Leonard Washington Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 casualties of war "you've got to give me a minute on this one sarge" :1stplace: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat fischer 37 Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I have seen some valid arguments for Platoon, too sappy if you ask me. The beginning of Full Metal Jacket was about as good as a movie can be but it comes up lame in the end, though it remains a great movie. Apocalypse Now used to be my favorite Viet Nam War movie, but it is hard to sit through the entire movie anymore. I think the character development was outstanding! Green Berets was another outstanding movie. The Duke! Some of the more recent ones were ok like We Were Soldiers; I think Greg Kinnear did a great job in that movie. But without a doubt the most compelling and my favorite Viet Nam War movie is Deerhunter. The scenes at home tend to go on, the wedding is probably a little longer than it should be, but there is no better scene in any movie ever, than the russian roulette scene that leads to their escape from that hell hole. Classic! Classic! Classic! Then after saving himself and his friends from certain peril in an improbable way, he carries one out on his back. Heroics don't get any more dramatic than that! Deerhunter, hands down!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 An excellent read- "The 13th Valley" terrific book about Vietnam. Also, a PBS series you could probably pick up on DVD thru your library "the 10,000 day war" is very good. Tons of news footage. real harrowing stuff. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Full Metal Jacket hands down... I can admit I've never seen Apocalypse Now or Platoon all the way through. Full Metal Jacket is full of many, many memorable quotes and the dialogue is awesome. "Holy dog ****. Texas? Only steers and queers come from Texas, Private Cowboy. And you don't look much like a steer to me so that kinda narrows it down. Do you suck dicks?" Reminds me of Cowboys fans every time is hear it. We Were Soldiers was also a good movie. Much more damatic, but told a good narative of soldiers from opposing sides of the war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 The first half of Full Metal Jacket is the best 'Nam War movie. The rest of the movie I could do without.The best, most complete 'Nam movie is Apocalypse Now Redeux without a question and by a landslide over the full FMJ and Platoon, et. al. by a great distance. Ehhh, didn't like the Redeux. That extra stuff got cut out for good reason, IMO. IMO, it's Apocalypse Now or Platoon. Hard to tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abdcskins Posted March 5, 2008 Author Share Posted March 5, 2008 Hey I appreciate all the feedback guys. A lot of movies mentioned that I hadn't heard about or seen(We Were Soldiers, The Killing Fields, Casualties of War, Bat 21). As well as Hamburger Hill and Born on the 4th of July. I will also check out the books that were recommended(The 13th Valley, The Things They Carried) when I get a chance. I also took your advice, RyansRangers, and looked up some documentaries(Regret to Inform, Hearts and Minds) and discovered a supposedly really good DVD entitled "Vietnam- A Television History." I'll probably get that for my dad, a real war buff. I don't know what it is about the Vietnam War that interests me. Maybe it's that fact that it is the first and only war that we've really been defeated in. Or the fact that soldiers were so traumatized and returned alienated and confused(not that that didn't or doesn't happen in other wars). Or maybe the sheer absurdity of us being over there in the first place or thinking we could win. I've always been somewhat interested in wars I guess....how they start and how they develop. It just amazes me how people/governments feel like that it is the only alternative as opposed to talking and finding a truce. Finally, I'd like to share these quotes. "If we use conventional military criteria, the Americans should have been victorious. They used 15 million tons of munitions (as much as they employed in World War Two), had a vast military superiority over their enemies by any standard one employs, and still they were defeated." - Gabriel Kolko “The customary reward of defeat, if one can survive it, is in the lessons thereby learned, which may yield victory in the next war. But the circumstances of our defeat in Vietnam were sufficiently ambiguous to deny the nation (that) benefit.” - Edward Luttwak Feel free to continue the discussion. Peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergasun Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Why would anyone choose Redux over the original version? Redux completely destroys the pace of the movie. I even notice this and I'm not a film major or weenie or anything... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OVCChairman Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 FORREST GUMP!!!! in all reality, Platoon, or FMJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyansRangers Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I am less inclined to believe this now that we have seen what is going on in Iraq.I think we could've defeated the North Vietnamese army relatively quickly if we moved quickly with a large force. ...I think we would have spent the next decade trying to protect the Republic of Vietnam from the insurgent attacks of the Viet Cong. China would have supported them. Who knows what would have happened in Cambodia and Laos. It would have been a lot fewer lives lost, but I think the baggage would still be the same. I see your point however, the generals would have pushed into cambodia and would have been able to get the insurgents. There was a clear defined army we were against unlike iraq and other countries were not getting involved like Iraq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GibbsFactor Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I don't know what it is about the Vietnam War that interests me. Maybe it's that fact that it is the first and only war that we've really been defeated in. Nope, the war of 1812. :2cents: for a movie on it: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0194627/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PCS Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Most of the ones talked about are good Vietnam movies. Some just have parts about them that make them good. Apocalypse Now was good in parts where it showed some of the sheer insanity that took place in that war. The Deer Hunter in it's flashback scenes did well. Full Metal Jacket was good in its depiction of some of the battle scenes, (the first half, classic as it was, was more about basic in that era than the war itself imho). Platoon and We Were Soldiers are my personal favorites. I served with some Vietnam Vets at the time it came out and those guys said "Yep. That's what it was like." We Were Soldiers, though taking license with the battle itself and some characters, was outstanding in its depection of the war at the time on both fronts. My father was over there at the time, (though only listened to the battle since he was in Saigon at the time), and said it was indeed, a very well done movie. My mom had to fill the role of Mrs. Moore on at least one occasion and possibly a few more times back then so I'm definitely partial to this movie for those reasons, (that and Hal Moore even said that Hollywood got it right with that one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rincewind Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Nope, the war of 1812. :2cents:for a movie on it: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0194627/ And then there was Korea... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark The Homer Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 My fave movies are already listed, of course. They would be Deer Hunter, Appocalypse Now, and Full Metal Jacket: Deer Hunter As I remember it, this was the very first Vietnam war movie. Hollywood hadn't yet tried to depict the war, so Deer Hunter was the public's first view, as shown by Hollywood. The movie was great, I would say it was my very favorite at the time, thanks to the acting, directing, and screenplay. The character development was outstanding because you could identify with the characters and feel their camraderie early in the movie - there are tons of examples. And it seemed so real because it wasn't limited to being friendly. They picked on each other too, which is what guys do when they get cranky. Stan: Mike, lemme borrow your boots. Mike: No. Stan: No??? Mike: No. Stan: What do you mean, no??? Mike: That's it. No. No way. Stan: Some ****in' friend... You're some ****in' friend, Mike. Mike: You gotta get your head out of your ass, Stan. John: Maybe he likes the view from up there. Everybody laughs. Mike: You gotta learn, Stan! You come out here... You got no jacket, you got no pants, you got no knife and you got no boots. All you got is that stupid little gun you carry around like John Wayne. You think everyone's gonna take care of you! That's what you always think, but this time you're wrong. This time you're on your own! Other guy: Mike, give him the boots. Mike: No. No boots. No nothin'. Stan: You're one ****in' ****, Mike. You know that? You're one ****ing ****! Mike (holds bullet in his fingers): See this? This is this. This ain't something else. This is this! For now on, you're on your own. Stan: You know what I think? There's times I think you're a goddamn faggot!... I fixed you up a million times, Mike! (to the others) I fixed him up a million times! I don't know how many times I fixed him up... and nothin' ever happens... Zilch! Zero!... The trouble with you, Mike, no one knows what the **** you're talking about! "This is this"? What the **** is that supposed to mean, "this is this"? I mean is that some faggot sounding bull****, or is that some faggot sounding bull****!!! Stan: Take last night...! Last night he coulda had that red head chick at the bowler-rama. Mike smiles and shakes his head. Stan: And what happens? Nothin'. JOHN: I'll get the boots. Somebody: Get the boots. JOHN: I mean let's get going before -- Mike -- who has remained completely calm throughout Stan's tirade: "Stan - I said no." Stan: What are you gonna do? Shoot me? Mike ignores him. Stan finally gives up. Nick - who has remained completely silent, walks over to the car, gets Mike's extra pair of boots, walks over to Stan. Nick: Stan ... (hands Stan Mike's boots, Stan takes them.) Nick turns to Mike: "What's the matter with you?" Mike doesn't protest, but instead looks down at the ground, seemingly ashamed. If that's not great dialogue, I don't know what is. That is just one scene that sets up the bond between Mike and Nick, which carries into the last scene in Nam when Nick shoots himself in the head in front of Mike. Another great scene in that movies was when Mike had the gun to his head. He then coaxed the enemy to start laughing, because he was surely about to shoot himself, having already spent two empty chambers out of six. It was that laughter that gave him the edge and allowed him to kill all the enemy and escape. That very same scene was copied in Die Hard. John McClain coaxed the German thieves into laughing - because McClain was unarmed and about to die -- and then McClain grabbed the gun taped to his back and shot everybody. Then of course, you have the last scene where they sing God Bless America. Extremely powerful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43brown32 Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Best book on Vietnam: A Rumor of War, Phil Caputo Not only what I consider the best personal account of the war, but the best narrative I've ever read on the corrosive effect of War on the human spirit. This is not a whiney," I'm a war criminal" confessional. This guy was a kickass Marine and later became one of the great war journalists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USS Redskins Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Full Metal Jacket hands down..... We Were Soldiers is right up there and then Platoon and Apolcalypse Now. I think it can be argued that we fought Vietnam instead of a Nuclear war with the Russians. Sucks but we probably had to fight somewhere, somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECU-ALUM Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Platoon. My father who did 3 tours in Vietnam as a door-gunner saw it with me and he siad, "That was pretty accurate." My mom was shocked when Charlie Sheen's character killed Tom Berringer's character....and my dad said, "That's what happened to our Lt. He was green out of West Point not ready for what he walked into, and a lot like Frank Burns on M-A-S-H. We all were convinced he was going to get us killed, and so he went to take a nap one of the sargents grabbed a grenade...walked by his tent...and..." That's all he said and my mom looked like she was going to puke and my dad later told my mom he felt guilty about telling her that story, because he felt I was to young to be hearing about that kind of stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bliz Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Apocalypse Now Redux hands down. Hamburger Hill wasn't bad either. The first half of Full Metal Jacket is the best 'Nam War movie. The rest of the movie I could do without.The best, most complete 'Nam movie is Apocalypse Now Redeux without a question and by a landslide over the full FMJ and Platoon, et. al. by a great distance. I thought the original version was better than the redux. Some of the stuff they add is cool, but most of it is unnecessary and ultimately detracts from the movie, in my opinion. I had seen it both ways and when I went to buy the DVD was very careful to buy the original and not the redux for that reason. :2cents: Great movies suggested, nothing to add there. But as far as books, I strongly recommend Michael Herr's "Dispatches". Herr was a correspondent in 'Nam, and later co-wrote the screenplay for Full Metal Jacket (some scenes in Dispatches made it in). It's more of a literary style, as opposed to a historical account. One of the first major and successful accounts of the war (1977), and is still considered by many to be among the very best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ComebackKing Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Also "We were soldiers" with Mel Gibson was a really great movie in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 The beginning of Full Metal Jacket was about as good as a movie can be but it comes up lame in the end, though it remains a great movie. I thought the same... FMJ was a bit of an uneven movie, it seemed like the pace actually got slower once the war actually started. still a great movie though Deer Hunter sounds great I have to check it out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 And then there was Korea...Technically, we didn't lose. We signed an armistice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zguy28 Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Full Metal Jacket was okay imo. The fact that at the time it was made a Marine Drill Instructor had never been killed by a recruit made it kind of unrealistic in retrospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKINS@THEGOALLINE Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Upcoming movie about President Bush and Vice-President Cheney's service during the Vietnam War, "Full Dinner Jacket". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sacase Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 All those movies are good movies. FMJ just because of the basic scene. EMory made that movie. I heard that he wasn't even supposed to play that role he was just a stand in and when he started going off the top of his head like that, they gave him the role. Very little of what he said was scripted. I used to read a lot of vietnam fiction when I was younger. Charlie Mike is an excellent book as well as The last Run. But like another poster said, look at the documenteries they will give a much mroe accurate depcition. Vietnam was not a military defeat, we beat the badly in almost every engagement. It was really the start of America loosing its will to fight. Vietnam was a political defeat. Korea? Once again we whipped them until the Red Chinese got involved we were reluctant to expand the war which is why we settled on the 48th parralel. Technically the war is still going on. 1812...yeah we got whipped. We might not even been a country anymore if the Great War was not going on. We only faced a small part of the british military, and frankly the blockade really put a hurting on the Economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oriolesfan93p Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 I have to say that my favorite would have to be "We were soldiers". It showed the training, the idiocy of some of the higher-ups, the determination of the American soldier, and even some of the idiocy of the American soldier "I'm just glad that I could die for my country", Also it showed the war at home, what the people at home had to deal with when the battle started and how we weren't ready to deal with the loss of our soldiers or informing their families. When the man who actually commanded the battle is able to say that they got things right then you know it has to be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bliz Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 Full Metal Jacket was okay imo. The fact that at the time it was made a Marine Drill Instructor had never been killed by a recruit made it kind of unrealistic in retrospect. I don't get it. Are you saying it was only okay because it was unrealistic? Also, that fact doesn't convince me that it was unrealistic. If someone who was there can say "basic wasn't like that", that would be something else (I know, I know...it's just an example), but what difference does it make whether or not a drill instructor had ever in fact been killed by a recruit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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