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Secularism.


Baculus

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After reading Chuck Norris's comments regarding Secularism, I started to ponder a bit on this subject. Thus, I wanted to ask for other folk's opinions on the subject of secularism, if you support or oppose it, and the reasoning for your perspective.

Personally, I believe secularism is extremely important and I do not support theocratic forms of government, which I believe are often anti-democratic. I also believe that secularism also helps to PROTECT religious freedoms, since a state mandated church may threaten individual's choice of worship.

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A five syllable word, Baculus? Five syllables?

I don't know that ES can handle that. Over in the tailgate, half the rats are fleeing the ship with 4-2 record. We've got twice as many victories as losses and their abandoning the season. That's not even fairweather... I don't know what that is.

And you expect people to deal with a concept that takes five syllables to pronounce? You got to be kidding me.

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A five syllable word, Baculus? Five syllables?

I don't know that ES can handle that. Over in the tailgate, half the rats are fleeing the ship with 4-2 record. We've got twice as many victories as losses and their abandoning the season. That's not even fairweather... I don't know what that is.

And you expect people to deal with a concept that takes five syllables to pronounce? You got to be kidding me.

Isn't it ironic how many syllables monosyllabic has?

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A five syllable word, Baculus? Five syllables?

I don't know that ES can handle that. Over in the tailgate, half the rats are fleeing the ship with 4-2 record. We've got twice as many victories as losses and their abandoning the season. That's not even fairweather... I don't know what that is.

And you expect people to deal with a concept that takes five syllables to pronounce? You got to be kidding me.

EDIT: OK I looked it up. I'm wrong.

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Secularism is the basis for a free society.

In a theocratic society, like you mentioned, there is little to no room for compromise. And compromise is the only way you can properly run a representative republic.

(Not to mention that we should be questioning the sanity of people who talk to imaginary sky-gods, not revere them as "People of Faith.")

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Well, it doesn't make for much of a debate if we all agree upon it! Haha.

I thought there were a few folks on here that didn't have a high opinion of the subject matter, at least some folks on the Right. Neverless, good replies so far.

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Religious tolerance and forced secularism can not coexist. It is not tolerant for me to tell Jews that their religion is so disgusting to me that I feel offended at simply being exposed to it's symbols in a public place. It is not tolerant for me to tell Muslims that their beliefs are so unwelcome that they must stick purely to predesignated areas so that I don't accidently encounter their symbols which I find offensive to lay eyes on.

Secularism is about the logic behind lawmaking. Theocracy fails a mixed society because "my God says so" doesn't justify anything in the eyes of those that don't beleive in you God. The recent hijacking of "secularism" in the states by bigots is disturbing and needs to be challenged and defeated.

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Religion, outside of protecting the freedom of it, should never mix with politics in my opinion. It would be nice if just one debate -- either GOP or Dem -- would be free of questions about faith and evolution. What do either have to do with being a good president?

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Next thread.... "Freedom, is it good or bad?"

I think we actually take seculariism for granted, in the sense that "Well, of course it is good!" Case in point, the Chuck Norris comment that inspired me to start the thread. He appears to oppose secularism, and I assume he has his adherents.

And look at the debate in Turkey: It is a huge part of Turkish society, and considering they live near a theocratic region (as well as having a religious majority that tends to have a theocratic form of government), the subject of secularlism and separation of Chruch and State is a hotbed of discussion.

I guess we also have to remember that separation of Chruch and State is a part of secularism, and I know that is often hotly discussed here in the U.S.

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Religious tolerance and forced secularism can not coexist. It is not tolerant for me to tell Jews that their religion is so disgusting to me that I feel offended at simply being exposed to it's symbols in a public place. It is not tolerant for me to tell Muslims that their beliefs are so unwelcome that they must stick purely to predesignated areas so that I don't accidently encounter their symbols which I find offensive to lay eyes on.

Secularism is about the logic behind lawmaking. Theocracy fails a mixed society because "my God says so" doesn't justify anything in the eyes of those that don't beleive in you God. The recent hijacking of "secularism" in the states by bigots is disturbing and needs to be challenged and defeated.

That is an interesting viewpoint.

Could you clarify this point: "The recent hijacking of "secularism" in the states by bigots is disturbing and needs to be challenged and defeated."

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That is an interesting viewpoint.

Could you clarify this point: "The recent hijacking of "secularism" in the states by bigots is disturbing and needs to be challenged and defeated."

I'm talking about the recent wave of lawsuits seeking to remove any and all mention of religion from public spaces. They go too far and if you "follow the money" to some extent and see which groups are supporting and celebrating each step you come across intolerant atheist movements.

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I'm talking about the recent wave of lawsuits seeking to remove any and all mention of religion from public spaces. They go too far and if you "follow the money" to some extent and see which groups are supporting and celebrating each step you come across intolerant atheist movements.

Ah, OK - I see your point, and I can agree with your sentiment. I do not think secularism means we have to become an athetistic society.

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I think theres a fine middle point between the 2 youre talking about. I agree with Destino that there is alot of forced secularism on us, but also forced religion. Of course, I do ask myself why it wasnt such a problem in the past. I mean, is it because America is becoming more and more PC, changing view points, or what. I dunno.

I dont go around looking for non Christians and tell them they better like my Christmas tree, but I also expect someone to never tell me my Christmas lights offend them. Will that ever happen? Maybe some day. Man, it must be getting close to Christmas.

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A five syllable word, Baculus? Five syllables?

I don't know that ES can handle that. Over in the tailgate, half the rats are fleeing the ship with 4-2 record. We've got twice as many victories as losses and their abandoning the season. That's not even fairweather... I don't know what that is.

And you expect people to deal with a concept that takes five syllables to pronounce? You got to be kidding me.

4-2? We're 4-3. Didn't you see who's on the schedule next week?

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I disagree. I believe secularism by its very nature is atheistic or at the least agnostic.

I disagree.

Take the example of pre-game ceremonies before a high school football game. Not having a Christian prayer is not anti-religion, it's recognising in a diverse society that such matters are best kept private to avoid favoring one religion or belief system over another.

E pluribus unum.

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I disagree. I believe secularism by its very nature is atheistic or at the least agnostic.

Many secularists are atheists or agnostic: That may be true. But most Western societies are considered to be secularist societies, and we have yet to see a large anti-religious expunging that you saw in the Soviet Union or China. I think part of the problem has to do with people's sensitivities and what's perceived as an attack on religion, or religion encroaching into the public life.

You have to remember, again, that secularism includes the separation of Church and State: That does not mean the separation of the citizens from the Church.

A person in a secular society can easily have faith and go to church: Just don't expect to have your religious party or church running the government.

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