Obama Starts Reversing Bush Policies

[Midnight Judges]

What was unemployment in 1940?

You throw out a very nice stat there. But its also completely skewed thanks to guys like Hitler

Here is a quote from FDR's treasury secretary in 1939

I don't know who your source is for that quote. If that is what Morgenthau said, he was dead wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United_States

Contrary to the quote, unemployment in 1940 was more than 10% lower than when FDR took office.

And I'm sure you assume Dubya's largely rosy unemployment rates were due to Saddam/Al Qaida.

[Johnny Punani]

What was unemployment in 1940?

You throw out a very nice stat there. But its also completely skewed thanks to guys like Hitler

Here is a quote from FDR's treasury secretary in 1939

Thanks for correcting Obermann Jr....

[SkinsHokieFan]

I don't know who your source is for that quote. If that is what Morgenthau said, he was dead wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_United_States

Contrary to the quote, unemployment in 1940 was more than 10% lower than when FDR took office.

And I'm sure you assume Dubya's largely rosy unemployment rates were due to Saddam/Al Qaida.

Here is a good chart

Gasp, Heritage Foundation

You'll notice the double dip recession which occurs in 1937, 4 years into the New Deal

And look for the quote in the Congressional Record. That was testimony to the Democrats House Ways and Means Committee in 1939

And lets also be honest, unemployment didn't even reach 7 percent at the start of this decade in the aftermath of the .com bubble popping. It hovered around 5.5-6.5 percent until the housing boom went into overdrive.

[Larry]

Here is a good chart

According to your chart, from '32 to '40, unemployment went from 24% to 15%.

(That's using the "alternative estimates". The census data says it went from 36% to 21%.)

[Midnight Judges]

Here is a good chart

Gasp, Heritage Foundation

You'll notice the double dip recession which occurs in 1937, 4 years into the New Deal

And look for the quote in the Congressional Record. That was testimony to the Democrats House Ways and Means Committee in 1939

Did you really just provide a chart disproving the quote from your previous post?

Let's pretend for a second that the Heritage foundation had an ounce of integrity, what else correlates with the blip in 1937? Definitely not the fact that FDR was expirementing with a conservative balanced budget.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Did you really just provide a chart disproving the quote from your previous post?

Let's pretend for a second that the Heritage foundation had an ounce of integrity, what else correlates with the blip in 1937? Definitely not the fact that FDR was expirementing with a conservative balanced budget.

It is a nice piece of propaganda isn't it to shoot the messenger.

It was around this time that the New Deal 2 was also enacted. Double dip recession, right in the middle of the New Deal. Unemployment back up to 1931 levels

And looking at this chart, 1932 must have been the worst year in the economic history of this country.

The whole point being is to point out your fallacy of unemployment going from 25 percent to 1.2 percent without factoring in WW2. In 1939 we still had unemployment at 14.6 percent , 7 years into the New Deal. For non farmers, it was still above 20 percent

The economy was still awful in 1939. It took the advent of WW2 to pull us out of that awful depression.

One more Heritage Chart (I know, BIASED LOW CHARACTER SOURCE)

If you wish to be truly accurate, you would state that unemployment went from 36 percent to around 1 percent from 1933-1945

It also went from 21 percent in 1939 to 1 percent in 1945

[Larry]

The economy was still awful in 1939.

But nowhere near as bad as the one he inherited.

And your second chart says the same thing. Unemployment was 36% when he took over, 21% in 40. (And the US didn't enter WW2 until '42.)

[Midnight Judges]

It is a nice piece of propaganda isn't it to shoot the messenger.

I was aiming for the propaganda, the messenger was collateral damage lol.

It was around this time that the New Deal 2 was also enacted. Double dip recession, right in the middle of the New Deal. Unemployment back up to 1931 levels

And looking at this chart, 1932 must have been the worst year in the economic history of this country.

The whole point being is to point out your fallacy of unemployment going from 25 percent to 1.2 percent without factoring in WW2. In 1939 we still had unemployment at 14.6 percent , 7 years into the New Deal

The economy was still awful in 1939. It took the advent of WW2 to pull us out of that awful depression

Of course that 14.6% includes 3.39 million emergency workers who actually had jobs and were being paid under the new deal (jobs that did not exist prior to 1933). People in those jobs began to be counted as employed starting in the 1950s. Why they count it that way? I don't know. Doesn't make sense and it's not consistent.

Regardless, your assertion that the war, and not Government spending was the solution makes almost no sense, because it was the enormous Government spending on the war that eventually reduced unemployment. Like it or not each one of those soldiers was a gubmint employee.

[SkinsHokieFan]

But nowhere near as bad as the one he inherited.

And your second chart says the same thing. Unemployment was 36% when he took over, 21% in 40. (And the US didn't enter WW2 until '42.)

21 and 36 are kinda 6 and half a dozen to me

You still have 1 person out of 5 without a job. Down from 1 out of 3

Improvement? Yea. Recovery, no. And again, it ruins the myth that the New Deal helped end the depression when it truly was the war. Making a number such that MJ states 25 percent to 1.2 percent completely irrelevant

[SkinsHokieFan]

Regardless, your assertion that the war, and not Government spending was the solution makes almost no sense, because it was the enormous Government spending on the war that eventually reduced unemployment. Like it or not each one of those soldiers was a gubmint employee.

I agree with that aspect. It further proves the failure of the New Deal and massive public works projects to lead to a true recovery

So if we really want to just end any potential recession we should hire 4 million people to lick envelopes and call it a day, right?

[Midnight Judges]

I agree with that aspect. It further proves the failure of the New Deal and massive public works projects to lead to a true recovery

No it doesn't. Those programs halved unemployment. If anything, WWII shows they weren't large enough. You've made that case quite well.

So if we really want to just end any potential recession we should hire 4 million people to lick envelopes and call it a day, right

I agree with your point here. We might as well get something for our money. MAGLEV anyone?

[Predicto]

SHF, you are not being very persuasive with your charts.

Looks to me like the New Deal did a fantastic job in halting and reversing an enormous unemployment problem, and did so from day one.

Of course, I'm only going by your charts.

[SkinsHokieFan]

No it doesn't. Those programs halved unemployment. If anything, WWII shows they weren't large enough. You've made that case quite well.

I agree with your point here. We might as well get something for our money. MAGLEV anyone?

So essentially we can have full employment by just having everyone work for the government. Makes the job of managing the economy that much easier

[SkinsHokieFan]

SHF, you are not being very persuasive with your charts.

Looks to me like the New Deal did a fantastic job in halting and reversing an enormous unemployment problem, and did so from day one.

Of course, I'm only going by your charts.

And then we had our double dip in 1937, which then reversed at the advent of WW2. And somehow unemployment in 1939 was still at 1931 levels