requirements? There is nothing to suggest that Zorn has any ability to evaluate anything football related with any level of competence that would be expected of an NFL head coach.
And what evidence do you have that Vinny is any better? It's pretty obvious Zorn knows the type of skill sets needed for his system more than anyone else here. I don't know what involvement he had with Seattle's draft, but he can't be any worse than Vinny.
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SoCalSkins

SoCalSkins

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And what evidence do you have that Vinny is any better? It's pretty obvious Zorn knows the type of skill sets needed for his system more than anyone else here. I don't know what involvement he had with Seattle's draft, but he can't be any worse than Vinny.

If Zorn had a system, then you might think that he would know the type of personnel that would work with it. However, he doesn't have a system. His running game, which is the only part of the offense that functioned, is controlled by Bugel and a left over from the previous regime. He has zero input on defense and special teams.

The passing scheme he used, which is really Holmgren's version of the WCO, did not make any adjustments as the year went on, despite declining production. He may not have made adjustments because he does not know how to change a scheme that is not his own.

Vinny has been involved with scouting departments for years including his time at Notre Dame and the 49ers. He may not be the best evaluator of talent, but he has made some decent picks. Zorn has done nothing in the talent evaluation department. He was a position coach on a team that he was a former star. It was pretty much a sympathy position as evidenced by the Seahawks unwillingness to give him a pay increase to stay on board when Zorn was using the skins as a bargaining chip.

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turbodiesel#44

turbodiesel#44

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If Zorn had a system, then you might think that he would know the type of personnel that would work with it. However, he doesn't have a system. His running game, which is the only part of the offense that functioned, is controlled by Bugel and a left over from the previous regime. He has zero input on defense and special teams.

The passing scheme he used, which is really Holmgren's version of the WCO, did not make any adjustments as the year went on, despite declining production. He may not have made adjustments because he does not know how to change a scheme that is not his own.

Vinny has been involved with scouting departments for years including his time at Notre Dame and the 49ers. He may not be the best evaluator of talent, but he has made some decent picks. Zorn has done nothing in the talent evaluation department. He was a position coach on a team that he was a former star. It was pretty much a sympathy position as evidenced by the Seahawks unwillingness to give him a pay increase to stay on board when Zorn was using the skins as a bargaining chip.

Let me tell you something. He didn't run a true scheme because he didn't have players capable of running it. Joe Gibbs couldn't even get those players to run in his scheme, and they were selected specifically for it, each and every one, by a HOF coach. Zorn inherited an aging, failed mess that never generated a respectable passing game the entire 2nd tenure of JG. And what exactly did you expect Zorn to do with it? Let me tell you something else. You need a passing game to pull off a WCO. And you can't have a passing game without receivers or passblocking. Plain and simple. I think Zorn knows what he needs. Whether he can get it or not is another story.

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SoCalSkins

SoCalSkins

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Posted
Let me tell you something. He didn't run a true scheme because he didn't have players capable of running it. Joe Gibbs couldn't even get those players to run in his scheme, and they were selected specifically for it, each and every one, by a HOF coach. Zorn inherited an aging, failed mess that never generated a respectable passing game the entire 2nd tenure of JG. And what exactly did you expect Zorn to do with it? Let me tell you something else. You need a passing game to pull off a WCO. And you can't have a passing game without receivers or passblocking. Plain and simple. I think Zorn knows what he needs. Whether he can get it or not is another story.

Our passing game looked pretty fantastic the 4 games prior to Zorn taking over. That "failed mess" made the playoffs 2 out of the 3 years prior to Zorn being handed the job when no one else woudl take it. Your post is full of contradictions. You claim that Gibbs was not capable of picking players for his own scheme even though he was a hof coach, yet Zorn will automatically be better at picking his own players despite having no experience whatsoever in talent evaluation in the past.

You can't have a passing game if you don't have an NFL caliber QB. That is even more the case in Holmgrem's version that Zorn tries to run by placing the line protection on the QB and giving the QB greater audible flexibility.

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turbodiesel#44

turbodiesel#44

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Our passing game looked pretty fantastic the 4 games prior to Zorn taking over. That "failed mess" made the playoffs 2 out of the 3 years prior to Zorn being handed the job when no one else woudl take it. Your post is full of contradictions. You claim that Gibbs was not capable of picking players for his own scheme even though he was a hof coach, yet Zorn will automatically be better at picking his own players despite having no experience whatsoever in talent evaluation in the past.

You can't have a passing game if you don't have an NFL caliber QB. That is even more the case in Holmgrem's version that Zorn tries to run by placing the line protection on the QB and giving the QB greater audible flexibility.

Of course he wasn't capable. Why do you think he quit early? He could never put together a passing game to compliment the rest of the team. He built the lines early for his 5 year plan and did NOTHING else there for any future consideration. No youth in the wings. Draft picks squandered on FA's. He never found the receivers he needed to balance the rushing game. You may think Vinny knows Zorns plan better than Zorn, but I think Vinny doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground. He drafts punters and receivers with bad knees when he should know about our lines.

And you think no one would take the job because Chin turned it down? NEWSFLASH - He's STILL not coaching. GW, Mooch and Fossil were jilted.

Audibles don't mean crap when you have to keep your RB and TE in to block and you don't have time to set in the pocket. Half the time there was no pocket and the rest of the time our 2 WR's couldn't get open short or long. Kind of tough to run a WCO that way.

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alwaysaskin

alwaysaskin

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The problem is that many of us have become cynical, we see massive contracts handed out in free Agency, boneheaded trades and failure to develop our own star players. We've seen the franchise ignore the lines year in and year out. Even finding a decent Kicker has been a challenge. We see the team with four draft picks this year and we are watching as FA linemen are going elsewhere while we worry about retaining Hall.

I hate being cynical; however Vinny has proven that he has no idea how to run a football team. I think the good news is this, Samuels and Thomas should be healthy next year. Maybe a healthy Jason taylor will be a difference maker at DE and maybe we can get nine wins. Plus we have all our picks in 2010, until Vinny gets distracted by something shiny

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illone

illone

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You're becoming quite the cynic, bulldog.

The reality is the Skins are stuck in a cycle of insanity where they keep making the same mistakes over and over, expecting different results.

Wake me up when the Skins draft eight to nine new players five years in a row.

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Thinking Skins

Thinking Skins

Posted
Posted
Jim Mora Jr, Spagnolo and Ron Meeks all withdrew from the coaching search process in addition to Cowher not wanting the job.

Actially, Meeks never withdrew, Jim Mora Jr. withdrew after he was given the job in Seattle. Spags withdrew after getting an extension in NY. And Meeks was in it til the end.

In addition though, Williams wanted the job.

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fansince62

fansince62

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Actially, Meeks never withdrew, Jim Mora Jr. withdrew after he was given the job in Seattle. Spags withdrew after getting an extension in NY. And Meeks was in it til the end.

In addition though, Williams wanted the job.

yup..they were all fighting tooth and nail to be the HC of the Washington Redskins!

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SoCalSkins

SoCalSkins

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Actially, Meeks never withdrew, Jim Mora Jr. withdrew after he was given the job in Seattle. Spags withdrew after getting an extension in NY. And Meeks was in it til the end.

In addition though, Williams wanted the job.

Translation, they all used the Skins as a bargaining chip and had no intention of taking the Skins job, just like Zorn tried to do with Seattle but it backfired on him. They endured the sleep-over at Dan's house and got fat pay increases and promotion guarantees from their teams. Which worked out great for Mora because after the season the Seahawks had, there is no guarantee that Paul Allen would have hired him with Chucky and Shanahan available.

You're correct that Meeks didn't withdraw. Indy's Caldwell withdrew from consideration after the Skins received permission to interview him.

Obviously Williams wanted the job and the fact that he did not get it is probably the primary reason no legitimate candidate was willing to take the job.

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fjblair

fjblair

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You're becoming quite the cynic, bulldog.

The reality is the Skins are stuck in a cycle of insanity where they keep making the same mistakes over and over, expecting different results.

Wake me up when the Skins draft eight to nine new players five years in a row.

Wake me up when we have new ownership.

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