Zeppelin Kicks *****

[ntotoro]

they arent relevant as far as my friends and i are concerned and have never been. dinosaur shlock rock does nothing for today's music in my opinion. and just because they arent the same type of music doesnt mean you cant compare them for impact. skynyrd made good guitar driven rock n roll. calling them southern rock is just a label.

depeche mode and U2? now who is reaching? that is solely your opinion and any band that i listen to that says they are influenced by metallica sure doesnt mention depeche mode in the same breath.

the armageddon thing was their ONLY #1 song so that shows you how much they looked for that. if that is the ONLY song they have that is co-written then you arent winning anything there with me. they probably had an agenda when they used her.

overrated? :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

sure he is..I am not even going to try and talk to you about that one.

It's not they're only song written or co-written by someone else. Go look at their liner notes or sheet music. You'll see what I mean. I only brought up that one tune as an example because it was popular.

Clapton is as overrated as the day is long. Is that my opinion? Sure. I also said he was relevant because a lot of people do still like him. I'm not debating his relevancy.

I don't care whether Zeppelin is relevant to your friends. That's fine, but state it from the very beginning. Don't confuse your personal opinion with Rock history. All the mentioned bands are relevant in one way or another. Bringing them up doesn't make Zeppelin more or less so.

No, it's not my opinion that some of these young kids like those other bands. Open a guitar magazine and read who influences a lot of these guys. You might be surprised, but don't be shocked if you read someone claim Metallica as well as U2 or even sometimes Air Supply & Toto, in the case of the guy from Hoobastank.

I don't like them and I don't know how history will view them, but I'm using him as an example.

[Bang]

Yah I'm pretty sure that Paige's contract with Allister Crowley and the debil expired in 1981 or so.

.....

well, the CD they put out of Led Zeppelin music played live with full orchestration and everything was REALLY good.

"No QUarter" I believe it was... that is a terrific CD and probably the best live recording of any of those guys I've ever heard.

The studio effort they put out after that was dreck.

~Bang

[ntotoro]

by who? who is voting them that? record execs who are still making money of the SAME OL CRAP DVDs that just keep rehashing the same bull**** music over and over.

you should take your own advice when it comes to YOUR OPINON not being fact. you seem to think that i am just all spaced out over here saying "you know, zeppelin is really irrelevant." once again you are being ignorant and just trying to make it like i am flying off the handle or coming sideways with my opinion. why dont you try to listen to what i have to say instead of just brushing it off and not paying attention. your opinion doesnt mean **** to me either but i am not insulting you by saying you dont know what youre tlaking about.

They put out DVD's. That means someone wants them. Regardless whether it's marketing or someone banging down the doors to get it, people want it and people buy it. That's not opinion.

I'm not trying to win you over with my opinion, just telling you not to confuse your own opinion with how Rock history views things.

[BigMike619]

Uh,, you state Aerosmith makes another band look like an over hyped machine?

Seriously,, is there a bigger group of whores in music today?

AC/DC?

Oh yeah,, 35 years worth of teenage sex and drinking songs,, all the same.

At least Zeppelin had some artistry. And at least they did manage to write a few songs that didn't deal with getting 15 yr old guys giggling over sexual double entendres and pumping their fists over the prospect of getting stoned.

Maybe it's just me, but I expect bands to evolve. Probably why I don't much like Metallica either.. .oooo angerangerANGER! Why is Hetfield STILL so angry?

It rings hollow after so many years.

To each their own, I'd guess. But if you're running the music at the party, I'd bet i'd be tired of it in about 5 minutes by the sound of it.

As to new Zeppelin music... meh. I heard the last time Page and Plant tried to make a CD of new music... it was plum friggin AWFUL. 2 spins in my cd player is all it has gotten in the 10 or so years since it came out. The first one on the day i bought it... the next one about 5 years later to see if it was as bad as I thought it was.

I was right.

~Bang

so if artistry is what is most important then KISS has to be labeled as one of the greatest too then right?

And if you read my earlier posts I said the albums after the Metallica Black album sucked.

Aerosmith is a big ol whore machine NOW sure. But in the 70s and 80s they put out great music.

AC/DC has fallen off sure, but they still put out DVDs and CDs that sell a bunch and their tours still sell out too. so I think that counters the other arguments.

If anyone puts a Zeppelin CD on at a party I am having it goes right off and they get the look like they are out of their minds..

[BigMike619]

They put out DVD's. That means someone wants them. Regardless whether it's marketing or someone banging down the doors to get it, people want it and people buy it. That's not opinion.

I'm not trying to win you over with my opinion, just telling you not to confuse your own opinion with how Rock history views things.

rock history? seriously? you think that some old dinosaurs sitting up in a room makes it history? there is already debate on if zep or sabbath was the greatest and some people dont even think either was.

just because people buy the DVDs doesnt mean its relevant. people lose their old crap and the media machine just tries to push crap like "digitally remastered" and stuff like that.

[zoony]

BigMike... I'm with you on Led Zeppelin, and I've taken plenty of **** on this board who act like you have just defiled the Virgin Mary when you say anything bad about them.

To me, Led Zeppelin personifies everything that is wrong with Rock & Roll music, and subsequently what things like punk & alternative rebelled against. Corporate greed, hi-jacking riffs, no soul, the big tours to sold out venues filled with mindless frat dorks holding up lighters, etc. Led Zeppelin spawned an entire decade of the most embarassing rock & roll in history. Poison, Skid Row, Warrant, Whitesnake, etc. It's all garbage.

Like I said, they wrote some catchy songs... and they were talented musicians. I'll listen to a song or two, no problem.

But if you want to see someone laying it on the line, pouring their heart into their art form for all the right reasons... check out someone like Jimi Hendrix.

But that's just me. And for all of you ready to quote this post and argue with me, save your breath.

[Bliz]

they arent relevant as far as my friends and i are concerned and have never been. dinosaur shlock rock does nothing for today's music in my opinion.

Sounds more like a problem of you and your friends. Or maybe you're just mis-using the word "relevant." They are unarguably one of the top 10 (and I would say top 5) most significant and influential bands of the last 50 years. Their albums continue to sell and get airplay, bands continue to cover their songs (and even Puff Daddy used a Led Zeppelin riff for a pretty popular song maybe 5 years ago?).

"[Led Zeppelin's] influence is so pervasive, it's impossible to play rock n' roll without stealing from them."

---Billy Corgan

[Mickalino]

a little off topic, but shouldn't there be only 3 asterisks in the Subject line,

instead of 5 ?

I'm sittin here tryin to think of what relevant word has 5 letters in it.

Oh no, I said "relevant" :doh:

[thehogs]

The Clapton thing...I agree with the 'overrated'. Most people assume when we use that word we mean he's a lousy guitar player which is a ludicrous thing to say. However, Clapton came along at a time when British hard rythm'n'blues music was at its height and he was so obviously in love with blues music, his knowledge as well as technical abilty that he became the focal point, no doubt about that. The stuff though about 'Clapton is God' (and I'm just old enough to remember people writing that on walls)...nah, that IS overrating him.

Within blues music, sure you could put him in there with the great blues guitar players but as the point was trying to be made, the idea that he is 'the greatest', Ali style, of all guitar players...nope, cant go with that.

Reminds me of my school days when I was convinced Blackmore was the man (which of course he is! )

[BigMike619]

Sounds more like a problem of you and your friends. Or maybe you're just mis-using the word "relevant." They are unarguably one of the top 10 (and I would say top 5) most significant and influential bands of the last 50 years. Their albums continue to sell and get airplay, bands continue to cover their songs (and even Puff Daddy used a Led Zeppelin riff for a pretty popular song maybe 5 years ago?).

"[Led Zeppelin's] influence is so pervasive, it's impossible to play rock n' roll without stealing from them."

---Billy Corgan

you just quoted billy corgan and puff daddy as a defense for zeppelin. sounds to me like YOU shouldnt worry about any problems that me and my friends have and try to come back with something a little more legit then that.

[BigMike619]

BigMike... I'm with you on Led Zeppelin, and I've taken plenty of **** on this board who act like you have just defiled the Virgin Mary when you say anything bad about them.

To me, Led Zeppelin personifies everything that is wrong with Rock & Roll music, and subsequently what things like punk & alternative rebelled against. Corporate greed, hi-jacking riffs, no soul, the big tours to sold out venues filled with mindless frat dorks holding up lighters, etc. Led Zeppelin spawned an entire decade of the most embarassing rock & roll in history. Poison, Skid Row, Warrant, Whitesnake, etc. It's all garbage.

Like I said, they wrote some catchy songs... and they were talented musicians. I'll listen to a song or two, no problem.

But if you want to see someone laying it on the line, pouring their heart into their art form for all the right reasons... check out someone like Jimi Hendrix.

But that's just me. And for all of you ready to quote this post and argue with me, save your breath.

:applause: :applause: :applause: :notworthy :notworthy :notworthy

[BigMike619]

The Clapton thing...I agree with the 'overrated'. Most people assume when we use that word we mean he's a lousy guitar player which is a ludicrous thing to say. However, Clapton came along at a time when British hard rythm'n'blues music was at its height and he was so obviously in love with blues music, his knowledge as well as technical abilty that he became the focal point, no doubt about that. The stuff though about 'Clapton is God' (and I'm just old enough to remember people writing that on walls)...nah, that IS overrating him.

Within blues music, sure you could put him in there with the great blues guitar players but as the point was trying to be made, the idea that he is 'the greatest', Ali style, of all guitar players...nope, cant go with that.

Reminds me of my school days when I was convinced Blackmore was the man (which of course he is! )

well to use ntotoro's theory, if people are writing it, it must be true and make him God. because people are still buying zeppelin CDs and DVDs so they must be the greatest..

[rincewind]

BigMike... I'm with you on Led Zeppelin, and I've taken plenty of **** on this board who act like you have just defiled the Virgin Mary when you say anything bad about them.

To me, Led Zeppelin personifies everything that is wrong with Rock & Roll music, and subsequently what things like punk & alternative rebelled against. Corporate greed, hi-jacking riffs, no soul, the big tours to sold out venues filled with mindless frat dorks holding up lighters, etc. Led Zeppelin spawned an entire decade of the most embarassing rock & roll in history. Poison, Skid Row, Warrant, Whitesnake, etc. It's all garbage.

Like I said, they wrote some catchy songs... and they were talented musicians. I'll listen to a song or two, no problem.

But if you want to see someone laying it on the line, pouring their heart into their art form for all the right reasons... check out someone like Jimi Hendrix.

But that's just me. And for all of you ready to quote this post and argue with me, save your breath.

Seems the debate is whether or not they're relevent. You kind of said that they are - don't matter if you like them or not - that has nothing to do with relevence.

[Bliz]

To me, Led Zeppelin personifies everything that is wrong with Rock & Roll music, and subsequently what things like punk & alternative rebelled against. Corporate greed, hi-jacking riffs, no soul, the big tours to sold out venues filled with mindless frat dorks holding up lighters, etc. Led Zeppelin spawned an entire decade of the most embarassing rock & roll in history. Poison, Skid Row, Warrant, Whitesnake, etc. It's all garbage.

Corporate greed? You don't know what the heck you're talking about. Zeppelin rarely granted interviews, shilled out for radio or anything like that. They were notorious for it. They also were also a severely rebellious band, given their contemporaries and immediate predecessors. Even today you don't hear their stuff used for advertising. Alternative rebelled against the hair-metal party all day style over substance high-living bs. Led Zeppelin was none of that crap. Punk...changes by the decade, I guess.

I'm not even sure what hi-jacking riffs means. If it means amazing guitar work, sure. If you're suggesting they stole from, or copied others...I just don't see it. They were a complete original. As for hair metal bands all trying to copy Zeppelin, I hardly see how that's their fault.

They personified everything that was great about rock n' roll - supremely talented musicians... who weren't afraid to actually PLAY THEIR FREAKIN' INSTRUMENTS, take chances and push boundaries.

[BigMike619]

Seems the debate is whether or not they're relevent. You kind of said that they are - don't matter if you like them or not - that has nothing to do with relevence.

I dont see how because they are still being programmed on the radio by PD's who are old and irrelevant themselves..

[Bliz]

you just quoted billy corgan and puff daddy as a defense for zeppelin. sounds to me like YOU shouldnt worry about any problems that me and my friends have and try to come back with something a little more legit then that.

You keep going back and forth. You said they aren't relevant, well, there's two people who have been relevant as of late. Didn't claim they were my favorite bands. (One of my favorites, Robert Randolph, for example, frequently covers Zeppelin songs at his concerts). Frankly I could give a **** who you think is cool, and what you think of the bands I like. But if we're defining "relevance" in any kind of rational way, they are clearly still relevant.

[rincewind]

I dont see how because they are still being programmed on the radio by PD's who are old and irrelevant themselves..

There are still A LOT of bands that are heavily influenced by Zep. Just because you don't like those bands doesn't make it any less true. I could give a crap about record releases, sales, or airplay. I judge relevence by how many people are influenced by the act - and Zep is still very influential.

[rincewind]

You keep going back and forth. You said they aren't relevant, well, there's two people who have been relevant as of late. Didn't claim they were my favorite bands. (One of my favorites, Robert Randolph, for example, frequently covers Zeppelin songs at his concerts). Frankly I could give a **** who you think is cool, and what you think of the bands I like. But if we're defining "relevance" in any kind of rational way, they are clearly still relevant.

And Robert Randolph kicks ASS**!!!!

[thehogs]

If you're suggesting they stole from, or copied others...I just don't see it. They were a complete original.

:doh:

I would love to say they were but 'seek and you shall find' my friend the truth of a lot of Zeps 'original' stuff. Jeez, even Zep I was basically a Yardbirds album plus ideas nicked from the 'Truth' album Page had just worked on with Jeff Beck before the first Zep album came out! As for the folk songs/Black Mountain Side - all taken from other people.

[BigMike619]

You keep going back and forth. You said they aren't relevant, well, there's two people who have been relevant as of late. Didn't claim they were my favorite bands. (One of my favorites, Robert Randolph, for example, frequently covers Zeppelin songs at his concerts). Frankly I could give a **** who you think is cool, and what you think of the bands I like. But if we're defining "relevance" in any kind of rational way, they are clearly still relevant.

I am not even talking to you dude, so why dont you calm down a bit. I am debating with ntotoro and if we are going back and forth then that is what it is.

you are really worked up and taking this too personally to be open to a debate. maybe you should take a deep breath and realize that nobody in here is attacking you or your family and just let go of the hostility.

[CandaceM23]

I wasn't around back in the day when LZ was in their prime .... I remember my dad listening to them when I was young, but they were not one of those bands that my dad constantly listened to and that I learned to appreciate at a young age (CCR, The Police, Fleetwood Mac).

Now, I do appreciate their music and listen to them on a fairly regular basis. Not everyone enjoys them (as seen in this thread), but they're still incredibly popular and have a huge following.

Taken from Wiki:

On September 12, 2007, it was confirmed during a press conference by promoter Harvey Goldsmith that the surviving members of Led Zeppelin will reunite in aid of the Ahmet Ertegun education fund for a show at the O2 Arena in London on 26 November 2007, with Jason Bonham filling in on drums. Tickets were made available via a lottery system through Ahmettribute.com, costing £125 / $250. The website exceeded its bandwidth allowance and crashed almost immediately following the announcement, with the promoter predicting that the gig will cause the "largest demand for one show in history", due to the ticket request site receiving 120 million hits, with 25 million people registering for 20,000 available tickets.

[BigMike619]

There are still A LOT of bands that are heavily influenced by Zep. Just because you don't like those bands doesn't make it any less true. I could give a crap about record releases, sales, or airplay. I judge relevence by how many people are influenced by the act - and Zep is still very influential.

Metallica is right up there then too. Zep is no greater then any band that came after them no matter how much people try to push them.

[ixcuincle]

I was actually having a discussion about this in World of Warcraft yesterday and someone told me that I should listen to more Zeppelin. We all know Stairway is a legendary song but I haven't heard to any Zeppelin other than that , my playlist has 2 other songs by them (Rock and Roll , Fool in the Rain). Can anyone suggest any more songs that I might obtain?

PS : Never was a big Metallica guy , I like Sandman like every Hokie should , but not a big fan of the rest of their songs.

[rincewind]

Metallica is right up there then too. Zep is no greater then any band that came after them no matter how much people try to push them.

Didn't say they were great - just relevent and influential.

Personally - I used to really like them, but now I'm in the 'one or two songs and then on to something else' crowd. Don't think I have one Zeppelin song on my Ipod right now.

[Bliz]

I am not even talking to you dude, so why dont you calm down a bit. I am debating with ntotoro and if we are going back and forth then that is what it is.

you are really worked up and taking this too personally to be open to a debate. maybe you should take a deep breath and realize that nobody in here is attacking you or your family and just let go of the hostility.

nah...I prefer to stay (and not taking it personally, although I can see how my last post looked that way).

But let me ask you this, what does it mean to be relevant? Right now this is just a yes they are no they're not argument, which doesn't really get anywhere. Others in this thread have tried to base it on enduring popularity based on radio play or dvd sales, influence of others, etc. and your response is to attack the validity of radio play (very valid, imo), sales numbers (less valid), or the quality of the bands they supposedly influenced (not at all valid).

So what does it mean to be relevant?