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pointyfootball

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Didn't see this posted. From USAToday. Only problem it doesn't let you see furture salaries. But it can let you see things like....how much Jevon Kearse is being overpaid. And the fact that WB is only making $3.2 this year, even though he's 60% of the offense.

http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/teamdetail.aspx?team=24&year=2007

Enjoy

PF

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Click on cap value. 4 names that will make most eagles fans cry (all in the top 9).

Reno Mahe

Darren Howard

Jevon Kearse

Takeo Spikes

How does Mahe get a four mill bonus???

Montae Raegor is a funny one too. Everyone makes mistakes, but this looks pretty bad right now.

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Click on cap value. 4 names that will make most eagles fans cry (all in the top 9).

Reno Mahe

Darren Howard

Jevon Kearse

Takeo Spikes

How does Mahe get a four mill bonus???

Montae Raegor is a funny one too. Everyone makes mistakes, but this looks pretty bad right now.

My guess is that the 4 mil for Reno is LTBE. He won't see it, and the Eagles will get it back next year as a cap bonus.

Those same people will argue that the Eagles have the highest payroll, etc etc etc. Behold the power of Banner and the Eagles Front Office.

Gold. Standard.

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My guess is that the 4 mil for Reno is LTBE. He won't see it, and the Eagles will get it back next year as a cap bonus.

Those same people will argue that the Eagles have the highest payroll, etc etc etc. Behold the power of Banner and the Eagles Front Office.

Gold. Standard.

You mean UTBE?

LTBE - Likely to be earned

UTBE - Unlikely to be earned, this comes back as a cap bonus

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You mean UTBE?

LTBE - Likely to be earned

UTBE - Unlikely to be earned, this comes back as a cap bonus

No.

LTBE in any particular year counts against THAT YEARS cap number, because they are expected to make it. You don't pay out ACTUAL DOLLARS until they DO make it.

If they don't make it,

1) you don't actually have to pay the money out, so it's less dollars out the door and

2) you get a bonus on next year's cap of the amount of the LTBE, because you already took the cap hit.

This year the Eagles had 2.9 mil in LTBE credits. My guess is that Reno will not see the 4 mil. They signed him after he was bussing tables this year, lol.

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No.

LTBE in any particular year counts against THAT YEARS cap number, because they are expected to make it. You don't pay out ACTUAL DOLLARS until they DO make it.

If they don't make it,

1) you don't actually have to pay the money out, so it's less dollars out the door and

2) you get a bonus on next year's cap of the amount of the LTBE, because you already took the cap hit.

This year the Eagles had 2.9 mil in LTBE credits. My guess is that Reno will not see the 4 mil. They signed him after he was bussing tables this year, lol.

I think you have it wrong.

From:http://www.thehogs.net/washington-redskins/salary.php?search=Adjustments

* - The 'Adjust' category refers to Unlikely To Be Earned incentives (UTBE). This number can be either a debit or a credit depending on whether or not that unlikely to be earned incentive was earned. If it was earned, there is a debit in this category, if it was not, the team receives a cap credit the following year and you will see a negative number.

Other than that I'm trying to find something on the web that clearly defines it. But no where have I seen that LTBE's being described as something that gives you cap bonus next year (well, technically they do, I guess, if the player doesn't reach the bonus, but they are called LTBE's for a reason).

So the 4 mil bonus for Mahe is more likely a UTBE than a LTBE. But say McNabb had something in his contract that said he will QB 12 games a year at minimum and get 2 mil for it - something that seemed Likely backed when the Eagles would have made his initial contract - and he gets injured in Week 11 for the rest of the season, that LTBE would then be cap credit since it got paid out.

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I think you have it wrong.

From:http://www.thehogs.net/washington-redskins/salary.php?search=Adjustments

Other than that I'm trying to find something on the web that clearly defines it. But no where have I seen that LTBE's being described as something that gives you cap bonus next year (well, technically they do, I guess, if the player doesn't reach the bonus, but they are called LTBE's for a reason).

So the 4 mil bonus for Mahe is more likely a UTBE than a LTBE. But say McNabb had something in his contract that said he will QB 12 games a year at minimum and get 2 mil for it - something that seemed Likely backed when the Eagles would have made his initial contract - and he gets injured in Week 11 for the rest of the season, that LTBE would then be cap credit since it got paid out.

Yeah, I know it gets confusing, but it is definitely LTBE.

If a team has extra cap room late in the season, they add an unreachable incentive as a bonus in a players contract and call it "Likely to be earned" The money counts toward that years cap. It's unreachable, so they never actually have to pay the player, but it still counts toward the cap, so you use up all the money for that year... technically.

In the 2005 season, there was a LTBE incentive in Rock Cartwrights contract of around 1.1 mil. It counted toward 2005 cap. He didn't reach the incentive. They didn't actually pay him. That 1.1 mil was added to the 2006 cap number.

That same 2005 season, the Eagles added a 6.5 million LTBE to Jack Brewer's contract late in the season. Same thing. He didn't reach the incentive, they didn't actually pay him, and that 6.5 million was ADDED to the 2006 cap.

Now the thing is, the Eagles had done this for multiple years in a row, so they typically were below the cap in ACTUAL DOLLARS SPENT. Hence, the "Eagles are cheap" comments.

I actually think it's smart to keep around 1million in cap, just in case you need to sign someone by the deadline. But keeping 6.5 mil? Excessive, and I think the accusation that the Eagles were cheap was definitely justified.

This year, the Eagles had 2.96 mil added to the 2007 cap number because of LTBE incentives that were not reached in 2006.

Next year, they probably get the 4 mil in Reno's contract added to the 2008 cap number.

Does this alone make them cheap? Not in my mind but it's part of the picture. Add to it that they go after the Jabar Gaffneys of the NFL and try to convince themselves they are big signings...

Add to it their horrible negotiations with their own players...of recent years Westbrook, LJ.

They never offered Hood a contract. Said he wanted to be a starter on another team. Trouble is, he never really said that. He probably would have stayed if they gave him a nice contract. They just never offered.

Same with Garthia. They never offered him a contract either. And he said he would take a backup role.

It's the combination of all the things that makes them friggin cheap.

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It's been quite a while since I heard anything about the Gold Standard. The only time it's mentioned anymore is by fans who want to rub the team's face in it.

And?

People keep going after Bush with the Mission Accomplished thing. And that was a long time ago as well. But just as wrong.

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Yeah, I know it gets confusing, but it is definitely LTBE.

If a team has extra cap room late in the season, they add an unreachable incentive as a bonus in a players contract and call it "Likely to be earned" The money counts toward that years cap. It's unreachable, so they never actually have to pay the player, but it still counts toward the cap, so you use up all the money for that year... technically.

In the 2005 season, there was a LTBE incentive in Rock Cartwrights contract of around 1.1 mil. It counted toward 2005 cap. He didn't reach the incentive. They didn't actually pay him. That 1.1 mil was added to the 2006 cap number.

That same 2005 season, the Eagles added a 6.5 million LTBE to Jack Brewer's contract late in the season. Same thing. He didn't reach the incentive, they didn't actually pay him, and that 6.5 million was ADDED to the 2006 cap.

Now the thing is, the Eagles had done this for multiple years in a row, so they typically were below the cap in ACTUAL DOLLARS SPENT. Hence, the "Eagles are cheap" comments.

I actually think it's smart to keep around 1million in cap, just in case you need to sign someone by the deadline. But keeping 6.5 mil? Excessive, and I think the accusation that the Eagles were cheap was definitely justified.

This year, the Eagles had 2.96 mil added to the 2007 cap number because of LTBE incentives that were not reached in 2006.

Next year, they probably get the 4 mil in Reno's contract added to the 2008 cap number.

Does this alone make them cheap? Not in my mind but it's part of the picture. Add to it that they go after the Jabar Gaffneys of the NFL and try to convince themselves they are big signings...

Add to it their horrible negotiations with their own players...of recent years Westbrook, LJ.

They never offered Hood a contract. Said he wanted to be a starter on another team. Trouble is, he never really said that. He probably would have stayed if they gave him a nice contract. They just never offered.

Same with Garthia. They never offered him a contract either. And he said he would take a backup role.

It's the combination of all the things that makes them friggin cheap.

Well put. How does UTBE work than?

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UTBE is similar.

The UTBE incentive does not count against the current year's cap. It only gets paid when it is met, and then it would be subtracted from the next year's salary cap figure.

and its a wonder why people distrust lawyers. who else comes up with all the craziness that is in the players contracts and the union rules and all that?

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Each team has a different way of dealing with the cap . The skins use different ways to extend the pro rated contracts and live in cash over the cap other teams a a little more shady .... I do think there is something strange going on with some teams like the Eagles paying players twice and the Packers having their players pay each other bonuses ....

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Interesting read Doc, nice work.

The Eagle let Garcia go because they knew they had a QB controversy on their hands. They were forced to choose between he and McNabb.

With plenty of cap space at hand, cheap seems the only explanation for not attempting to keep players like Stallworth and Hood.

Eagle fans were thrilled when Mahe was cut. They were twice as thrilled to see him return. Some thought he was worth $4 mil!:laugh:

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The Eagle let Garcia go because they knew they had a QB controversy on their hands. They were forced to choose between he and McNabb.

100% correct.

With plenty of cap space at hand, cheap seems the only explanation for not attempting to keep players like Stallworth and Hood.

If Hood wanted starter money, I could see them not wanting to pay him that because he definitely didn't play like a starter when given the chance last year. Stallworth, in hindsight, was a personnel mistake, not a financial one in my opinion. They believed he couldn't remain healthy, and they also believed that Brown would continue his development, along with Avant & Baskett. Stallworth has remained healthy, although his production isn't that great, but that's probably b/c he's Brady's third option behind Moss and Welker.

In my opinion, they're not cheap. They won't pay players over 30 a lot of money, and they won't normally chase after big FAs (A. Samuel, Clements, etc.) They have had some ignominious draft picks, as well as pisspoor FA selections (Howard, Gaffney, Schoebel, etc.). Losing older, veteran players and assuming you can fill those through draft picks only, has led to a weak secondary, no talent in the return game, and continued performance by #2-3 level wide receivers. I truly believe however, the main mistake they've made, and it was out of pure stubbornness and the inability of a McNabb to be a professional, is how they handled TO. Can't lose the best WR in the NFL due to personality issues - just BS.

Eagle fans were thrilled when Mahe was cut. They were twice as thrilled to see him return. Some thought he was worth $4 mil!:laugh:

If that $4 mil had been spent before the season started, they would have won the Green Bay game. It is mind boggling that they haven't gotten someone better. Freakin WB has 25-30 touches a game, and still has to jog out on the field with 2 minutes to go to try and pull off a miracle return to give the team a chance to win.

PF

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