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The Figure Four - ALL Things ECW-WWF-NJPW-TNA-ROH-AEW

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Ppl seem to realize that there was A LOT of terrible ideas/concepts during the Attitude era.

Yeah, they hit on a few crucial elements but there was plenty of crap there too.

That era wasn't great because of the TV-14 rating

That era was driven by Austin being the most unique babyface ever and Vince McMahon simply being the greatest heel in wrestling history and then the Rock inexplicably becoming whatever it was he became (I don't think you can really characterize him). I guess it helped that they could say "ass" and "hell" and "damn." But those first three things made the "Attitude" era great.

The rest of the Vince Russo nonsense kind of sucked. Unless you think Mark Henry was better when he was a sex addict.

The problem with the current product is not the lack of an "edge." The problem is that everything is so controlled. The talent they have on the roster right now is actually quite exceptional. They just are putting everyone into little boxes, feeding them their lines, and not letting them do anything memorable. Honestly, if they just gave the wrestlers 15 percent more control over the characters and occasionally let someone get over big, all their problems would go away.

Edited by Lombardi's_kid_brother

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John Cena's ruining himself...

How is he ruining himself? He's doing what he's told. WWE ruined him when they stopped letting him improv. Everyone can see when he use to write his material or gets to improv he's quite good at it. There is times you can tell Cena definitely goes off the script because he has to (such as addressing chants by the crowd). Not every superstar would abandon the script to interact with the crowd. Stone Cold, Rock, McMahon, Cena, Edge, Punk,etc actually do. The most successful superstars can connect with the crowd which makes WWE management see them as a potential star. That's why ones like Ryback are still up in the air. Yeah people chant his phrase but they already think of him as goldberg.

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I'm hearing rumors that Cena will turn heel Sunday. From watching his promo this Monday, I think he will finally turn heel. When your #1 face recievers a chant of "BORING, BORING, BORING!!!", a change is desperately needed. That never happened to Hogan, Rhodes, Sting or Austin.

I'm beginning to wonder if they're going to throw a curveball at us and actually have Rock win... Cena loses... He looks downtrodden... WrestleMania ends.

Rock comes out on RAW to say he has cemented his legacy... Cena's music hits and he comes out completely depressed and down... And tells the Rock that it's now obvious that The Rock is better than John Cena. He shakes his hand and walks away. In the back a few segments later, Cena is shown with his bag over his shoulder leaving... Vickie runs up to him and says, "JOHN! YOU HAVE A MATCH! WE'RE TRYING TO DETERMINE A NUMBER ONE CONTENDER!!! YOU BETTER NOT WALK OUT!!!"

Cena: "I'm not good enough to hold that title. And besides, I can't beat him."

Cena walks by, head down, depressed... as he gets to the door...

Vickie: "HUSTLE, LOYALTY AND RESPECT? NEVER GIVE UP, JOHN? YOU'RE A LOSER! YOU'VE ALWAYS BEEN A LOSER AND ALWAYS WILL BE! BUT YOU'RE RIGHT!!! YOU NEVER COULD BEAT THE ROCK!!! EVER!!!!!!!!! AND THAT'S WHY YOU'LL NEVER BE MENTIONED WITH NAMES LIKE ROCK, AUSTIN, HOGAN, SAVAGE, HART, MICHAELS, HHH OR FLAIR! YOU'RE A NOBODY!!!!"

The next week Cena is shown in the back and a stage hand makes a comment about how he's a quitter... Cena snaps and beats the snot out of him.

He comes out to the ring, obviously being booed and he apologizes for losing his cool... And he still has his principles and that he's so sorry. He begs for forgiveness... Rock comes out... Taunts him and says what a sorry excuse for a human being he is... Cena looks very upset with himself and he leaves in a very depressed manner... Again.

That goes on until the RAW before Extreme Rules. Rock comes out to cut a promo... Cena's music hits and he explains that he wants his belt back... Rock says no... Cena says he'll put his career on the line for a shot at that title because if he can't win that belt on the third attempt than he doesn't deserve to collect a paycheck anymore.

Rock accepts and says that for the opportunity to end John Cena's useless career, he'd gladly accept one last match.

At Extreme Rules, Cena wins by some kind of cheating method, whether it's a run in from someone or cheating in his own way. New WWE Champion... And then he proceeds to beat the snot out of Rock. To the point where the show goes off the air with the Rock "severely injured" and Cena looking like a man possessed...

Monday on RAW the Dr. Of Thug-A-Nomics returns.

Edited by KDawg

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The rest of the Vince Russo nonsense kind of sucked. Unless you think Mark Henry was better when he was a sex addict.

The most successful superstars can connect with the crowd

Mark Henry can connect with a crowd. That is why that Sexual Chocolate gimmick worked for him. But obviously his career when to another level when he became a monster heel.

So I agree RR, the most successful wrestlers are the ones that connect with the fans, but creative still has to have something good for them.

Look at people like Zack Ryder and Kofi Kingston. Two wrestlers that the fans love, but creative does nothing worthwhile with them.

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Ppl seem to realize that there was A LOT of terrible ideas/concepts during the Attitude era.

What, you weren't rivited when Mae Young gave birth to a rubber hand?

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What, you weren't rivited when Mae Young gave birth to a rubber hand?

The only thing I remember about her was the King's commentary one time when she wanted to show her "puppies" like Debra. He said, "those aren't puppies Mae, those are basset hounds." lmao

Who could also forget "Poopstain" Patterson winning the Hardcore title from Crash? Yeah, the attitude era didn't hit on everything lol but it was a hell of a lot more entertaining than today...

Edited by Momma There Goes That Man

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I'm beginning to wonder if they're going to throw a curveball at us and actually have Rock win... Cena loses... He looks downtrodden... WrestleMania ends.

(stuff)

I don't know how I missed all of that :ols: That would shock me if The Rock wins. If he does win, I will start to believe the rumors of Cena turning heel. I don't care how they do it, I just hope that they don't take the easy way out and have him join The Shield. It would be stupid and it would slow down Rollins, Reigns, and Ambrose's growth.

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Bring back Val Venis.

Venis was a pretty good wrestler, but that gimmick should have had a ticking clock behind it.

I just hated the entire concept behind Vince Russo's booking which was, "Everything on this show is scripted, except what you are watching right now. This is a shoot." The right talent could elevate that stuff (and they had great talent). But it buried mid-level talents.

In all honesty, I don't mind the concept of a creative team. It's the same concept as a booker. And bookers had their own problems (a tendency to push themselves or their friends, too many blind spots, eventually running out of ideas, hotshotting to save their jobs). The problems with Creative are:

1. They are too controlling of the talent. Give them a direction for an interview. Not a script.

2. They don't seem to like anyone getting too over except Cena and the part-timers. I think the McMahons are so angry about the Rock and Lesnar leaving and having success that they never want anyone to even have that option again.

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Isn't the Rock leaving again to film some movies after WM? I thought I read that in this thread.

Cena wins.....Dolph cashes in MITB on Cena right away.. End WM.

Edited by Buford

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Isn't the Rock leaving again to film some movies after WM? I thought I read that in this thread.

Cena wins.....Dolph cashes in MITB on Cena right away.. End WM.

Only one problem, the MITB is good for the Heavywegiht Championship only, not the WWE Championship.

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Only one problem, the MITB is good for the Heavywegiht Championship only, not the WWE Championship.

I did not know that. I thought it was good for either. Well, that's lame. Nevermind.

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Isn't the Rock leaving again to film some movies after WM? I thought I read that in this thread.

Cena wins.....Dolph cashes in MITB on Cena right away.. End WM.

Rock is scheduled through Extreme Rules to do stuff with WWE.

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Venis was a pretty good wrestler' date=' but that gimmick should have had a ticking clock behind it.

I just hated the entire concept behind Vince Russo's booking which was, "Everything on this show is scripted, except what you are watching right now. This is a shoot." The right talent could elevate that stuff (and they had great talent). But it buried mid-level talents.

In all honesty, I don't mind the concept of a creative team. It's the same concept as a booker. And bookers had their own problems (a tendency to push themselves or their friends, too many blind spots, eventually running out of ideas, hotshotting to save their jobs). The problems with Creative are:

1. They are too controlling of the talent. Give them a direction for an interview. Not a script.

2. They don't seem to like anyone getting too over except Cena and the part-timers. I think the McMahons are so angry about the Rock and Lesnar leaving and having success that they never want anyone to even have that option again.[/quote']

Fandango is on that same clock. Hopefully that clock is much shorter though.

He's McMahon's pet project. He doesn't get booed because he's a heel and knows how to generate heat. He gets booed because the gimmick is lame as ****.

Also, CM Punk best heel in FOREVER. These past few weeks have been amazing. One of the best, although more tame things he's done, was interrupting Mae Young's birthday song. Loved that ****.

---------- Post added April-4th-2013 at 04:02 PM ----------

Also how pathetic is it that Tons of Funk and Rhodes Scholars are on the main card but the IC match with Barrett (PUSH THIS MAN) and Miz are on the pre-show? WTF?

Edited by Who Del

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So who's going Sunday?

I am pretty sure just about everybody I am rooting for is going to lose, and I still don't care. It's Wrestlemania, I'm going to have a blast.

Lets see if I'm right.

Rock/Cena- rooting for Rock

Punk/Taker- Rooting for Punk

Brock/HHH- Brock

Hell No/Ziggler & Big E- Hell no

ADR/Swagger- ADR

Henry/Ryback- Henry

The 8 person mixed tag- Rhodes Shcolars and the Bellas

Shield/ Show Orton Sheamus- Shield

Jerich0/Fandango- FAN DAN GO

Barret/Miz- Barret

I think I hit two of them. ADR and the Shield.

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I think I hit two of them. ADR and the Shield.

Fandango has to win too. Wouldn't make any sense to have him lose to Jericho.

It would be so sweet if Dolph and Big E wins the tag tile and then Dolph Cashes in MITB against Del Rio.

Edited by MLSKINS

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So who's going Sunday?

I am pretty sure just about everybody I am rooting for is going to lose, and I still don't care. It's Wrestlemania, I'm going to have a blast.

Lets see if I'm right.

Rock/Cena- rooting for Rock

Punk/Taker- Rooting for Punk

Brock/HHH- Brock

Hell No/Ziggler & Big E- Hell no

ADR/Swagger- ADR

Henry/Ryback- Henry

The 8 person mixed tag- Rhodes Shcolars and the Bellas

Shield/ Show Orton Sheamus- Shield

Jerich0/Fandango- FAN DAN GO

Barret/Miz- Barret

I think I hit two of them. ADR and the Shield.

I'm going. Arrive in NYC tomorrow morning.

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Couple of friends were given tickets as gifts. Seventh row. Said they're diagonal off the left post, opposite the entrance ramp. ****s. Also, why is this on page 2 with the event less than an hour off?

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I'm already annoyed knowing Cena will beat Rock. I tune into wrestling here and there, mostly just for the main pay per views and maybe a raw here and there if bored. I'd like to see Rock go 3-0 vs Cena as I heard Rock is signed for the event after wrestle mania too, But It means he probably loses the next two. Lame. Cena doesn't deserve to beat the rock.

Edited by Zazzaro703

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who the **** booked the end of the main event...God it was so corny and stupid. I'm glad the fans **** on it.

I knew Cena was going to win but my God, that was awful.

Only redeemable thing on the card was Taker/Punk

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I just brought a truck for 2 Grand that I probably have to spend another grand to get it running the way I want it to run...

That still was a better purchase than the 70 dollars I just wasted on Wrestlemania. 70 Freakin Dollars.

Never again.... :doh:

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who the **** booked the end of the main event...God it was so corny and stupid. I'm glad the fans **** on it.

I knew Cena was going to win but my God, that was awful.

Only redeemable thing on the card was Taker/Punk

I definitely think they went over board on the ending. I think the match could have ended earlier. The last AA was kind of lame compared to the tricking the Rock attempt, Rock getting AA after mocking the shuffle, and Cena's rock bottom. All those could have made for interesting endings for Cena to win. Cena giving the ring to the Rock was understandable from a legend point of view but they didn't need the salute(It's Cena's thing but really no need to have them saluting each other) and two holding hands up. The two were billed as not being able to stand each other and suddenly become good friends?

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