KC Joyners QB over/under rated

[TonyRomoProBowl]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/insider/columns/story?columnist=joyner_kc&id=2947314

Overrated Quarterbacks

Brett Favre

Many of Favre's 2006 metrics were among the worst in the league. His 6.2 YPA put him in the company of Charlie Frye and Jason Campbell. His total of 18 bad decisions was tied for the fourth-most in the league, and his 62 combined interceptions and near interceptions was easily the most in the NFL, even surpassing the much-maligned Rex Grossman. Favre simply isn't anywhere near the quarterback he was even just three years ago.

Underrated Quarterbacks

Tony Romo sits to pee: Romo sits to pee was like Rivers in that his end-of-season performance tailed off, but his reputation seemed to take a much bigger hit than Rivers. This shouldn't have been the case, as Romo sits to pee's end-of-season metrics were still among the best in the NFL. His 8.4 YPA was the highest in that category. Romo sits to pee also had the second-highest success percentage and the highest SYPA rating.

EDIT: I took Campbell off the subject title. I had no idea that it would cause that much trouble......jeeez, did i not just read a thread about Romo sits to pee saying "Score" when asked what is off. was designed to do...but yet, this thread, (which is on par with a bunch of others about KC Joyner and his over/under rankings and/or chat wraps) gets blasted for trolling. I am truley sorry to all that i may have offended byu posting the thread with Campbell in the title!

[tr1]

Please, can you give it a better try when you troll?

This one is too obvious.

[TonyRomoProBowl]

Please, can you give it a better try when you troll?

This one is too obvious.

I've been around a while now, and i have participated in many debates. I know what I am doing here ok...and if you do not like articles or Threads about Romo sits to pee or Dallas.....why do you post them so much? Every single position that KC has done his over/under rated on and/or every other chat wrap he has is posted....why would this one be any different?

[pointyfootball]

why would this one be any different?

Because it paints JC in a negative light and TR in a positive light. That's in direct violation of Rule 7.3.5.6a (para 4).

[bubba9497]

I've been around a while now, and i have participated in many debates. I know what I am doing here ok...and if you do not like articles or Threads about Romo sits to pee or Dallas.....why do you post them so much? Every single position that KC has done his over/under rated on and/or every other chat wrap he has is posted....why would this one be any different?

1. you don't know what your doing, most of the time.... but you DO know that you're trolling this time

2. you included Campbell in the title only to get Skins fans to look, but no real Campbell info in your post.... that's why it's trolling

3. tr1 is right, your intentions are obvious

4. So I assume your posting this means you agree with him about Newman, Flozell, Roy Williams, Henry, Hamlin all being overrated and not very good

[Goaldeje]

Rivers in December was average, to say the least. Here are his QB ratings for the month:

Dec 3 @ BUF W 24-21 85.4

Dec 10 DEN W 48-20 136.0

Dec 17 KAN W 20-9 12.4

Dec 24 @ SEA W 20-17 77.2

Dec 31 ARI W 27-20 117.2

Romo sits to pee's December was pretty bad:

Dec 3 @ NYG W 23-20 58.1

Dec 10 NOR L 17-42 58.8

Dec 16 @ ATL W 38-28 113.9

Dec 25 PHI L 7-23 45.5

Dec 31 DET L 31-39 111.6

Both QB's were up and down; Rivers' highest point was much higher than Romo sits to pee's, but his lowest was much lower.

If you take out both players best and worst performances in the month of December (which I grant you is completely arbitrary), then I think most would agree that Rivers performed much better.

Additionally, if we consider the average QB rating to be around 75-80, in the month of December, Rivers had only 1 performance below the average. The rest of his games he was at or above the average. Romo sits to pee had three below-average games.

With Rivers, we can easily say his one bad game dragged down his 4 good, or above-average games. With Romo sits to pee, we can easily say that his two good games served only to pull up his three poor games.

So to Joyner's question, why doesn't Rivers get more blame? I'm thinking it has to do with the 3rd column in the above stats: W&L. Romo sits to pee lost three, Rivers won all 5.

I don't think Joyner's analysis is necessarily on target here to conclude. He doesn't mention the winning vs. losing, which is kind of the bottom line. And he doesn't go very in depth.

I would rather have Rivers than Romo sits to pee, bottom line.

[Goaldeje]

And yeah, gotta go with Bubba on this one. Pretty lame with the Campbell mention in the title. Go with what the article is about, it gives you more credibility.

[ouvan59]

Tony Romo sits to pee: Romo sits to pee was like Rivers in that his end-of-season performance tailed off, but his reputation seemed to take a much bigger hit than Rivers. This shouldn't have been the case, as Romo sits to pee's end-of-season metrics were still among the best in the NFL. His 8.4 YPA was the highest in that category. Romo sits to pee also had the second-highest success percentage and the highest SYPA rating.

Here is a perfect example of why Joyner's metrics are so flawed. He doesn't look at the whole picture. Over the last month of the season he threw 61% of his interceptions (6-8 TD/Int ratio), he committed 78% (7) of his fumbles and he went 2-3 (not all on him). Rivers also struggled down the stretch but while he wasn't nearly as effective as he had been earlier in the year he didn't hurt the team. He threw only 3 picks over the last month and fumbled 4 times. His 7-3 TD/Int ratio was pretty much what he did all year. Plus his team went undefeated (not all on him). But hey Romo sits to pee had 8.4 YPA. Nevermind that he turned the ball over like nobody's business, his "metrics" were still good.

[DWinzit]

I can't tell you how sick I am of the term "metrics". Over the past six months the term has been discussed and argued in many way too threads. :doh:

Maybe it's just the word because it reminds me of school when they forced the metric system down our throats.

[bubba9497]

Tony Romo sits to pee: Romo sits to pee was like Rivers in that his end-of-season performance tailed off, but his reputation seemed to take a much bigger hit than Rivers. This shouldn't have been the case

so basically he's underrated because his drop off was criticized more than Rivers.....

not really anything eles

[bubba9497]

Maybe it's just the word because it reminds me of school when they forced the metric system down our throats.

drink a liter of beer, relax and prop your feet up a meter or so

[No_Pressure]

So KC Joyner's metrics are only true when he says Tony Romo sits to pee is underrated, and not when he says Roy Williams and Terrence Newman are overrated and the Redskins offensive line is one of the best in the league?

[pointyfootball]

To be fair, though, for last year:

SD Def >> Dallas Def

SD OL >> Dallas OL

SD RB >>>Dallas RB

SD TE > Dallas TE

Dallas WR >> SD

I think the jury is still out on both of them, although Rivers impressed me with his drive to set up a field goal attempt against the Pats in the playoffs. I just think the LT really helps him look really good. Kind of the same effect that Bettis/Parker had for Rothlisberger two years ago.

[DWinzit]

drink a liter of beer, relax and prop your feet up a meter or so

That'll do it! You ought to be a life coach.

[BMahoney]

Doesn't underrated usually mean the player is off the radar, and far better than everyone expects. Romo sits to pee is in the limelight now and everyone is predicting Dallas to go far and that Romo sits to pee will lead them their, so he would pretty much have to be better than Peyton Manning to be considered underrated at this point in time. Just another joke article by some idiot, who knows nothing about football.

[JoeSkins]

I'll say it in every link to a Joyner article until the day I die. He's an accountant, not a football guy, and his opinion, whether it's what you want to hear or not, is pretty useless.

[TonyRomoProBowl]

1. you don't know what your doing, most of the time.... but you DO know that you're trolling this time

no, i do not think i am trolling at all.......and you post KC's chats and over/under rated all the time. You are in love with him more then anyone, yet somehow this was not posted, so i did it.

2. you included Campbell in the title only to get Skins fans to look, but no real Campbell info in your post.... that's why it's trolling

i included it in the title, cause it was true...was he not mentioned? If he was on the list of either under or over rated, then i would not have...but since he was mentioned, i put it in the title....its a fact that he was mentioned.......do you want me to take that out of the title of my thread???

3. tr1 is right, your intentions are obvious

thats your opinion and his. I feel different. So when others call TR1 a troll, does that make it true?? I dont think so...because you think it, or Tr1 thinks it....dosnt make it so!!

4. So I assume your posting this means you agree with him about Newman, Flozell, Roy Williams, Henry, Hamlin all being overrated and not very good

I think Flozell had a bad year, due to injuries....I think Newman is a very good corner. Roy is a solid SS and Henry sucks. Hamlin like i said is an upgrade...albiet he is replacing a guy that was "horrible" last year....

What about you? Do you agree with KC that Campbell's YPA is "that bad" i mean one of the worst in the league with Frye and Farve??

[Riggo#44]

What about you? Do you agree with KC that Campbell's YPA is "that bad" i mean one of the worst in the league with Frye and Farve??

So you are propping Romo sits to pee up by comparing him to a player that has been in the league half the time? Congrats!

[taylorcoreskin]

Because it paints JC in a negative light and TR in a positive light. That's in direct violation of Rule 7.3.5.6a (para 4).

:rotflmao:

I'm not listening! I'm not listening! - Conan O'Brien advanced spoiler proof technology

[TonyRomoProBowl]

So you are propping Romo sits to pee up by comparing him to a player that has been in the league half the time? Congrats!

good try, they both just last season had thier first taste of starting. This is Romo sits to pee's first ever TC with the #1's.....He was undrafted and a practice squad player for 1 year and #3 another....Campbell was a 1st round pick. If Brunell hadn't gone to the Chitter...Campbell would have been on the bench for the whole season and possible this season. (atleast 2 seasons behind Brunell).....for a first round pick, comparred to a undrafted FA.....you would think that Campbell would have an edge......

[SkinsFTW]

Favre will be a first ballot HOFer, and he was never very good. He was coached for several years by Holmgren and his minions but besides those years Favre has been just a guy who plays hard and makes a lot of dumb mistakes. He has put up great numbers with average receivers, but he was never elite like Marino or Elway.

Which brings me to a new Troy Aikman thread I need to start. That dude went to the Pro Bowl in years where he truely sucked. Brunell in 05 outshines every single Aikman year.

[TonyRomoProBowl]

Favre will be a first ballot HOFer, and he was never very good. He was coached for several years by Holmgren and his minions but besides those years Favre hasn't been just a guy who plays hard. He has put up great numbers with average receivers, but he was never elite.

Which brings me to a new Troy Aikman thread I need to start. That dude went to the Pro Bowl in years where he truely sucked. Brunell in 05 outshines every single Aikman year.

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: pricless!!!!!!!!

[Cdowwe]

Romo sits to pee underrated? He has to be the most overrated QB for how little he has done.

[Riggo#44]

for a first round pick, comparred to a undrafted FA.....you would think that Campbell would have an edge......

He does!! In his second year, he started 7 games. His third he is going into camp as the undsiputed starter. Romo sits to pee started his 1st game in his 4th year and and his 1st Training Camp as the starter in his 5th year. Is that concept SO difficult for you to comprehend?!

And if Bledsoe hadn't sucked so bad, Romo sits to pee wouldn't have started either - so you can stick that weak argument!

So to sum up, and I'll keep it simple so as not to lose you, Campbell, entering his third year, is entering his 1st camp as a starter, and has given the coaching staff, and other observers, reason to believe he could be a legitamite NFL QB.

Romo sits to pee, entering his 5th year, is entering this 1st camp as a starter, and has given the coaching staff, and other observers, reason to believe he could be a legitamite NFL QB.

EDIT - Oh and - no last year was his 1st with the starters. I distincly recall Romo sits to pee getting A LOT of reps in the preseason with the starters...but again, don't let facts get in the way

[SkinsFTW]

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh: pricless!!!!!!!!

Aikman went to 6 pro bowls and these are his stats in those years:

Yr---gm--cp--att--%---yds-ypa- t--i

1991 12 237 363 65.3 2754 7.6 11 10

1992 16 302 473 63.8 3445 7.3 23 14

1993 14 271 392 69.1 3100 7.9 15 6

1994 14 233 361 64.5 2676 7.4 13 12

1995 16 280 432 64.8 3304 7.6 16 7

1996 15 296 465 63.7 3126 6.7 12 13

6 Pro Bowls, those are always decided before the seasons over so don't tell me it was his postseason excellence that got him the votes.

6 Years 6 Pro Bowls in a row and I bet that I could find QB's on **** teams that had those stats.

BTW, here are Steve Young's stats for the same 6 years on a team that didn't have the best OL in the league or Emmitt Smith.

1991 11 180 279 64.5 2517 9.0 17 8

1992 16 268 402 66.7 3465 8.6 25 7

1993 16 314 462 68.0 4023 8.7 29 16

1994 16 324 461 70.3 3969 8.6 35 10

1995 11 299 447 66.9 3200 7.2 20 11

1996 12 214 316 67.7 2410 7.6 14 6

Steve Young put up 2x the numbers but only made 5 Pro Bowls because Aikman's 1991 was better, or was it?

BTW here are Favre's 1994 stats when he DIDN'T go to the Pro Bowl but look at Aikmans numbers for that year and acknowledge.

1994 16 363 582 62.4 3882 6.7 33 14

Here is Brunell's best year (2005)

2005 16 262 454 59.7 3050 6.7 23 10

Here is Aikman's best:

1992 16 302 473 63.8 3445 7.3 23 14

We all admit that Brunell was along for the ride in 2005, so at his best what was Aikman doing?