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Jesus vs. Horus


Helter_Skelter

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Source Material would make such a huge difference in these types of threads. It would completely transform these religious debates from blind stabs at other people's beliefs to a good source of information.

For instance, would it be too hard to cite a passage from an Egyptian text detailing Horus' death by crucifixion when making such a claim? It wouldn't need to be true that a god named Horus actually died that way, just true that there was an historic text even making such a claim.

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Looking back at this, I should've questioned the bit about Horus being crucified, since crucifixion was a form of execution brought about by the Romans long after the Horus myth was written. :doh:

common misconception...Crucifiction was torture, not a death sentence. Most who were crucified lived. It was the sword to the side that would be blamed for the death.

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common misconception...Crucifiction was torture, not a death sentence. Most who were crucified lived. It was the sword to the side that would be blamed for the death.
I think you misremembered. :)

How It Works: The prisoner is hoisted off the ground, arms restrained to the sides or behind the back, and simply left alone. Over time, the prisoner will grow tired and fall forward--constricting the lungs and causing asphyxiation. Death by crucifixion can take hours or even days.

http://civilliberty.about.com/od/capitalpunishment/ig/Types-of-Executions/Death-by-Crucifixion.htm

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common misconception...Crucifiction was torture, not a death sentence. Most who were crucified lived. It was the sword to the side that would be blamed for the death.

Do you have a reference for that? I'm not trying to bust your chops; I'm genuinely curious. I've heard that typically crucified victims took many days to die, and that there is a lack of crucified skeletons to confirm the large numbers the Romans claimed to have nailed up, but I have never heard most victims were allowed to live, other than a few conspiracy theorists re: Jesus.

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Mardis Gras' post:

1. Horus born of a virgin. Jesus born of a virgin.”

-Not true. It was a miraculous birth but not nessecarily a virgin birth. Isis was impregnated by Osiris even though his penis was still missing after Seb killed him and scattered his remains…. hmmm sounds NOTHING like Jesus lol

2. The foster father of Horus was Seb or Seph. Jesus was fostered by Joseph.

-This is misleading. In all of the stories PREDATING Jesus, Seb was Horus’ Uncle but since he murdered His father he was Horus’ arch-nemesis. It was up to Horus to avenge his father… in no version ANYWHERE was Seb his “foster father”. Also Joseph was a mortal man while Seb was the god of the under world…

3. Horus was of royal descent. Jesus was of royal descent.

Jesus mortal descendant was of the bloodline of David- Horus had no mortal bloodline, technically, as he was never mortal- although all pharoahs traditionally saw themselves as horus incarnate. This is not really similar to Jesus.

4. Horus birth accompanied by three solar deities [star gazers] who followed by the morning star of Sirius bearing gifts. Jesus birth accompanied by three wise men [Zoroastrian star gazers] who followed by a star “in the east” bearing gifts.

First off- at least get your biblical facts right. The Bible says nothing of the number of wisemen nor anything of any “Zoroastrian star gazers”. Second of all, Horus was never visited by any soloar deities NOR was his birth ever heralded by any stars.

5. The birth of Horus announced by angels. The birth of Jesus announced by angels.

No it wasn’t. Only Jesus’ was. And even then it was only to a few select people (Mary, Joseph, and the Shepherds)

6. Herut tried to murder the infant Horus. Herod slaughtered every first born in an attempt to kill Jesus the forthcoming messiah.

There was no Herut- it was his Evil Uncle Seb who wanted Him dead lest he avenge his father, Osiris.

7. Horus is baptized at age 30 by Anup the Baptiser at a river. Jesus is baptized at age 30 by John the Baptist at a river.

There never was any Anup the Baptiser nor was Horus ever baptised… this one was COMPLETELY fabricated

8. Horus resists temptation by the evil Sut [sut was to be the precursor for the Hebrew Satan] on a high mountain. Jesus resists temptation by Satan on a high mountain.

Horus was never tempted by any Sut. And Sut was just another name for Seb in another version in the story. There is ALWAYS an evil guy or a nemisis or something along those lines. Seb is no more Satan than Lex Luthor is…

9. Horus had 12 followers. Jesus had 12 disciples.

Horus had followers but in the stories it either says 10 or many. Never 12.

10. Horus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water. Jesus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water.

-Horus did no such thing, although even if he did- this would be assumed from a deity would it not? Deities must have SOME universal qualities.

11. Horus raised someone from the grave [his father Osiris] Jesus raised Lazarus [notice the name similarity] from the grave. Lazarus is short for Elasarus - the “us” on the end is romanized. Elasarus was derived from “El-Asar” which was the name given to Osiris.

There are no stories where Horus raises ANYONE from the dead. Osiris was pieced back together by Isis (Horus’ Mommy). However, in versions that post-date Christianity, the story of Horus sort of “evolves” him into his fathers place. He becomes the Sun god rather than the god of the sky like in the versions that predate Christianity, but this is worthless information to this cause…

12. Horus was buried and resurrected in the city of Anu. The place Bethany mentioned in John was a derivative of the words “Bet” and “Anu” which translates “the house of Anu”. The ‘y’ on the end of bethany is interchangeable with the letter ‘u’.

Horus never died let alone resurrected- only His father Osiris died. In one story that comes after Christianity, however, Seb wins the battle over Horus, but the Gods let him live.

13. Horus was killed by crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified.

Horus was never crucified in ANY version of the story.

14. Horus was accompanied by two thieves at the crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified with two thieves.

Horus was never crucified…

15. Horus was buried in a tomb at Anu. Jesus was buried in a tomb located in Bethany [bet-Anu].

Horus never died….

16. Horus was resurrected after 3 days. Jesus was “said” to resurrected after over a period of three days.

Horus never died…..

17. The resurrection of Horus was announced by three women. The resurrection of Jesus was announced by three women.

Horus never died….

18. Horus was given the titel KRST which means “anointed one” Jesus was given the title Christ [Christos] meaning “anointed one”

No such title was given to Horus. Horus was the God of the Sky anad later (after Christ) was given the title God of the Sun

19. Horus was considered the Good Shepherd amongst other names identified as a falcon to watch over shepherds, flocks and other grazing cattle. Jesus was called the Good Shepherd amongst other names the same for Horus.

Nope Horus was never given that title- he was identified as a falcon but because he was the God of the Sky

20. Horus is associated with fish and is linked with the star sign Pisces. Jesus is also associated with fish [and fishermen] and has Pisces as his star sign.

Horus was never associated with a fish… only a hawk and the sun (after Christ)

: end post

Mardi wins. Half of these comparisons made by the OP's reference did not seem at all correct to me. I only share the opinion that religions have a lot of common elements and that there is definitely something to be explored about it.

I'm not an "expert" on Egyptian religion, but I have a pretty good handle on their pantheon and I agree with everything Mardi just referenced.

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Do you have a reference for that? I'm not trying to bust your chops; I'm genuinely curious. I've heard that typically crucified victims took many days to die, and that there is a lack of crucified skeletons to confirm the large numbers the Romans claimed to have nailed up, but I have never heard most victims were allowed to live, other than a few conspiracy theorists re: Jesus.

I'll find it...just can't do too much browsing at work. Its like a punishment...torture to fit the crime. SO yeah it could be used to kill someone painfully. But in itself NOT a death sentence.

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Its like a punishment...torture to fit the crime. SO yeah it could be used to kill someone painfully. But in itself NOT a death sentence.

This is from Wiki, but its an accurate explanation of crucifixion as I understand it.

The goal of Roman crucifixion was not just to kill the criminal, but also to mutilate and dishonour the body of the condemned. In ancient tradition, an honourable death required burial; leaving a body on the cross, so as to mutilate it and prevent its burial, was a grave dishonour.

In their culture, nothing was worse than dishonor. I could see your source saying that the goal of crucifixion was not primarily execution but to induce shame. That's as close as I can get to resolving your explanation of crucifixion with everything else I've read.

I look forward to you digging up your source and sharing it.

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Mardis Gras' post:

1. Horus born of a virgin. Jesus born of a virgin.”

-Not true. It was a miraculous birth but not nessecarily a virgin birth. Isis was impregnated by Osiris even though his penis was still missing after Seb killed him and scattered his remains…. hmmm sounds NOTHING like Jesus lol

2. The foster father of Horus was Seb or Seph. Jesus was fostered by Joseph.

-This is misleading. In all of the stories PREDATING Jesus, Seb was Horus’ Uncle but since he murdered His father he was Horus’ arch-nemesis. It was up to Horus to avenge his father… in no version ANYWHERE was Seb his “foster father”. Also Joseph was a mortal man while Seb was the god of the under world…

3. Horus was of royal descent. Jesus was of royal descent.

Jesus mortal descendant was of the bloodline of David- Horus had no mortal bloodline, technically, as he was never mortal- although all pharoahs traditionally saw themselves as horus incarnate. This is not really similar to Jesus.

4. Horus birth accompanied by three solar deities [star gazers] who followed by the morning star of Sirius bearing gifts. Jesus birth accompanied by three wise men [Zoroastrian star gazers] who followed by a star “in the east” bearing gifts.

First off- at least get your biblical facts right. The Bible says nothing of the number of wisemen nor anything of any “Zoroastrian star gazers”. Second of all, Horus was never visited by any soloar deities NOR was his birth ever heralded by any stars.

5. The birth of Horus announced by angels. The birth of Jesus announced by angels.

No it wasn’t. Only Jesus’ was. And even then it was only to a few select people (Mary, Joseph, and the Shepherds)

6. Herut tried to murder the infant Horus. Herod slaughtered every first born in an attempt to kill Jesus the forthcoming messiah.

There was no Herut- it was his Evil Uncle Seb who wanted Him dead lest he avenge his father, Osiris.

7. Horus is baptized at age 30 by Anup the Baptiser at a river. Jesus is baptized at age 30 by John the Baptist at a river.

There never was any Anup the Baptiser nor was Horus ever baptised… this one was COMPLETELY fabricated

8. Horus resists temptation by the evil Sut [sut was to be the precursor for the Hebrew Satan] on a high mountain. Jesus resists temptation by Satan on a high mountain.

Horus was never tempted by any Sut. And Sut was just another name for Seb in another version in the story. There is ALWAYS an evil guy or a nemisis or something along those lines. Seb is no more Satan than Lex Luthor is…

9. Horus had 12 followers. Jesus had 12 disciples.

Horus had followers but in the stories it either says 10 or many. Never 12.

10. Horus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water. Jesus performed miracles like healing the sick and walking on water.

-Horus did no such thing, although even if he did- this would be assumed from a deity would it not? Deities must have SOME universal qualities.

11. Horus raised someone from the grave [his father Osiris] Jesus raised Lazarus [notice the name similarity] from the grave. Lazarus is short for Elasarus - the “us” on the end is romanized. Elasarus was derived from “El-Asar” which was the name given to Osiris.

There are no stories where Horus raises ANYONE from the dead. Osiris was pieced back together by Isis (Horus’ Mommy). However, in versions that post-date Christianity, the story of Horus sort of “evolves” him into his fathers place. He becomes the Sun god rather than the god of the sky like in the versions that predate Christianity, but this is worthless information to this cause…

12. Horus was buried and resurrected in the city of Anu. The place Bethany mentioned in John was a derivative of the words “Bet” and “Anu” which translates “the house of Anu”. The ‘y’ on the end of bethany is interchangeable with the letter ‘u’.

Horus never died let alone resurrected- only His father Osiris died. In one story that comes after Christianity, however, Seb wins the battle over Horus, but the Gods let him live.

13. Horus was killed by crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified.

Horus was never crucified in ANY version of the story.

14. Horus was accompanied by two thieves at the crucifixtion. Jesus was crucified with two thieves.

Horus was never crucified…

15. Horus was buried in a tomb at Anu. Jesus was buried in a tomb located in Bethany [bet-Anu].

Horus never died….

16. Horus was resurrected after 3 days. Jesus was “said” to resurrected after over a period of three days.

Horus never died…..

17. The resurrection of Horus was announced by three women. The resurrection of Jesus was announced by three women.

Horus never died….

18. Horus was given the titel KRST which means “anointed one” Jesus was given the title Christ [Christos] meaning “anointed one”

No such title was given to Horus. Horus was the God of the Sky anad later (after Christ) was given the title God of the Sun

19. Horus was considered the Good Shepherd amongst other names identified as a falcon to watch over shepherds, flocks and other grazing cattle. Jesus was called the Good Shepherd amongst other names the same for Horus.

Nope Horus was never given that title- he was identified as a falcon but because he was the God of the Sky

20. Horus is associated with fish and is linked with the star sign Pisces. Jesus is also associated with fish [and fishermen] and has Pisces as his star sign.

Horus was never associated with a fish… only a hawk and the sun (after Christ)

: end post

Mardi wins. Half of these comparisons made by the OP's reference did not seem at all correct to me. I only share the opinion that religions have a lot of common elements and that there is definitely something to be explored about it.

I'm not an "expert" on Egyptian religion, but I have a pretty good handle on their pantheon and I agree with everything Mardi just referenced.

No links or information to back up anything you said?????

Yet you are declaring someone a victor of what? the bull-crap award???

I am just asking for some proof (if you have any)

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Good thing you guys are swinging from TB's jock or anything....

Comeon, I know you've more than that? :)

Good thing all of his sources have proven credible and non-biased:rolleyes:

:laugh:

Being perfectly honest for a second, and since you brought it up, what credible and non-biased sources have you produced in response?
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No links or information to back up anything you said?????

Yet you are declaring someone a victor of what? the bull-crap award???

I am just asking for some proof (if you have any)

Some things are somewhat common knowledge and don't always need links to "credible" sources for discussion. But that's just my opinion, and I don't have a link to back it up. :2cents: :)
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Comeon, I know you've more than that? :)

Being perfectly honest for a second, and since you brought it up, what credible and non-biased sources have you produced in response?

I'm not the OP but I believe he posted links to support his position.

If people disagree it is their job to post proof of claim if they want to be taken seriously.

The short answer is this is not my thread...

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Some things are somewhat common knowledge and don't always need links to "credible" sources for discussion. But that's just my opinion, and I don't have a link to back it up. :2cents: :)

Really?

Dream on....or should I say faith on...?

For those of us that don't believe everything we are told we require proof.

I am just asking the chachie to provide some proof if he expects me or anyone else (that requires proof over faith) to take him seriously.

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Good thing you guys are swinging from TB's jock or anything....

Good thing all of his sources have proven credible and non-biased:rolleyes:

:laugh:

Figuring he doesn't use the Bible as the backbone for his references I'd say you are guilty of not reading any of the cites provided.

Ignorance is bliss I suppose

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I have to agree with the Original poster, there are too many parallels between current religions and paganism for them to be original.

Back then (way back then), when people didn't understand something, they automatically feared it, and attributed it to some supernatural force or entity. Such as when one year you get plentiful rain and the next year its a dry season, people just looked at what changed and attributed it to that. Its all about weather patterns, currents, etc..., but the problem is their knowledge was very limited.

What worries me is that, even with todays technology and explanations, people still believe in books that are nothing more than fairy tales, believing that there is this all-mighty god sitting somewhere watching every move we make. Anything and everything can be quantified (or will be in the near future), yet people still hinge on some primordial knowledge written in a book hundreds of years ago. All the stories in the Bible, Koran, Bhagavid Gita etc... are just that, stories. They are used to teach children about morals and distinguish between whats right and whats wrong etc... But once you get to a certain age, how can you not distinguish between fairy tales and reality?

So what I'm getting at here is......God Doesn't exist.. you've all been duped.

**Cue Techboy and his excuse that the NT is historical fact and not some scriptures written down by second hand knowledge.**

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