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A HUGE problem with this team: No kicker


Sekhmet728

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This is ridiculous. He kicks off short by design? The goal for EVERY kickoff, barring an onside kick or squib kick, is a touchback, plain and simple. They start at their 20, nobody gets hurt.

Some people will make excuses for ANYTHING. "No no, Speaker Pelosi, we're losing the war BY DESIGN." :rolleyes:

Did you miss the average starting position of our opponents on our kickoffs? It was the 19! He's doing better than your goal, and people still give him grief. I think the goal is to give them the worst field position possible. I'll take the extra yard for them to drive.

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This is ridiculous. He kicks off short by design? The goal for EVERY kickoff, barring an onside kick or squib kick, is a touchback, plain and simple. They start at their 20, nobody gets hurt.

Some people will make excuses for ANYTHING. "No no, Speaker Pelosi, we're losing the war BY DESIGN." :rolleyes:

Wow, that simply is not true at all. Having played football my entire life, still playing now in semi-pro leagues and starting to coach football I will tell you that many times the design is different.

Look at a guy like Hester. He has problems picking up balls that are kicked high in the air. This is evident by the drops he has on many deep passes as well as the number of punts he bobbles. As a special team coach I will instruct my kicker to kick it high and to one side forcing him to move up and to his left or right to field the kick. This gives my team a chance for a turnover as well as limiting the abilty of their returner. Also, I am showing my team that I have confidence in them by kicking to the opp's best player and stopping him by using a scheme that works.

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I think people are missing that. Did nobody note that our opponents are on average starting in worse field position than if he banged it through the end zone every time? WOW :notworthy

Seriously, who cares about yards in the air on kick offs? It all about hitting it high enough AND long enough to pin your opponent back as far as you can. People need to keep the end goal in mind (same goes for complaining about a long field goal that had to curve to be good). People, results are what matter, not style did it pretty points.

So, let me get this straight:

We should give Suisham a pass for his terrible kickoffs because other guys will cover for him?

:doh:

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I was wondering when a good blame the kicker thread was going to get started. I guess it was just a matter of time, and lord knows he has it coming because he has stunk so bad (sarcasm). I even bet he was beginning to feel left out.

Fact of the matter is, if you are relying on your kicker to win you games, then you have other problems.

Peace. HTTR! :helmet:

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Wow, that simply is not true at all. Having played football my entire life, still playing now in semi-pro leagues and starting to coach football I will tell you that many times the design is different.

Look at a guy like Hester. He has problems picking up balls that are kicked high in the air. This is evident by the drops he has on many deep passes as well as the number of punts he bobbles. As a special team coach I will instruct my kicker to kick it high and to one side forcing him to move up and to his left or right to field the kick. This gives my team a chance for a turnover as well as limiting the abilty of their returner. Also, I am showing my team that I have confidence in them by kicking to the opp's best player and stopping him by using a scheme that works.

What I said is absolutely true. Your ultimate goal is NOT to have a return at all. Plain and simple.

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I was wondering when a good blame the kicker thread was going to get start. I guess it was just a matter of time, and lord knows he has it coming because he has stunk so bad (sarcasm). I even bet he was beginning to feel left out.

Fact of the matter is, if you are relying on your kicker to win you games, then you have other problems.

Peace. HTTR! :helmet:

1) Nope, no team has ever won a Super Bowl on the back of their kicker.

2) Nope, we shouldn't need a kicker at all, so why even have one on the roster?

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1) Nope, no team has ever won a Super Bowl on the back of their kicker.

2) Nope, we shouldn't need a kicker at all, so why even have one on the roster?

Sounds good to me. Field goals don't win championships and I think to speed the game up a touchdown should just an automatic 7 points.

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He is told to kick it high and short so the coverage unit can get down there and make the tackle quickly. If you kick it low and into the endzone, it is returnable and the blocking gets set up further up the field.

I still think he should just be able to kick it away as far as he can. Coaches get FANCY PLAY SYNDROME too much with kickoffs.

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i guess u forget INdy with Vandershank or Vainteri with NE. U need a FG kicker to win a championship
Sounds good to me. Field goals don't win championships and I think to speed the game up a touchdown should just an automatic 7 points.

Or, you know, that Mark Moseley guy carrying us to the Super Bowl. But, whatever, kickers aren't important. :rolleyes:

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Suisham isn't bad, he's just been inconsistent recently.

And his kickoffs, from what I've seen, have been really short.

This last part puzzles me. From my feeble recollections, I thought he initially did pretty well on kickoffs, to the point it seemed a pleasant relief that one of our kickers finally had some distance again.

What might the reasons for this be? Could he be hurting (K seems to be a position of jinxable integrity for us, historically speaking)? Or is this a bit of strategery (thanks SNL GW) in order to reduce big returns? Maybe he's just lost a bit of his kickoff mojo... hopefully to return.

The one thing I do know is that our opponents can't run a kick back if it goes out of the endzone.

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Did you miss the average starting position of our opponents on our kickoffs? It was the 19! He's doing better than your goal, and people still give him grief. I think the goal is to give them the worst field position possible. I'll take the extra yard for them to drive.

Uh, no. Do you want to take the risk of a return for 50, 60, 70 yards or a touchdown while putting all of our players at risk just because you want to, on average, give them an extra yard?

I guess you haven't seen Leon Washington return a KO for 90+ yds against us and guys like Devin Hester return punts from that distance.

I think you're on my side? I don't know what your post means.

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i guess u forget INdy with Vandershank or Vainteri with NE. U need a FG kicker to win a championship

Look, I'm not saying teams don't need kickers. I am just saying if a team relys on them to win games, then the offense has problems that need worked out. I also understand not every game is going to be won New England Patriot style and that there will be close games decided by kickers, but if the offense is scoring with any kind of consistency, the kicker scoring becomes a luxury, not a necessity; which is the way it should be.

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This last part puzzles me. From my feeble recollections, I thought he initially did pretty well on kickoffs, to the point it seemed a pleasant relief that one of our kickers finally had some distance again.

What might the reasons for this be? Could he be hurting (K seems to be a position of jinxable integrity for us, historically speaking)? Or is this a bit of strategery (thanks SNL GW) in order to reduce big returns? Maybe he's just lost a bit of his kickoff mojo... hopefully to return.

The one thing I do know is that our opponents can't run a kick back if it goes out of the endzone.

His kickoffs have never been A+, and that's simply unacceptable for a kicker. His job:

Kick the ball.

Real far.

That way.

How can you be one of the top 32 in the WORLD and not be able to do that every single time? A kickoff or field goal, for a kicker, is the same damned play from Pop Warner to the Pro Bowl. The SAME EFFING THING! There's no game film to study, there's no variations to the play from the kicker's standpoint, nothing.

I have no sympathy for kickers on kickoffs or within 40 yards.

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Look, I'm not saying teams don't need kickers. I am just saying if a team relys on them to win games, then the offense has problems that need worked out. I also understand not every game is going to be won New England Patriot style and that there will be close games decided by kickers, but if the offense is scoring with any kind of consistency, the kicker scoring becomes a luxury, not a necessity; which is the way it should be.

Still no. I mean, it'd be great to have an offense that makes a kicker a waste of a roster spot, but you basically just said "If 11 players are doing their jobs, then there shouldn't be a need for the other 42." That's simply unrealistic and not true.

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What I said is absolutely true. Your ultimate goal is NOT to have a return at all. Plain and simple.

Again, that is not always the case. Have you played football? The idea that a kicker can kick the ball through the endzone every time is simply false. There is no kicker in the league that can kick the ball out the back of the endzone every time. Honestly, I have seen it happen maybe 10 times in my life (again playing football and being on the field to watch it) when it was not wind aided. It's almost like driving the ball 400 yards in golf every time with accuracy. The chances of that happening are very very very rare. Instead of trying this coaches will design plays that will work to their kickers advantages.

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Again, that is not always the case. Have you played football? The idea that a kicker can kick the ball through the endzone every time is simply false. There is no kicker in the league that can kick the ball out the back of the endzone every time. Honestly, I have seen it happen maybe 10 times in my life (again playing football and being on the field to watch it) when it was not wind aided. It's almost like driving the ball 400 yards in golf every time with accuracy. The chances of that happening are very very very rare. Instead of trying this coaches will design plays that will work to their kickers advantages.

I totally understand your point, but this isn't semi-pro that I'm talking about; this is the NFL. If it's windy like crazy, then fine, play like we did against the Bears. However, on most days, we should have a kicker who can kick it 75 yards into the middle of the endzone with consistency. There's 6.5 billion people in the world.

And please, no one tell me that Suisham is in anyway kicking his balls stragegically outside of Thursday's game. Kicking it just to the left of a hash mark does not mean you're pinning the returner.

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I totally understand your point, but this isn't semi-pro that I'm talking about; this is the NFL. If it's windy like crazy, then fine, play like we did against the Bears. However, on most days, we should have a kicker who can kick it 75 yards into the middle of the endzone with consistency. There's 6.5 billion people in the world.

And please, no one tell me that Suisham is in anyway kicking his balls stragegically outside of Thursday's game. Kicking it just to the left of a hash mark does not mean you're pinning the returner.

So - Um... I guess you don't watch much football?

Name a team where the kicker kicks the ball in the end zone every time? The NFL moved the kickoff from the 35 to the 30 to make most balls returnable.

My guess - And it is a guess, is that 75% of all kickoffs in the league are returned. And out of the 25% that aren't, most are eaither kicked out of bounds or had help from the wind.

2nd - Did you notice after the Jets game is when his KO's got shorter? They are kidcking it high on purpose. You don't think Thursday night was a matter of stradgegy? Lets see...

The best Kick returner and the punt returner in the league, close game, and all punts were also short, high, and outside.....

But naaaaa - SS kicks were all just bad kicks.... even though we were one of the few teams that played the bears that were NOT burned by hester....

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So - Um... I guess you don't watch much football?

Name a team where the kicker kicks the ball in the end zone every time? The NFL moved the kickoff from the 35 to the 30 to make most balls returnable.

My guess - And it is a guess, is that 75% of all kickoffs in the league are returned. And out of the 25% that aren't, most are eaither kicked out of bounds or had help from the wind.

2nd - Did you notice after the Jets game is when his KO's got shorter? They are kidcking it high on purpose. You don't think Thursday night was a matter of stradgegy? Lets see...

The best Kick returner and the punt returner in the league, close game, and all punts were also short, high, and outside.....

But naaaaa - SS kicks were all just bad kicks.... even though we were one of the few teams that played the bears that were NOT burned by hester....

:applause:. No 1 in the league does that anymore. We have one of the best coverage units and DS is taking advantage of that. We are the only time in a while not burned by Devin Haster

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This is a homer pick but...

I'd love to see them try and grab Connor Hughes from the Steelers and have him in camp to compete with Suisam. He was a hell of a kicker in College, was MONEY in his 2003 year but fell off a tiny bit 2004. Has a great leg. I think he'd be a good, cheap, option to maybe give a shot

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I totally understand your point, but this isn't semi-pro that I'm talking about; this is the NFL. If it's windy like crazy, then fine, play like we did against the Bears. However, on most days, we should have a kicker who can kick it 75 yards into the middle of the endzone with consistency. There's 6.5 billion people in the world.

And please, no one tell me that Suisham is in anyway kicking his balls stragegically outside of Thursday's game. Kicking it just to the left of a hash mark does not mean you're pinning the returner.

Semi-Pro, College, Pro, World League, etc. There are no kickers in the NFL that will hit the ball 75 yards to the middle of the endzone every time UNLESS they do it on a low, line drive kick. If they do that they are outkick their coverage and the other team gets a big return.

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