Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Joe Gibbs couldn't do it this time around. He brought in Al Saunders who couldn't get it done. It has been quite a while since the Skins have had a consistently effective passing game. Forget the old "run the ball, stop the run" chant. The key to winning in today's NFL is the passing game. You need a good passing game on offense, and you need to stop it on defense. Average yards per attempt (YPA) is the best quick and dirty way to measure a team's passing efficiency. Average yards per carry does the same for the running game. Those are the measures I used in gathering some stats on the 2007 season. The top five passing teams in YPA won 65 games last year. The top five rushing teams in YPC won 44. The bottom five rushing teams won 33. The bottom five passing teams won 21. Based on these measures, the major difference between the nine-win Redskins and the 18-win Patriots was the offensive passing game. Our club was better defensively both against the run and the pass. The Pats ran for a better YPC than the Skins (4.1 to 3.8) but their big edge was in YPA (8.3 to 6.9). Quarterback, scheme, play calling, receivers...these four factors combine to determine the efficiency of the passing game. The Skins must raise this aspect of their game to win more often. None of this suggests that the running game can be completely ignored. We're talking about where the emphasis should be if we expect to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fury010 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 11. Please do not use the “Quote” feature to quote huge blocks of text or pictures. If you would like to respond to the contents of a particular post, simply quote the sentence or idea that you're commenting upon, not necessarily the entire post. It wastes space on the database and unnecessarily extends and clutters threads. Good post! Early returns indicate that JC is much more comfortable under Zorn! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 That's one of the other excellent aspects of the WCO. It's timing allows receivers to make the catch and get upfield for good YAC. Great post, Oldfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Very good post. I like all the information provided. Let's hope things continue in this direction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptChaos86 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Very good post. The game has evolved more around the pass now, and i think Zorn is just the guy to bring us up to date. Hopefully all of these rooks work out and we can have a good passing attack for years to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Regardless of what stats you use to prove it, it was obvious when watching the games last year that our passing game was holding us back.... We had WRs that were either too injured or too old to be explosive includiing a certain #85 that turned out to be a bust along with a QB still developing that all played a roll in that. Arguably, play calling had its moments too but the question still remains, is a new system and our QBs development going to be enough if one of the rookie WRs doesnt come through? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 Thanks to all for the kind remarks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2006Skins Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Great post Oldfan. It's great to hear the early reports on Zorn that him and Campbell are working great together. I know it's only the preseason, but Campbell has averaged over 8 yards per attempt in the 2 games he's played. That's definitely an early thumbs up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 That's one of the other excellent aspects of the WCO. It's timing allows receivers to make the catch and get upfield for good YAC. The WCO is more O line friendly too. Our good people up front are getting a little long in the tooth and coming off injuries. It will help that they don't have to hold their blocks as long. The average gain per completion might be down in this scheme, but the completion pct. should go up. Overall, I think it's reasonable to expect the YPA to go up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyConway Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Good read. The NFL is a passing league. With that said, IMHO, it takes a passing game to win games (therefore get in the paloffs). It takes a defense to win a championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 Regardless of what stats you use to prove it, it was obvious when watching the games last year that our passing game was holding us back.... We had WRs that were either too injured or too old to be explosive includiing a certain #85 that turned out to be a bust along with a QB still developing that all played a roll in that. Arguably, play calling had its moments too but the question still remains, is a new system and our QBs development going to be enough if one of the rookie WRs doesnt come through? I think the front office will have to hit on two of those three drafted receivers in order to make a big improvement. Zorn will have some really good options if that happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 Great post Oldfan. It's great to hear the early reports on Zorn that him and Campbell are working great together. I know it's only the preseason, but Campbell has averaged over 8 yards per attempt in the 2 games he's played. That's definitely an early thumbs up. Damn right! Eight is good. That confirms what we've seen so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I think the front office will have to hit on two of those three drafted receivers in order to make a big improvement. Zorn will have some really good options if that happens. I thoroughly agree... Good research btw... But if one of those two doesnt step up then I dont think we have improved enough. One might say that after making it to the playoffs that we dont need to improve that much but the rest of the division has also improved. We need one of the rookies to push ARE to the slot to take a big step in the direction we want to go in the passing game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Nice post However Comma The key to winning is and always will be DEFENSE!!!!! I Don't recall the Giants being a top 5 like passing offense last year. Execution, minimal injuries to our offensive line and players making the plays will be to the Redskins success this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 Nice post However CommaThe key to winning is and always will be DEFENSE!!!!! I Don't recall the Giants being a top 5 like passing offense last year. Execution, minimal injuries to our offensive line and players making the plays will be to the Redskins success this year The Giant won the big one, but I think you'd be in a small minority if you think they were among the best five teams in the NFL last year. We disagree on defense being the key. The odds are that the best overall team will win a football game. Whether they are relatively better on offense or defense doesn't really matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljeasel Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 OF, nice post, nice research. But I respectfully disagree. I always enjoy your posts though. HTTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siven Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Thanks to all for the kind remarks. I'll bring you back down to earth. It sucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 I'll bring you back down to earth.It sucked. I needed that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jweisk1 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 what is the deal with these common sense threads... better passing attack = more wins scoring 20 points or more = more wins Whats next...oh I got it, how about if you score more points than your opponet your going to win the game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 OF, nice post, nice research. But I respectfully disagree. But, don't wanna make your case? I always enjoy your posts though. HTTR Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ouvan59 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Unfortunately it's not that simple. To have a winning team you have to be able to pass and stop the pass but to do those things effectively you have to be able to run and stop the run. You can't do one if you don't do the other well enough to keep your opponent honest. But yes, to improve as a team we must improve our passing game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljeasel Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 But, don't wanna make your case?Thank you. I do, but I am running around right now. I dont want to put down some half baked thoughts. Heres a brief response though. You mention the biggest difference between the 9 win Skins and the 18 win Pats is the passing game. Im paraphrasing of course but I want to make sure Im not twisting your words too much. I think the biggest difference was actually the health of the teams. If we dont lose the right side of the line I think we could have been talking about the 10,11,12 win Redskins. Pure speculation of course, but I think we would have been able to keepthe Giants down at home if Randy doesnt go down (+1). Maybe we win the Dallas game if ST is back their to at least breath on TO rather than Priealou (SP?). The Philly game is another one we could have won with ST (I remember PP watching another poorly thrown ball caught for a TD after ST went down). I could go through the whole season like that but I remembre hearing constantly how healthy the Pats were the whole season. I think that could have alot to do with their sucess and our struggles last year. Speculation yes, but hey, its an idea. Again I think you have a great idea with offensive efficiency being the hallmark of sucess. Im not sure ypc is the proper stat though. Does it correlate with your analysis? Yes. I think its one of the cases of correlation not being the same thing as causation. Good teams execute. Wouldnt good teams have higher averages as a symptom of winning? Or would good teams have higher averages because of their winning? Essentially are you saying Yards per Completion is higher in winning teams So in order to be a winning team you have to get more yards per competion? Its been a long time since ive done stats, but I see ypc as more of a (i cant remember the proper term) secondary correlation. If you are winning you would be playing better. If you are playing better you probably have better numbers kind of deal. But, you dont need high stats to win. If you are talking about efficiency wouldnt you be better off with an entirely new stat (this is what i was thinking about rather than posting). Something like Yards per play in comparison with % of drives that end in points and then somehow also compare that with turnovers wouldnt that be more of a stat that would indicate efficiency? anyways, I think you have alot of really great points here but I dont like the new chant of "This is a passing league" any more than "Run and stop the run". "Get it done" seems to be what the chant should be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADF Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 The key for us winning is being more effective in the red zone. We moved the ball quite a bit between the 20's. Once we got in the red zone we sputtered. The running game couldn't get it done and neither could the passing games. In as many close games as we were in, turning those 3's into 7's would have meant a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselPwr44 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Silly me, I always thought a balanced attack is what won in today's league? :whoknows: We have been anything but balanced the last few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Silly me,I always thought a balanced attack is what won in today's league? :whoknows: We have been anything but balanced the last few years. Not once did he say that a balanced attack didn't win games. He said that if we improve the passing game we'll have a better chance to win games. That's not saying we'd be a full out pass offense. what is the deal with these common sense threads...better passing attack = more wins scoring 20 points or more = more wins Whats next...oh I got it, how about if you score more points than your opponet your going to win the game... :doh: Nice, constructive post. It holds no weight and its really an insult to the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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