jc learning from tc

[Stone Cold]

we've all seen how young qbs start and struggle...especially when they're thrown directly into the fire as a rook. jc had the opportunity to learn for a season +.5

he's performed well this year prior to the injury, but tc seems to be working with, or at least executing, a much bigger playbook.

i think jc's experience under center this year, coupled with an opportunity to watch an expert execute the offense, will only prove dividends in the future.

i'm on the record as saying that jc is our qb however, tc is the guy making it happen right now. chemistry is a funny thing...sometimes overrated, but we're peaking at the right time and i'd think twice before pulling a healthy tc in favor of a hobbling/inexperienced jc.

whatever...we still gotta beat dallas. and Lord knows, i wouldn't want it any other way.

...just didn't want it buried: jc is learning a ton watching tc execute this offense with a fraction of the talent that jc has in his pinkie.

[throwback37]

Y'know, I was thinking the same thing. In his first season as a backup, he was watching the 8 car trying to run the offense, who was still learning it himself. JC and ultimately the team, will benefit from seeing this offense being run the way it is supposed to be.

[2006Skins]

I think Campbell will be a fury next year... As they just said on the radio, Campbell right now is like in his 2nd year of a foreign language... Next year, Campbell will be able to speak in that language fluently. That's really the only difference.

[SeAnTaYlOr2121]

I think if JC learns Al Saunders offense the way TC is showing that he does, I think the Redskins would be a Super Bowl caliber team. JC is better in every facet of the game then TC. The only thing TC has on JC is smarts and a better understanding of the offense. Its definalty not experience so you cant say TC is a veteran since his last start was '97. I am very excited bout next yr when Jason comes back and hopefully has a better understanding and the NFC is ours next year.

Lemme know what you guys think.........great win tonite

[Voice_of_Reason]

Completely agree. A couple things to note:

1. JC did NOT play in the pre-season due to injury.

2. JC did NOT have his WRs healthy to practice with in camp or during most of the season.

3. The offensive line was down right offensive a number of times due to injury.

4. When JC was watching Brunell last year, it meant NOTHING because Brunell is also new to this offense and was completely lost as well.

I think that as he watches TC run the offense, he's going to understand just how well this offense can be run. If he can stay healthy, man, he could be scary good.

[SearchHorizon]

The only thing TC has on JC is smarts and a better understanding of the offense. onite

IMHO, for QB's, understanding and smarts are perhaps more important then athleticism. This is the reason why Todd has time to throw in the pocket -- he understands the defensive formations and he is adjusting.

There is no guarantee that JC will achieve TC's level of proficiency.

[Cyber Pimp]

I think if JC learns Al Saunders offense the way TC is showing that he does, I think the Redskins would be a Super Bowl caliber team. JC is better in every facet of the game then TC. The only thing TC has on JC is smarts and a better understanding of the offense. Its definalty not experience so you cant say TC is a veteran since his last start was '97. I am very excited bout next yr when Jason comes back and hopefully has a better understanding and the NFC is ours next year.

Lemme know what you guys think.........great win tonite

JC is super slow making reads and has a slow release. Not to mention that he isnt that accurate. He has a lot of improving to make. Al Saunders runs a timing based offense. Slow reads and a slow release wont get the job done.

[redman]

Stop everything and go listen to Collins' post-game interview on redskins.com. He was asked, "What have you gotten better at in those 10 years (since you last started)?", and the end of his answer tells you exactly what the difference is between what he's doing and what Campbell does. The question is around 2:08.

I'm serious, go listen now.

[myzhi]

What happen to Al Saunder's Offense sux? Time kick his butt to the curve?

Like I have said a million times, having good QB play makes the entire team, not just the O, look good. Having a bad QB makes the entire team look bad with holes need to be patched everywhere. People can keep on dreaming, but I don't believe JC will ever be good. His habit of loosing games from fumbling and throwing INTs can't be overlook.

[SeAnTaYlOr2121]

What happen to Al Saunder's Offense sux? Time kick his butt to the curve?

Like I have said a million times, having good QB play makes the entire team, not just the O, look good. Having a bad QB makes the entire team look bad with holes need to be patched everywhere. People can keep on dreaming, but I don't believe JC will ever be good. His habit of loosing games from fumbling and throwing INTs can't be overlook.

Then if we are gonna go with JC as our future and most people are saying that hell never grasp this offense then why the hell do we have Al Suanders because its a waste of time if JC never gets it.

[TheLongshot]

Like I have said a million times, having good QB play makes the entire team, not just the O, look good. Having a bad QB makes the entire team look bad with holes need to be patched everywhere. People can keep on dreaming, but I don't believe JC will ever be good. His habit of loosing games from fumbling and throwing INTs can't be overlook.

The guy has barely played one year of NFL football. Hell, a lot of people thought Drew Brees would never be a good QB, and then one day it happened for them.

Campbell shows steady improvement. To expect him to be a great QB this year, tho, was somewhat unrealistic.

Jason

[Cyber Pimp]

Then if we are gonna go with JC as our future and most people are saying that hell never grasp this offense then why the hell do we have Al Suanders because its a waste of time if JC never gets it.

Its not Al's fault if JC never gets it. JC isnt the caliber QB that you build around. Why build a team around a mediocore QB? Its starting to look like JC has been wasting everybody else's time.

[NoCalMike]

Jason Campbell has every physical tool an NFL QB needs. What he needs to gain is what Collins already has and that is knowledge and experience in this offense.

It is obvious watching both guys that having Collins in there is going to take away some of the deeper passes down the field, and a lot of the laser passes Campbell can make. An example would be the two routes Cooley ran, about 8 yards and then towars the sideline. Campbell has completed those all season long because of the strength of his arm, but Collins had both of his knocked down because the ball doesn't zip to Cooley, giving the DB time to get there to knock it away.

On the other hand, Collins is a lot calmer and knowledgable RIGHT NOW against the blitz. He doesn't overreact and he looks to all his options, checks down and makes the other team pay.

Campbell's inexperience will be fixed in time, Collins lack of physical attributes will never go away.

Lets face it, Al Saunders brought Collins for a reason. He knows the offense frontwards and backwards. He might not be able to make every throw, but he knows where every single guy on offense is SUPPOSED to be at all times and in all situations.

Once Campbell learns the offense the way Collins knows it, Campbell is going to be pretty darn good.

[redman]

Like I have said a million times, having good QB play makes the entire team, not just the O, look good. Having a bad QB makes the entire team look bad with holes need to be patched everywhere. People can keep on dreaming, but I don't believe JC will ever be good. His habit of loosing games from fumbling and throwing INTs can't be overlook.

Too bad you like your QB's microwaveable. I have a little more patience for someone as promising as Jason is to develop in what is one of the most complex professional sports positions I can think of.

If anything, Todd Collins is himself proof of the effect that time and preparation have on development of a QB.

[ColdnGrey]

Its not Al's fault if JC never gets it. JC isnt the caliber QB that you build around. Why build a team around a mediocore QB? Its starting to look like JC has been wasting everybody else's time.

:laugh: :laugh:

This post was a joke, right?

[Cyber Pimp]

:laugh: :laugh:

This post was a joke, right?

Its the truth. JC is just an average QB. He will be a backup QB somewhere in the league in two years.

[zCommander]

The only thing TC has on JC is smarts and a better understanding of the offense. Its definalty not experience so you cant say TC is a veteran since his last start was '97.

You didn't listened to JG after the Bears game. JG said he is a smart QB and in practice is pointing out incorrect formations. He is a QB who doesn't sit on the bench like other backup QB in the league.

To say he has no experience is kinda wrong it is this experience that makes him a good QB. Do you forget to ride a bike if you haven't touched it in 10 years?

Go listen to that presser after the Bears game.

[ColdnGrey]

Its the truth. JC is just an average QB. He will be a backup QB somewhere in the league in two years.

Bookmark the thread. I see him as the Redskin starter until atleast 2015.

[SeAnTaYlOr2121]

Its the truth. JC is just an average QB. He will be a backup QB somewhere in the league in two years.

i can't see how you can say that, he hasn't had a full year in the league. I think in time he's better then Sheli Girling, Philip Rivers and Vince Young to name a few. I would take JC over any of those guys. These guys are just hyped caus the media is obsessed with them

[LoudMouth12thMan]

I think if JC learns Al Saunders offense the way TC is showing that he does, I think the Redskins would be a Super Bowl caliber team. JC is better in every facet of the game then TC. The only thing TC has on JC is smarts and a better understanding of the offense. Its definalty not experience so you cant say TC is a veteran since his last start was '97. I am very excited bout next yr when Jason comes back and hopefully has a better understanding and the NFC is ours next year.

Lemme know what you guys think.........great win tonite

Some of you guys are nuts. Collins poise in the pocket is unmatched by Campbell. JC does stay rather calm for the most part, but his head is not there yet. Collins makes better decisions and looks off defenders/goes through his progressions much more efficiently. Collins is not as physically gifted, but he is by far a more complete quarterback with better field vision and accuracy plus ball handling skills. I know it's painful people to admit, but the old man's got skeeeillzzz' Campbell is a potential badass but he ain't there yet. We didn't think he'd be there this year, and he's not. He's gotta' fix a couple things before he can play at a high enough level for us to win the big games. Next year is his year to shine, but give Collins his due. Collins has earned it so far. :2cents:

HTTR

[bikie]

I disagree with the JC mediocre sentiments... I believe JC has the talent to be a great QB in this league, and I think seeing collins run this offense (as opposed to watching brunell do it) has and will help him immensely...

protecting the ball, taking what is given to you and seeing the whole field are things collins is doing and JC should learn from...

[deejaydana]

JC is super slow making reads and has a slow release. Not to mention that he isnt that accurate. He has a lot of improving to make. Al Saunders runs a timing based offense. Slow reads and a slow release wont get the job done.

As much as I like JC I've been feeling the same thing: the guy is just slow moving and slow to read defenses. I know some of this comes w/time and Collins is a journeyman and a back-up (not slighting him saying this) BUT Collins does look just much more poised and doesn't make bad errors like JC does. I hope Collins can take us as far as possible this year and that JC just studies the heck outta what he's seeing and comes back that much better for it.

[Joe Gibbs II]

one thing i love about TC, he stays in the pocket and is very, very composed.

For some reason (last 3 years at least), the O-line plays huge last 4-5 games of the season. When JC was back there, they didnt do all that they did for TC.

3 things JC needs to work on.

Poise

Accuracy

Experience/Knowledge

he is close

[bikie]

one thing i love about TC, he stays in the pocket and is very, very composed.

For some reason (last 3 years at least), the O-line plays huge last 4-5 games of the season. When JC was back there, they didnt do all that they did for TC.

3 things JC needs to work on.

Poise

Accuracy

Experience/Knowledge

he is close

I respect your opinion, bro, but do you really think TC is getting better protection than JC was? I've been as anal as timing their snap to pass and there's no difference.. the only difference has been protection of the ball and speed in passing (TC is faster)...

without the game films, it's all speculative, but from what I can tell, TC is seeign the field better and if he is not seeing anyting downfield, he is checking to his safefy valves much quicker than JC was, which is giving them more time to make plays, versus dumping off to the guys that the rest of the defense was then keying on...

[AHerald]

One of these guys is smarter and more decisive than the other.

I really like JC and he's gifted with a lot of great qualities: he is a nice man, a good teammate, a God-fearing character guy, tough, poised under fire, determined, and a gifted athlete with a heckuva arm. But he's not exactly Mensa material.

Now, Terry Bradshaw, as one obvious example, is living proof that a good quarterback doesn't have to be smart to be a winner. But then Bradshaw didn't have to run Saunders' offense. Saunders is a braniac and his complicated offense needs a bright and nimble mind at the QB spot. 700 page playbooks aren't for bad students.

Yes, Collins has experience in this offense, and I'm not discounting that advantage. But at the end of day he's a smarter player than Campbell and it really shows in how he runs the offense.

I hope JC, through sheer determination and effort manages to master this offense, but my gut tells me he'll never flourish in Saunders' mentally challenging offense.

:2cents: