For those who say Brunell can't go downfield.......

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

old news, boonells stats get padded with YAC. he has 1657 yards passing on the season, yet 973 of them come from YAC (numbers from www.stats.com). im pretty sure he has the highest YAC percentage of any QB in football.

[Ty Garcia]

it is a team effort and it starts with the O-line blocking and giving him enough time to make his 2nd and 3rd read. He is not as mobile as he once was and as far as him throwing downfield, my personal opinion is that he just does not want to make mistakes. I feel if you do not want to throw it downfield why did you spend in the offseason getting fast receivers if you did not want to throw it downfield you should of gotten more possesion type receivers. Do not get me wrong I love the receivers we have and feel that we are not using them to our advantage!!!!

[XxSpearheadxX]

Like that 74 yarder to Portis? Yea that was all in the air, right? Now I am not bashing him or defending him. All I am saying, don't come here and defend him until you tell me how many of those supposed long bombs were actually in the air for more than 20 yards.

:laugh: :laugh: :rotflmao:

[SKINZ33]

some of those catches have been due to the YAC yards by santana

DING!! DING!! YAC are a huge part of it.

[fansince62]

"When Brunell really steps into a 15 to 20 yarder, it still has a lot of zip. But, he usually is shuffling his feet or falling back and doesn't have the arm strength to have bad mechanics and throw hard.

The puzzlingly bad passes are the lob bombs that he has underthrown EVERY time this year. And, in truth, after his knee injury last season, he couldn't throw the bomb either. I remember the bomb to start the Giants game at FEDEX last year where Santana had to contort himself to get to it.

The Lloyd pass that was called back last game was a great catch of another underthrow."

nice post.that is what I have seen as well.

[#1SkinsFan]

Ok your missing the point. I am not pinning the losses on Brunell at all. MY POINT is if we keep losing, we might as well bench Brunell to get ready for the future with Campbell. Brunell is old and this is probably his last stab at a SB (which is not happening). So why keep him in if we lose? Not saying he lost us the game, just saying we gain nothing from him being in there when were not in playoff contention.

Also, if we want to utilize our playbook and WR strengths the most, Campbell can get the ball deep to them.

agreed but at least Brunell can hopefully lead us to the playoffs this year like he did last year, and even if we get there, I know its unlikely, but there is always a shot at getting to the big one. (See Pittsburgh last year).

I say that until we are mathematically out of playoff contention, play Brunell. The it will be Campbell time.......

[spidernat]

"People want to say his stats are skewed, when in reality, his stats are no more sked than any other QB or player in the league. It doesn't matter what the guy does or doesn't do, some people only see and believe what they want to see and believe."

exactly. and you are prima facie evidence to that!

:applause: :applause: :applause: ...

The funny thing is that he made that statement and didn't even realize that he was talking about himself. Look in the mirror dude!

[Passizle]

So look at those and think what you want about Brunell, but the fact is, with time, he WILL get it deep, and almost 62 % of the time complete it.

Well thats the problem right there isnt it? We only have 16 games and Brunell is probably in his last season as a starter. I will give him props where it is deserved. He protects the ball well... really well. But you have to risk a little in this league if you want solid production. He needs to llearn to trust our receivers other than Moss and Cooley. Lloyd has great hands and speed. I wish the just once, Brunell would call a "go" play for the receivers, pump fake to get the DB's out of whack and let it go deep to Moss or Lloyd. They have great makeup speed and hands to grab those bombs out of the air.

[spidernat]

If we made the playoffs last year without Gibbs, then my answer would be YES

But if he continued his sucking from 2004, and didn't lead us anywhere in 2005, then my answer would be NO.

I know he won't win us a SB, but he is apparently the "best guy to give us a chance to win."

So I guess we should just stick with him until we are "mathematically eliminated".

Then comes "Jason Campbell Time!"

Curious comment kid. Isn't the goal of a football season to win the Super Bowl?

Also, you sound like a soldier marching to Gibbs' drum with the "best guy to give us a chance to win" quote.

By the way, why aren't you in school this morning?

[Portis4President]

some of those catches have been due to the YAC yards by santana

Exactly.

[skinstzar]

some of those catches have been due to the YAC yards by santana

Most of them have. Some great catches by Cooley as well. Some tough catches over the middle by Thrash and Randle El. Believe it or not the recievers have made Brunnell look good on many occasions. He needs to start returning the favor and hit them in stride on go routes and fly routes.

[redskin81]

Not another Brunell thread. :doh:

Is there any end to the madness?

Never enough.

[Stuckinphilly1]

Yea I know. If we lose 1 more, he might be snagged and Campbell might be put in.

Than what the heck did you start this mindless thread for :doh:

We all know that MB is not getting us anywhere this year. IF and that's a HUGE if it will be Gibbs leadership and Portis strapping the team on his back. Anything can happen in Jan/Feb but you gotta get there first, realistically we're not.

LET'S JUST PLEASE ENJOY THIS DALLAS WIN FOR A FEW MORE DAYS BEFORE THE MISERY THAT WILL FOLLOW THE PHILLY GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[nneece]

It's not only down field, it is over the middle also. Passes in the 10 to 15 yard range are practically nonexistent. You can't tell me that every defense we play takes away those passes. It is because Brunell does not throw them because he is ultra conservative at this point and scared of throwing a pick. Admittedly, maybe he plays within his limitations which are huge when it comes to his passing game.

[dinamo]

Brunell can get the job done! That is the fact. That is why he is here. Gibbs does not ask him to win games. He asks Brunell not to make mistakes. And if offensive line was able to give him good 4 seconds to throw - I am confident Mark will deliver. Our offensive line plays very poorly. For the money the getting paid - they are terrible. They definitely have their moments, but they really must protect Brunell at all times. Samuels and Jensen should be monster protectors, but instead they allow DEs to get to our QB. It just offensive line is not as visible as QB. Everybody watches what QB does, but how many actually can see blown assignments by OL?

The bottom line: Mark Brunell can lead as were we want to go, but he does need help from the OL and definitely from our D.

[skinny21]

FrankenMonkey over at CPND did a bangup job on some research regarding one Mark Brunell and YAC. He has been gracious enough to allow me to post his research here.

Here's the link to the stats he compiled:

http://members.cox.net/frankenmonkey/YAC.htm

Those are some interesting stats... really makes me wish we'd kept the status quo last year and just brought in randle el.

I will say (this is just the skeptic in me) that those stats could be in part due to playcalling. If (a big if, I know) Saunders does not have faith in our o-line or blitz pickup and therefore calls a bunch of screens and passes to the flat to negate the pressure other teams put on us.

Lastly, I'll also defend the thread starter on one issue... even though I think those numbers are highly skewed and are not a good argument for brunell's arm strength, I agree with his position that many people on this board believe that brunell CANNOT throw the ball down field... that he has no arm strength. I've even heard some of the players say he can really put the ball on a rope (I've seen it for myself too, just too small a percentage of the time).

Personally, I believe Brunell's main problems have been that he is still adjusting to the playcalling (as are his receivers and backs) and the receivers, his line is adjusting to a much larger # of blocking schemes, and our defense isn't doing their part.

With all that said, if we lose at the Linc and some/most of the wild card contenders win, then I want Campbell in.

[bbuzz1962]

A lot of those passes came during junk time, when we had already lost the game. Brunell doesn't impress anyone in the profession. He continues to struggle, and again, the reason we won against Dallas was special teams play. This team cannot survive hoping that our offense gets bailed out somehow.

[Oldskool]

This thread is pure comedy. A serious wake up call to those fans who think that Brunell isn't gimping this team.

[bryanjr2003]

Brunell cant go downfield the way this system is designed to do so. He doesnt have the arm strength or deep accuracy to do so. Its pretty bad when one of our wide receivers throws one deep ball and it looked better than any Brunell threw the whole season. Look back at some of the highlights from last year Moss had to repeatedly slow down and wait for the ball to get to him. It takes everything he has for him to throw over ten yards its pretty sad.

[s0crates]

To the thread starter, you are exactly right.

Unfortunately, there is just no reasoning with some people.

[spidernat]

To the thread starter, you are exactly right.

Unfortunately, there is just no reasoning with some people.

Do any of Brunell's Zombies have ANY credibility left?

[supadrummer]

If we made the playoffs last year without Gibbs, then my answer would be YES

But if he continued his sucking from 2004, and didn't lead us anywhere in 2005, then my answer would be NO.

I know he won't win us a SB, but he is apparently the "best guy to give us a chance to win."

So I guess we should just stick with him until we are "mathematically eliminated".

Then comes "Jason Campbell Time!"

And My Answer is who cares? I guess reinventing the wheel is what you are trying to do with this thread. stats stats stats....

Gibbs Knows football and is a winner. Brunell is going to start regardless of the two points. Save the drama you both lose!!

Redskins just win and stop the contraversy.

[AKM311]

To the thread starter, you are exactly right.

Unfortunately, there is just no reasoning with some people.

What is he right about? Have you looked at the stats, watched the games, heard the WRs, watched the post game film?

If you have, then you will see, the ATTEMPTS are not there. Now maybe he can throw it that far, but bottom line is he does not attempt them. Why, who knows, but it sure seems like he can't consistently do it without tiring out his arm.

[AKM311]

And My Answer is who cares? I guess reinventing the wheel is what you are trying to do with this thread. stats stats stats....

Gibbs Knows football and is a winner. Brunell is going to start regardless of the two points. Save the drama you both lose!!

Redskins just win and stop the contraversy.

I agree! Who cares what Brunell does. If we win AWESOME. If he doesn't Campbell will come in once were out of the playoffs. So I say we close the thread and move on.

Let the season play out before we start acting like we know what the problem is.

[no1fanofno21]

http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/1032

Check out his stats so far from this year.

He has 23 passes for 20 + yards, compared to 36 of ALL last year

He has 4 passes for 40 + yards, compared to only 9 of ALL last year!

So by going downfield, how far do you want him to go? A hail mary every time?

I watch the games as much as the rest of you and sometimes his dumpoffs and screens can get frustarting, but as you can see, he does have the ability to get it deep. He should have at least 6 or more of 40 +, but they have been called back b/c of penalty (i.e- Lloyd catch, called back for holding on Fauris, B.S. call).

Maybe it's just b/c the WR's aren't getting open as much as everyone wants them to, and that's why he is forced to throw to his only option which is usually the RB. But if you give him time, and the o-line blocks well, like it did vs. Dallas, he has that oppurtunity which is why we saw so many passes deep down the middle or a few down the sidelines.

He has 8 Td's and only 3 ints and isn't making any crucial mistakes, but the poor o-line play has caused most of us to overlook his talent and way of getting the ball to open recievers. If our o-line play improves well enough to give Mark time so that he isn't immediately flushed out of the pocket, then look for his stats to be increased and look for more receivers to get the ball through deep and intermediate passes. He played his 2 best games against good defenses in teh Jags and Cowboys ( and a bad texan defense), but that was mainly due to how good our o-line was.

So overall, O-Line improvement=More passes downfield=Better play from Brunell and co, which ultimately equals more wins, and no more calling of Brunell's head (for now )

Just my :2cents:.........................

Are you serious. Have you been watching the games. Are you kidding me.

He throws dump offs to the recievers/RB's and they do the rest. Randel El has thrown the longest pass all season, and that was downfield. I dont know what you've been smoking cause you are in just as much denial as Gibbs.