Sarge Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-18rearrests%2C0%2C4091353.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines WASHINGTON -- Illegal immigrants who were caught but released in the United States may have been re-arrested as many as six times, Justice Department data released Monday indicates. The findings by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn A. Fine are based on a sampling of 100 illegal immigrants arrested by local and state authorities in 2004, the latest complete data available. They show that 73 of the 100 immigrants were arrested, collectively, 429 times -- ranging from traffic tickets to weapons and drug charges. Fine's office said its audit could not conclude precisely how many of the 262,105 illegal immigrants charged with criminal histories that year had been re-arrested. ``But if this data is indicative of the full population of 262,105 criminal histories, the rate at which released criminal aliens are re-arrested is extremely high,'' the audit noted. The audit was required by Congress in 2005, and parts of it were redacted because of security reasons. It looked at how local and state authorities that receive Justice Department funding to help catch and detain illegal immigrants are working with the Homeland Security Department. It also examined the arrest rates of immigrants who were released _ usually because of insufficient jail space _ before they could be turned over to Homeland Security's bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement. In all, 752 cities, counties and states participating in the program received $287 million in 2005, the audit noted. Five states _ California, New York, Texas, Florida and Arizona _ received the bulk of the money, together pulling in more than $184 million. Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff four months ago declared an end to the ``catch and release'' practice that for years helped many illegal immigrants stay in the United States unhindered. At the time, the department was holding 99 percent of non-Mexican illegal immigrants in its custody until they could be returned to their home nations. The policy generally does not apply to Mexicans, who are almost immediately returned to Mexico after being stopped by Border Patrol agents. The audit also looked at whether local and state authorities fully cooperated with Homeland Security efforts to remove illegal immigrants, and tried to determine how many had been released because of jail space or funding shortages. In both cases, Fine's office said it was unable to draw definitive conclusions. It also found that at least one area _ San Francisco _ was receiving funding even though local policy specifically limits the information it gives to Homeland Security about immigration enforcement. San Francisco, which won $1.1 million, defines itself as a ``city and county of refuge'' and does not allow federal agents to view immigration jail records without permission from local police. Assistant Attorney General Regina B. Schofield, who oversees the Office of Justice Programs, declined comment on the audit, noting it does not contain any recommendations. The Justice Department audit can be found at: http://www.usdoj.gov/oig/reports/OJP/a0707/final.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tizzod Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 I feel a 5-pager coming on...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted January 9, 2007 Author Share Posted January 9, 2007 I feel a 5-pager coming on...... :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IONTOP Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 I have a problem with this title... SOME immigrants are re-arrested 6 times ON AVERAGE... That's like saying SOME americans get married 5 times on average... Either say SOME americans get married around 5 times or say Americans, on average get married 5 times.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen-like Todd Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 I have a problem with this title... SOME immigrants are re-arrested 6 times ON AVERAGE... That's like saying SOME americans get married 5 times on average... Either say SOME americans get married around 5 times or say Americans, on average get married 5 times.. sure, but if you look at the article, it's a huge percentage of the individuals arrested (3/4ths). The findings by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn A. Fine are based on a sampling of 100 illegal immigrants arrested by local and state authorities in 2004, the latest complete data available. They show that 73 of the 100 immigrants were arrested, collectively, 429 times -- ranging from traffic tickets to weapons and drug charges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 sure, but if you look at the article, it's a huge percentage of the individuals arrested (3/4ths). So 3/4ths of individuals arrested have been arrested before. What % of citizens who are arrested have been arrested multiple times? I would venture a guess that the % it pretty high as well. I bet if you polled 100 citizens who have been arrested, over half of them have had prior convictions, and some may skew the results. For example, if three people were arrested 20 times a piece, that would totally skew the results, and make the average look worse. The moral of this story is, if you have been arrested, and you are here illegally, chances are you have been arrested before. Nothing earth shattering at all. Just more hate filled propaganda meant to make people think immigration is bad for this country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen-like Todd Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 So 3/4ths of individuals arrested have been arrested before. What % of citizens who are arrested have been arrested multiple times? I would venture a guess that the % it pretty high as well. I bet if you polled 100 citizens who have been arrested, over half of them have had prior convictions, and some may skew the results. For example, if three people were arrested 20 times a piece, that would totally skew the results, and make the average look worse. The moral of this story is, if you have been arrested, and you are here illegally, chances are you have been arrested before. Nothing earth shattering at all. Just more hate filled propaganda meant to make people think immigration is bad for this country. Just to clarify, it's not that 3/4ths have been arrested before, it's that 3/4ths have been arrested an average of 6 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomerics Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Just to clarify, it's not that 3/4ths have been arrested before, it's that 3/4ths have been arrested an average of 6 times. Yes, and the "on average" can be skewed by a few people who have been arrested a LOT! Here is an example. . . 100-arrested the totals could break down as follows. . . 25 arrested once 45 arrested twice 5 arrested 3 times 10 arrested 6 times 5 arrested 10 times 5 arrested 15 times 2 arrested 20 times 3 arrested 25 times I know some people have rap sheets that are over 100 arrests long, and you only need one or two of them in your survey to skew the results. So in this case, only 30% of the people were arrested more than twice. The old statistical average game, similar to the tax break "ave" game Bush played. . . He would say "the average American household will get back $1500 in taxes this year", while correct is not telling the entire story. The top 5% get 90% of the cut, and they average say $20,000 back, and the bottom 95% get 5% of the cut, and they average maybe $100 back. The "averages" work out, but the wording is used to make it appear better (or in this case worse) then the actual statistics show. That was the point I was getting to. Just trying to make people be aware of the importance in language usage when dealing with statistics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BURGUNDYBLEEDER Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 Just more hate filled propaganda meant to make people think immigration is bad for this country. We are talking not about immigration but ILLEGAL immigration. That means we don't know who they are...undocumented? So if out of a sample of 100 illegal immigrants who were initially arrested because they were illegal and released, 73 were re-arrested, how is it hate filled to believe that possibly illegal immigration is bad for this country? Who is spewing the propaganda? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted January 9, 2007 Author Share Posted January 9, 2007 So 3/4ths of individuals arrested have been arrested before. What % of citizens who are arrested have been arrested multiple times? I would venture a guess that the % it pretty high as well. I bet if you polled 100 citizens who have been arrested, over half of them have had prior convictions, and some may skew the results. For example, if three people were arrested 20 times a piece, that would totally skew the results, and make the average look worse. The moral of this story is, if you have been arrested, and you are here illegally, chances are you have been arrested before. Nothing earth shattering at all. Just more hate filled propaganda meant to make people think immigration is bad for this country. And just think, if they weren't here ILLEGALLY to begin with, we wouldn't be having this discussion. And the cops wouldn't be wasting time re-arresting people that are here ILLEGALLY. And the prisons, which are run by taxpayers dollars, wouldn't have to house and feed people that are here ILLEGALLY. And the victims of crime, perpatrated by people here ILLEGALLY, would be victims, and in some cases might even still be alive. But, go on living in La La Land Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 sure, but if you look at the article, it's a huge percentage of the individuals arrested (3/4ths). Not quite. That's 100 people, out of 262,105. Sure, of the 100 people they have data on almost 75% were arrested more than once (it doesn't say specifically that each were arrested 6 times), but those 100 people are 0.03% of illegal immigrant criminals; that can hardly be considered a representative population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted January 9, 2007 Share Posted January 9, 2007 What % of citizens who are arrested have been arrested multiple times? I would venture a guess that the % it pretty high as well. I bet if you polled 100 citizens who have been arrested, over half of them have had prior convictions, and some may skew the results. For example, if three people were arrested 20 times a piece, that would totally skew the results, and make the average look worse. Exactly. I'm sure the percentage of legal citizen criminals currently in our system who have prior convictions is upwards of 70-80%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjah Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 And just think, if they weren't CRIMINALS to begin with, we wouldn't be having this discussion. And the cops wouldn't be wasting time re-arresting people that are CRIMINALS. And the prisons, which are run by taxpayers dollars, wouldn't have to house and feed people that are CRIMINALS. And the victims of crime, perpatrated by CRIMINALS, would be victims, and in some cases might even still be alive.But, go on living in La La Land Fixed for inclusiveness of all criminal activity. Now, what percentage of worrisome repeat criminals in this country are illegal aliens? (Hint: small number) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 I have a problem with this title... SOME immigrants are re-arrested 6 times ON AVERAGE... That's like saying SOME americans get married 5 times on average... Either say SOME americans get married around 5 times or say Americans, on average get married 5 times.. 2/5 of the ESers that read this article will be 100% confused on average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen-like Todd Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Not quite. That's 100 people, out of 262,105. Sure, of the 100 people they have data on almost 75% were arrested more than once (it doesn't say specifically that each were arrested 6 times), but those 100 people are 0.03% of illegal immigrant criminals; that can hardly be considered a representative population. It very much depends on how the study was designed. n = 100 could be the right number depending on the distribution. It's not something that can be automatically dismissed. Election polls for the entire country are conducted with ~1,000 individuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjah Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 Todd is right on the money. You might be able to pull a pretty reasonable confidence interval with just 100 data points. Depends on information we don't have, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsburySkinsFan Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 The findings by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn A. Fine are based on a sampling of 100 illegal immigrants arrested by local and state authorities in 2004, the latest complete data available. They show that 73 of the 100 immigrants were arrested, collectively, 429 times -- ranging from traffic tickets to weapons and drug charges. Hmm, 100 immigrants, not exactly what I would call a wide sampling, 100 out of 20,600,000? Yeah totally not exactly what could be considered.......well anything of merit or value. I don't think I'd hang my hat on the statistics provided in this survey. Statistics provided here: http://www.immigrationcounters.com/ *edit* there is simply too much not told in this survey; for instance were the illegal immigrants repeatedly arrested for being in country illegally, if so that just means that they know a good way across the border, not that they are dangerous. BTW, for all you "ship 'em back to Mexico" folks, next time you drink your orange juice, smoke a cigarette, bet on a horse race, eat Perdue turkeys know that each one of these industries heavily rely upon undocumented workers, and yet somehow our nation's unemployment rate stays about the same, so I guess they aren't stealing all the jobs and killing and robbing everyone. */edit* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrockster21 Posted January 10, 2007 Share Posted January 10, 2007 It very much depends on how the study was designed. n = 100 could be the right number depending on the distribution. It's not something that can be automatically dismissed. Election polls for the entire country are conducted with ~1,000 individuals. Todd is right on the money.You might be able to pull a pretty reasonable confidence interval with just 100 data points. Depends on information we don't have, though. The article clearly states that the 100 people are "all the data that is available." So we have no idea if this is representative or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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