Peerless Price is the fastest 4.65 guy I've ever seen here.

[Art]

Everyone is loving Peerless Price. Yet, does anyone even know what his speed is? According to this, it's 4.65....

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/1999/nfldraft/players/17277.html

I've seen Price listed anywhere from 4.44 to 4.65 before the draft. We know Gardner was 4.45. Price isn't striking me as the fastest of all men. Why are we so in love with the Price idea? Don't get me wrong, I'd love Price too, but, as a No. 2 receiver to compliment and assist Gardner. Does Price shine with the attitude that screams, "Let me go help a team?" Or do his recent comments make it sound like he thinks he's gotta be the man wherever he goes?

Price wasn't as good as Gardner entering the league, in terms of being an NFL prospect. He wasn't as good as Gardner as a rookie. He wasn't as good as Gardner as a second-year player. If he comes here, he's immediately the second-best receiver we have and for the price for Price, considering how he seems to think he may be better than he is, what are we doing falling in love with him?

[@DCGoldPants]

I agree we need a WR but really, we need a fast fast guy who can help spread out the D so gardner and thompson (they better re-sign him) can work on the corners and in the middle.

[Mickalino]

2 other things Price has against him. First he's not a Gator (although I hope the Gator experiment is over by now). But besides that, Price happens to be from Tennessee. What would Spurrier want with a player from a team he always used to beat up on ?

[Nighthawk]

Well Art, you beat me to it. I've been wondering the same thing. Why the sudden love affair with Peerless Price. Until this year, his numbers were nothing to get worked up about. It's funny you say he's the fastest 4.65 guy you've ever seen because he's also the tallest 5-11 guy I've ever seen.

I was looking at his numbers earlier this morning and I thought to myself why would we want to pay the price for a guy to be our #1 WR when his numbers don't compare with Gardner's?

I'm terribly afraid we'll get in a bidding war with ourselves to sign this guy. The FA WR crop this year is thin when you take into account how many are RFA's. That's the only reason I can imagine that everybody is jumping on the Peerless bandwagon.

[bubba9497]

Originally posted by Bufford

I agree we need a WR but really, we need a fast fast guy who can help spread out the D so gardner and thompson (they better re-sign him) can work on the corners and in the middle.

Washington drafted three Vols this year. Two are still on the team. B. Jackson, Andre Lott.

Price was a 4.2 guy at UT. The article even stated the time was taken while he had a serious ankle injury (since healed) and this quote...

He also has a "sneaky" extra gear, which allows him to get deep more often than his speed would indicate. He is excellent when running with the ball after the catch and he also has some ability as a return specialist. He is not always a real natural looking player, but you cannot deny his production and performance in big games. This is a guy that is starting to look like the "real deal" and he may be sneaking up most NFL draft charts....

[Art]

Price, to me, screams Hakim, only as what Hakim would have been in a pass friendly offense as the No. 2 receiver. Price is a NICE, NICE, NICE piece to add here. But, is he a true No. 1 as he'll certainly be paid? And even if he is, is he somehow better than Gardner, or even Thompson one full year into the system it obviously took so much time to get down?

I'd smile and be very happy if we added Price but I would only be so because I would continue to talk about him as a great No. 2 receiver who'll help Gardner develop into the No. 1 he's already closer to being than Price. Remember, Gardner actually has experience working against a majority of double teams. He's already seen coverage designed to take him away. Price never really has. Moulds always got the attention in Buffalo and still does.

There will be a learning curve for Price to figure out how to get open when coverage is keying on him. Gardner has much more experience with that than Price does. Gardner has shown incredibly fine hands and the ability to make the tough catch. He's show an ability to get space and he's still developing as a player. Price scares me because to me he's got more warts than Gardner and we'd be signing him to be our top guy, not a No. 2 guy.

If you want a top guy, go get Boston. Then I couldn't complain .

[Art]

Originally posted by bubba9497

Washington drafted three Vols this year. Two are still on the team. B. Jackson, Andre Lott.

Price was a 4.2 guy at UT.

Bubba,

Price was a 4.2 guy prior to his injury in 1997. By all accounts he lost a lot of his explosiveness and entering the draft he was a rather pedestrian speed guy.

[bubba9497]

Boston is an ill fit with Washington. He is slower than Price, and has a history of injuries. Last year was his only productive year. He provides nothing better than what we all ready have on the team. Plus he has had some drug test problems early in his career. Bostons style of play, and his huge size... he seems better suited for a TE position ala Shannon Shape of the Bronco's.

In Spurrier's fun & gun there is no true #1, #2. Price is a better fit. He is smart, fast, has big play ability (I read somewhere he leads the NFL in plays over 40 yards this year), great hands no history of injury in the NFL. He is a confident aggressive player, that has worked great with Bledsoe, (Ramsey's big arm, hard nose play, tough in the pocket, leadership skills, all remind me great deal Bledsoe).

Everyone has their own opinion, but for my money I would take Price anyday over Boston.

[SkinsThug]

Let's see what Cliff Russell can do first.

No to Price.

[The Dark Horse]

"I've seen Price listed anywhere from 4.44 to 4.65 before the draft. We know Gardner was 4.45. Price isn't striking me as the fastest of all men. "

There are guys who run track and there are guys who play football. Price's game has always been associated with getting deep.

Athalon:

Complementing Moulds is tempermentival but talented Peerless Price, who had his best season (55 catches and a team leading 7 tds). When his head's in the game, he may be better than Moulds on the deep ball.

Lindy's:

Moulds and Price form a fine wideout tandem. Both can go deep. Price's numbers have improved each of his three years, and he's aiming for a big season in the last year of his contract."

Sporting News wide receiver analysis:

Moulds and Price have the speed to stretch defenses, an asset new offensive coordinator Kevin Gilbride is intent on taking advantage of in the team's vertical passing attack. With Moulds and Price forcing safeties to protect against the deep pass, Reed and Johnson could do a lot of damage underneath the coverage.

Bledsoe's strong arm and the speed of receivers Eric Moulds and Peerless Price will allow the Bills to attack defenses vertically. That should create opportunities for other receivers on short and intermediate routes.

[Dirk Diggler]

Just like any other FA, it all comes down to the value or in this case, the Price $$$

He's a nice player. He's even nicer than Boston when you consider what it will cost, not only in terms of guaranteed dollars but when compared to the draft picks you need to give up.

I have said this on a # of occasions but just in case it has fallen on deaf ears:

The Cardinals will be more than 30 mill under next years cap.

They will franchise Boston whether they intend on paying him or not.

He will cost 2 # 1's to sign to a contract that he is probably not worth coming off of a knee injury. Especially in the short term.

There are also character issues with Boston.

I can think of about 3 WR's I would give 2 #1's for and he aint one of them.

[Art]

Bubba,

In your world is 71 catches for 1156 yards and seven touchdowns doing nothing? Boston was better and faster than Price entering the draft. He had a better first three years and was hurt this year. I'd take my chances on Boston in a fair fight.

DH,

I'm not attempting to diminish Price other than to set into some perspective whether he's a No. 1 receiver or not in this league. He's not and hasn't yet been. Neither has Gardner, though, Gardner is a lot closer after two years than Price. Gardner is averaging 15.1 yards per catch so far in his career. Gardner has a 20-yard or better catch in 10 games this year. Price has the same in 9. Our offense for a good chunk of the year didn't have a QB capable of really putting the ball downfield. Buffalo's did.

Let's just say this. If we had Price right now and Buffalo had Gardner, right now, we'd want Gardner in the worst way while never giving Price his due.

[Mickalino]

Originally posted by SkinsThug

Let's see what Cliff Russell can do first.

No to Price.

We need to quit fantsazing about Russell and his speed. Not only will he essentially be a rookie next year, but Russell is more injury prone than Boston or anyone I know, for that matter. Here's a couple reminders from the past, in case we forgot

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9704&highlight=Russell

http://www.extremeskins.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11363&highlight=Russell

[Posse81]

Originally posted by Nighthawk

I was looking at his numbers earlier this morning and I thought to myself why would we want to pay the price for a guy to be our #1 WR when his numbers don't compare with Gardner's?

In 2002:

Price: 89-1195-9

Gardner: 66-947-8

[Art]

Posse,

Do you realize how inane that is?

So effing what? What'd Price do his rookie year as compared to Gardner?

Price 31-393-3

Gardner 46-741-4

How about his second year?

Price 52-762-3

Gardner 66-947-8

You know, one could make a seriously fine argument that Gardner's year this year straight up is better than Price. Price has a legitimate, wonderful QB throwing to him. He's got a set and settled legitimate No. 1 receiver next to him. He's got a dangerous rookie receiver as a true No. 3.

The Redskins had receiver shuffle. QB shuffle. Completely new offense bordering on RADICALLY different from last year and Gardner may still top 1000 yards, 70 catches and 8 touchdowns? Fascinating.

Price isn't even his own teams top receiver. He's so valuable and deadly the Bills aren't likely to use a transition or franchise label on him. Are you seriously attempting to validate Price's arrival based on being a sound No. 2 in a Top 5 pass offense with a legitimate QB all year and what Gardner has done in his SECOND year as a pro in his second offense with his SIXTH QB?

[CBMGreatOne]

I live in Rochester during the year, and have seen a fair amount of Price, and the thing I like about him is that he's a threat to score running after the catch, the likes of which we haven't had in a long time. He has the ability to catch a ball, make one move, and beat the only guy left. Spurrier is going to want the kind of guy who can score from anywhere on the field, which Price has proven himself to be.

Whether he will come cheap enough is in question, but he'd definitely be a good addition, and is exactly the type of WR Spurrier wants, moreso than Boston.

[chiefhogskin48]

Art, you're right on the money here. Peerless clearly is no saviour at the receiver position, but I am also pretty sure we will get him and overpay significantly.

Boston is way, way better, but no chance we get him (as he will be franchised by the Cardinals). Hilliard is an acceptable option, especially since his price tag will be relatively low.

Unfortunately, it's a seller's market for WRs this year which will lead to some teams overpaying.

[APB]

The comparison between Price and Hakim seems justifiable. I was thinking more about comparing him to Albert Connell, personally.

[Posse81]

Originally posted by Art

Posse,

Do you realize how inane that is?

So effing what? What'd Price do his rookie year as compared to Gardner?

Price 31-393-3

Gardner 46-741-4

How about his second year?

Price 52-762-3

Gardner 66-947-8

You know, one could make a seriously fine argument that Gardner's year this year straight up is better than Price. Price has a legitimate, wonderful QB throwing to him. He's got a set and settled legitimate No. 1 receiver next to him. He's got a dangerous rookie receiver as a true No. 3.

The Redskins had receiver shuffle. QB shuffle. Completely new offense bordering on RADICALLY different from last year and Gardner may still top 1000 yards, 70 catches and 8 touchdowns? Fascinating.

Price isn't even his own teams top receiver. He's so valuable and deadly the Bills aren't likely to use a transition or franchise label on him. Are you seriously attempting to validate Price's arrival based on being a sound No. 2 in a Top 5 pass offense with a legitimate QB all year and what Gardner has done in his SECOND year as a pro in his second offense with his SIXTH QB?

I am not saying that Price is a better WR than Rod. You will notice I did not comment on my previous post, I merely listed the stats for each guy this year in response to the comment that Price's numbers do not compare to Gardner's. THAT is an inane statement, as the numbers show.

You make the argument this year, Rod dealt with a QB shuffle and Peerless benefitted from Bledsoe throwing him the ball. You also list Price's rookie and second year numbers--years when his numbers continued to improve steadily--, so I ask, who was throwing Price the ball then? Not Bledsoe. Furthermore, Price did not have the benefit of starting every game his rookie year, he only started 4 as he played behind Andre Reed.

As far as the Bills not using the franchise tag on Price, maybe its because they are investing a lot of $$ in their other WR, Eric Moulds. You think they are unhappy with they way he has played this year?

Price isn't even his own team's #1? You are knocking him because the team happens to have Eric Moulds too?

Again, my argument is not that Price is better than Gardner. Not every WR can put up the numbers Price did this year, regardless of the talent around him. The argument is, the numbers are nice and he is worth considering to play WITH, not instead of Rod.

[RiggoDrill]

To me it's all about the speed. If he can run signifigantly faster than Rod or Derrius, sign him -- Even if we overpay him a bit with the bonus, we will have obtained a NOW player with the speed we need without sacrificing a #1 draft pick.

If he's really not much faster than what we've got, forget it. Price had good numbers, but we must also remember that he had Bledsoe throwing to him all season, while Rod and Derrius have only begun to see their downfield potential with Ramsey.

If Price ain't worth it, I would draft at least one more, preferably 2 more, Cliff Russel type in rounds 2 or 3, and let them compete. We saw what the competition did for Darnerian and Derrius, so why not do it again for speedy guys?

[The Dark Horse]

"I'm not attempting to diminish Price other than to set into some perspective whether he's a No. 1 receiver or not in this league. He's not and hasn't yet been. Neither has Gardner, though, Gardner is a lot closer after two years than Price."

OK, I was assuming your arguement was that Price is not a deep burner.

I'm sure we can all agree that the one thing our receiver corp needs a guy who can get deep.

Another thing I'm fairly sure of is that no one here feels Price is a bonafide #1 receiver ala Boston, Owens, Harrsion, etc.

I guess the thing I don't agree with is the assumption that Price will be a large ticket item. I've heard other boards claiming signing bonus numbers in the range of $7-$8M. I doubt it.

Also, I have always been a huge Gardner fan - I have his throwback jersey. The thought of Gardner and Price, supported with Thompson, McCants, and Russell is appealing to me.

[GURU]

Something to think about, maybe. Maybe we shouldn't be comparing Price and Gardner, physically. A better comparison is Gardner to Moulds. They are physically comparable. If Price can produce like that with Moulds on the other side, it's certainly possible he could with a maturing Gardner on the other side.

You look for receivers to complement each other. I think Moulds and Price do. I think Gardner and Price could. From watching Price this season, he seems to be the type of receiver who can get to full speed in one step. And he has some shake-n-bake, make-you-miss run-after-the-catch ability that all of our current receivers lack. I don't give a crap about 40 times, or height or weight. You look for what a guy does on the field. He's a confident, firey competitor. Could we use some of that on our offense?

Someone said it already in this thread--Price has improved every season. That's what you look for. The jury is still out as to whether or not he can be a number one receiver. Some have already made up their minds that he is not. I'm not so sure. He is physically similar to Marvin Harrison, who is not your "prototypical" #1 receiver, but he is the best in the league, at this time.

That being said, I wouldn't get into an outrageous bidding war over Price. That just wouldn't be wise. But I could see making him the highest paid receiver on the team, for now. For the right contract, I could see Price coming here and being very effective in Spurrier's offense, and possibly becoming the #1 receiver without hindering Gardner's growth. If we are fortunate, for once, both Price and Gardner could blossom into superstars and really make that offense go.

[yank]

Take all 40 times with a huge grain of salt. There are many factors that affect 40 times:

- surface

- wind (unlike track records, player times never come with a wind factor)

- hand vs. automatic timing

- injuries

- in season/off-season

- wearing pads or not

- lying *******s

Darrell Green, Deion, Cliff Branch and Bo Jackson are supposed to have run "legit" sub- 4.2 40s. I would think Randy Moss did too.

Darrell supposedly ran a 4.24 at the age of 40. What a freak!

Taking any 40 time from a campus workout is not likely to have much validity especially hand-timed.

I find it hard to believe that Price is legitimately in the 4.2 range. He has good football skills and anyone who combines that with a 4.2 40 would not have slipped to the bottom of the second round in the 1999 NFL draft.

What counts is "football speed." For a WR thats how fast you can go into and come out of your breaks, and whether you have that extra gear. You can have all the straight line speed you want but it's rare a WR just does a straight go pattern without any variation in speed at the start. DBs have a 5-10 yard head start which is huge in a dead race. WRs have to sell a shorter pattern (or slower speed) to get the DB to close - then turn it on for a go pattern. When the ball comes, the WR has to defeat the defender for the ball using his speed, hands, jumping ability and hand/eye coordination.

Jerry Rice did all that I don't recall anyone putting him on the all-time NFL track team.

[Luca Brasi]

Originally posted by Posse81

I am not saying that Price is a better WR than Rod. You will notice I did not comment on my previous post, I merely listed the stats for each guy this year in response to the comment that Price's numbers do not compare to Gardner's. THAT is an inane statement, as the numbers show.

You make the argument this year, Rod dealt with a QB shuffle and Peerless benefitted from Bledsoe throwing him the ball. You also list Price's rookie and second year numbers--years when his numbers continued to improve steadily--, so I ask, who was throwing Price the ball then? Not Bledsoe. Furthermore, Price did not have the benefit of starting every game his rookie year, he only started 4 as he played behind Andre Reed.

As far as the Bills not using the franchise tag on Price, maybe its because they are investing a lot of $$ in their other WR, Eric Moulds. You think they are unhappy with they way he has played this year?

Price isn't even his own team's #1? You are knocking him because the team happens to have Eric Moulds too?

Again, my argument is not that Price is better than Gardner. Not every WR can put up the numbers Price did this year, regardless of the talent around him. The argument is, the numbers are nice and he is worth considering to play WITH, not instead of Rod.

Ohh...that's in the bone Art.

[Art]

Posse,

A couple of broad strokes here.

The person in this thread that mentioned numbers was comparing where Rod was today as compared to where Price was as a second year player. As a first and second year player the two players don't come close.

As an NFL prospect, Gardner was the superior one.

And, while I realize you in particular may not be talking about adding Price to replace Gardner, the fact is, the majority of the love for Price revolves around how he's a certain No. 1 receiver that Gardner can, for some reason, never be.

I LOVE the idea of Price to open up the field for us. I love the concept of having a guy who's as dangerous as Price on the field. If we're talking about as a guy to add to Gardner, that's great. But, at this point, there's more reason to believe Gardner will be a true No. 1 receiver than there is to believe Price will be, and, in general, we're talking about adding Price to add a true No. 1.

If Price were to be pleased with the role of second fiddle, that'd be great. Does he strike you as happy being considered No. 2 in Buffalo?

I think it is a detriment to Price that the Bills aren't likely to tag him in any way. I don't care how much money is sunk into Moulds. If the Bills felt Price was a top five or 10 player at his position, they'd retain him. When we resign Champ to huge money and Smoot gets free in a couple of years, you can bet we're going to tag Smoot if he continues to improve because you simply don't let elite players walk.

You just don't.

The Bills evidently feel Price is a nice player in addition to Moulds, but, by himself, is not a critical one. And too many Redskin fans are pretending he's the critical one we need. I agree he is if he is viewed as the guy who's likely to allow Gardner to grow. If he winds up earning the No. 1 role, then great. I just worry that he won't, and yet he'll be productive, and he'll be whining about how he needs to be on a team where he's the man to prove he's the man.