JMS Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 CNN reported back in 2003 they had an undislosed number of pre teens, 11 and 12 year olds at Guantanamo for almost two years. Those detainees being released shortly before the 2004 presidential election after the media started to make it a campagne issue. Today the US admits they had 8 and now 12 juveniles but still refuses to give their ages, rather claiming nobody knew how old their prisoners were.... or how many they were evidently. Pultzer Prize winner Seymour Hersh wrote back in 2004 that the administration had detained 70-80,000 people at Guantanamo and other secret camps around the world. I'm looking forward to the full accounting of what went on in these camps. How many were detained, how long they were detained, and what eventually happenned to them and why.... Currently the Bush Administration is protesting Obama's decision to try the 200 odd detainees currently housed in Guantanamo, in criminal coart cause they say they don't have any evidence against them so most will be set free. It boggles the mind the system of reasoning these folks use. U.S. admits it held 12 juveniles at Guantanamo The government revises its count, up from eight reported in May to U.N. SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico - The U.S. has revised its count of juveniles ever held at Guantanamo Bay to 12, up from the eight it reported in May to the United Nations, a Pentagon spokesman said Sunday. The government has provided a corrected report to the U.N. committee on child rights, according to Navy Cmdr. Jeffrey Gordon. He said the U.S. did not intentionally misrepresent the number of detainees taken to the isolated Navy base in southeast Cuba before turning 18. "As we noted to the committee, it remains uncertain the exact age of many of the juveniles held at Guantanamo, as most of them did not know their own date of birth or even the year in which they were born," he said. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27754942/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsOrlando Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 I'd say I give a damn, but I don't. Find a 12 year old with an automatic weapon in a terrorist camp and well, seems like a good place to put em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwbiggs Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Yep...a 12 year old can strap on a bomb as easy as a 30 year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shk75 Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 This totally reminds me of that how old is 15 bit. A 15 year old cannot have sex because mentally they do not understand the consequences of their actions, but a 15 year old can be charged as an adult because he knew full well what he was doing....etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMS Posted November 17, 2008 Author Share Posted November 17, 2008 So take Abu Grab for instance. After the naked pyramid photo's and the photos of the soldiers letting the dogs chew on the prisoners privates came out did you know 98% of those prisoners were released because of no evidence. The crimes they were in prison for consisted of being on a street when a bomb went off, being out after dark against curfew, and walking too close to US military positions. The reason the prisons were overcrowded is because some units were throwing people in their for no reason what so ever. In Afghanistan we were offering the equivilence of multiple years of income as bounty for any foreigner in Afghanistan or any Afghani helping Al Quada. No evidence required. Rival clans used us to clean up their enemies. We were also kidnapping "suspcious" people off the streets from around the world. Again no evidence required... It's amaizing anybody can defend this insane counter productive and brutal policy conducted without any independent oversite. It's something you would expect to come from the worst of the banana republics. It will be a blight on America's reputation you children will be discussing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 So take Abu Grab for instance. After the naked pyramid photo's and the photos of the soldiers letting the dogs chew on the prisoners privates came out did you know 98% of those prisoners were released because of no evidence.The crimes they were in prison for consisted of being on a street when a bomb went off, being out after dark against curfew, and walking too close to US military positions. The reason the prisons were overcrowded is because some units were throwing people in their for no reason what so ever. In Afghanistan we were offering the equivilence of multiple years of income as bounty for any foreigner in Afghanistan or any Afghani helping Al Quada. No evidence required. Rival clans used us to clean up their enemies. We were also kidnapping "suspcious" people off the streets from around the world. Again no evidence required... It's amaizing anybody can defend this insane counter productive and brutal policy conducted without any independent oversite. It's something you would expect to come from the worst of the banana republics. It will be a blight on America's reputation you children will be discussing. There you go, siding with the terrorists against the US of A again. Damn libs. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 I'd say I give a damn, but I don't. Find a 12 year old with an automatic weapon in a terrorist camp and well, seems like a good place to put em. Sorry but children can deprogrammed much more easily than adults, and I'm not convinced that Gitmo (a max security military prison) is the most appropriate place for children. After all we don't put 12 year olds in Super Max prisons for adults so why are we doing this for these kids? What's more is that if the Administration didn't already know it was wrong or would be EXTREMELY unpopular then why didn't they make this stuff known? Sorry, just one more reason why the last 8 years will be remembered as some of the darkest in the last 100 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Sorry, just one more reason why the last 8 years will be remembered as some of the darkest in the last 100 years.You can not possibly be serious with that comment.:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 You can not possibly be serious with that comment.:doh: The darkest in the last 100 years here in the US, not global. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sacase Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 Sorry but children can deprogrammed much more easily than adults, and I'm not convinced that Gitmo (a max security military prison) is the most appropriate place for children. After all we don't put 12 year olds in Super Max prisons for adults so why are we doing this for these kids? What's more is that if the Administration didn't already know it was wrong or would be EXTREMELY unpopular then why didn't they make this stuff known?Sorry, just one more reason why the last 8 years will be remembered as some of the darkest in the last 100 years. drama queen much? If they got picked up on the battlefield then they deserved to be in there plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 drama queen much?If they got picked up on the battlefield then they deserved to be in there plain and simple. yeah - IF. But of course, asking the Administration to explain why they were picked up (or even who they are or how many of them there are or anything else) would horribly undermine the War on Terror and you are a traitor for even asking. Don't you remember the talking points of 2004? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted November 17, 2008 Share Posted November 17, 2008 drama queen much?If they got picked up on the battlefield then they deserved to be in there plain and simple. baaaaaaaahahahahaa...he does overreact a little bit. :laugh: these kids got caught doing something terribly wrong and the US felt the need to put them there. they didnt invade houses and snatch up kids who were praying or doing their homework and sentence them to gitmo. but if you can reform them I say give it a try..if not, **** em. let em rot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 If we found em doing bad stuff, its a perfect place to put them. I don't see why anyone would think differently. Unless you hate anything and everything about this past 8 years without thinking twice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 If we found em doing bad stuff, its a perfect place to put them.I don't see why anyone would think differently. It's the IF that I am having trouble with, that I have always had trouble with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 It's the IF that I am having trouble with, that I have always had trouble with. Well apparently some people think that Bush just did stuff like that for kicks. Like Bush told Colonel Jessep to order the code red. Of course it's "if", Predicto. Of course with my "if" I seem to think that there's a good chance they're not in there for just skipping school. Your "if" seems to think that, once again, Bush screwed up...an it ain't even Bush's fault in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Well apparently some people think that Bush just did stuff like that for kicks. Like Bush told Colonel Jessep to order the code red. Of course it's "if", Predicto. Of course with my "if" I seem to think that there's a good chance they're not in there for just skipping school. Your "if" seems to think that, once again, Bush screwed up...an it ain't even Bush's fault in this case. No. My "if" thinks there needs to be oversight because Government must always be kept i check. Your "if" assumes that there is nothing wrong with the Government making people disappear and never answering to anyone for what they do. I have no idea if anyone screwed up, because no one ever had to answer to me, or to anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMS Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 drama queen much?If they got picked up on the battlefield then they deserved to be in there plain and simple. How do you know they were picked up on the battle field? I've heard people talking about 15 year olds... Amnesty international has identified these kids at 11, 12 years of age. About the worst thing I've ever heard a foreign government doing was North Korea kidnapping and holding kids from Japan against their will withiout telling the parrents they were alive or dead. Truely despicable. That was exactly what we did in Iraq. Couldn't tell how old they were but they identified them as under the age of 18 indeed. How about a full disclosure to begin with.. I'll bet you 1000 dollars to 1 dollar that the vast majority of the folks who passed through our detention camps on the scale of 1000 to one were not terrorists and never had any beef with us before we picked them up. I'll also bet after being tortured and abused for months and sometimes years they don't feel that way today... In this country people are innocent until proven guilty as a matter law. By our legal system all these folks were innocent. By our actions of releasing the vast majority of these folks after having abused them, we are admitting they were always innocent even by our non legal standards... It's just a ridiculous stupid Bush policy which better suites a south american dictator rather than an American President. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 I'm always struck, in the threads discussing Gitmo et al, by the fact that there appear to be two sides to the discussion. One side, call it "Side A", is absolutely convinced that every single person there deserves to be there. That every single one was captured on a battlefield, weapon in hand, engaged in active combat. At a minimum. And if anybody disagrees with Side A, then Side A will announce that the other side is making up their mind based on blind partisanship and insufficient evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMS Posted November 18, 2008 Author Share Posted November 18, 2008 I have no idea if anyone screwed up, because no one ever had to answer to me, or to anyone else. Hell man we know they screwed up... Remember the Chaplain which was arrested for taking messages from Gitmo to Syria.. Charged him with treason during war time which carries a death penalty. After they discredited him on the national news and found no evidence of any treason, they offered him a dishonorable discharge and five years in prison... ( he had already served two years waiting for trial )... then they offered him a dishonorable and two years in prison. Then they offered him just a dishonorable with time served; when he refused even this; they dropped the charges and charged him with receiving pornographic spam email on his government laptop.. No fooling... After being convicted of the porno charge his lawyer appealed and the military court of appeals threw out the charge based on the fact the government had abused it's authority. We also know about the Australian who we held for 5 years and called a national security threat. Finally the Austrailians convinced us to turn him over to them for trial; turns out he was in Afghanistan to meet his fiancee's inlaws and had never been outside of Austrialia before. He got grabbed off a bus as a foreign national by a warlord because we were offering a bounty on any foreigner captured in Iraq to the tune of several years wages for an average Afghani.. And we kept the poor shmuck for 5 years!!! Then their was the Canadian and German guys who we kidnapped off the street and then released afte years without any explanation. We don't have much visibility into this program, but what we do know smells to high heaven. These guys just imprisoned anybody who seemed questionable or out of the ordinary. Problem is we live in a round world made up of exceptions and not one which fits nicely in a square hole. Did they catch some real terrorists maybe. Did they catch a vast majority of innocent people.. From what has been published absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMike619 Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 the whole middle east is a battlefield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 SSorry, just one more reason why the last 8 years will be remembered as some of the darkest in the last 100 years. And people wonder why I call liberals 5 watt light bulbs. Until you liberal Bush bashers face a 8 to 13 year old with a 9mm or some of the prettiest shiny sawed off shotguns (and you can actually experience it in SE DC,NE or NW DC any given Day or night) who will car jack you or beat you down(take you out) to be accepted in a Crew aka Gang, STFU. Idiots like liberals will have you believe Bush Administration grabbed the middle east versions of the Huxtables or leave it to beaver types who were on their way to a Mohammed and pop store. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 If you actually think the U.S. soldiers were grabbing children off the street and throwing them in gitmo you OBVIOUSLY don't know our military are children also. They dont have horns and pitchforks. These are the same soldiers that were giving said children their food and digging their ditches and rebuilding their schools and etc. etc. etc. etc. Some of you make me sick. Edit: before anyone says it: Of course there are screwups in a 500,000 person force. It's no difference than placing everyone in D.C. into Iraq and saying if 'anything' bad happens we blame everyone forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 And people wonder why I call liberals 5 watt light bulbs. Because you're better at name calling than at thinking, reasoning, and facts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Save money. Execute on the spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted November 18, 2008 Share Posted November 18, 2008 Because you're better at name calling than at thinking, reasoning, and facts? That would be you since you go on emotion than listening to facts since it would defeat your agenda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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