The Figure Four - ALL Things ECW-WWF-NJPW-TNA-ROH-AEW

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

Hey, that was a good match! Rock has still got it. Like Rocky Maiavia in there.

[NewCliche21]

Most "Meh" Wrestlemania ever. Aside from the *INCREDIBLE* Undertaker/HHH/HBK match, the rest was just "meh."

---------- Post added April-1st-2012 at 11:17 PM ----------

If they get Brock, then they really need to get Heyman back with him.

Very disappointed that he didn't even show. Expected him to get Punk DQ'd after that rule was put into place and then three-way for a title between Lesnar, Punk, and Jericho in Chicago (potential Hart-like screwjob angle) with the no DQ matches.

Missed a major one there, WWE.

[spjunkies]

My guess is they just want to hold off on Lesnar until Monday so he can start a fresh program with someone.

[OU_skins]

I got home in time for the Rock/Cena match...gotta say I was pretty entertained. I caught Raw every once in a while leading up so I was in on the hype. But I'm not a huge WWE fan. I watched last year's entire show and I thought it was pretty disappointing. I think the Rock and Cena lived up to the hype from my noob perspective this year.

[RichmondRedskin88]

This Wrestlemania reminds me why I'm not into Raw and Smackdown as I use to be. The Undertaker match was good but everything else kind of stunk. I'm also tired of the upcoming/ new generation superstars taking backseat to past wrestlers. Cena needed to win that match. Rock is gone from the WWE and will be back in movies. All that match did was say that the past WWE/WWF was better than the current one. WWE absolutely beats down its young superstars for celebrities and past popular superstars. How can WWE plan for the future if it continues to live in the past?

[spjunkies]

This Wrestlemania reminds me why I'm not into Raw and Smackdown as I use to be. The Undertaker match was good but everything else kind of stunk. I'm also tired of the upcoming/ new generation superstars taking backseat to past wrestlers. Cena needed to win that match. Rock is gone from the WWE and will be back in movies. All that match did was say that the past WWE/WWF was better than the current one. WWE absolutely beats down its young superstars for celebrities and past popular superstars. How can WWE plan for the future if it continues to live in the past?

The Rock is already committed to doing at least two more matches (Summerslam, Wrestlemania 2013) and Cena losing makes sense for his character if they play it right he can turn into an epic heel.

[RichmondRedskin88]

The Rock is already committed to doing at least two more matches (Summerslam, Wrestlemania 2013) and Cena losing makes sense for his character if they play it right he can turn into an epic heel.

When will people get he's not going to turn heel? He's liked by some and hated by others. Cena won't turn full heel. People been thinking it would happen for years now. Only reason Rock won is his celebrity hollywood status and the match being in Miami. If you haven't noticed the hollywood/celebrity always wins(Mayweather, Trump, Sumo wrestler against Big Show,etc). Celebrity always wins. I knew before watching Wrestlemania that they would never let a celebrity lose. Soon as Rock kicked out of the second Attitude Adjustment I knew Cena would lose.

[spjunkies]

When will people get he's not going to turn heel? He's liked by some and hated by others. Cena won't turn full heel. People been thinking it would happen for years now. Only reason Rock won is his celebrity hollywood status and the match being in Miami. If you haven't noticed the hollywood/celebrity always wins(Mayweather, Trump, Sumo wrestler against Big Show,etc). Celebrity always wins. I knew before watching Wrestlemania that they would never let a celebrity lose. Soon as Rock kicked out of the second Attitude Adjustment I knew Cena would lose.

I said if they were smart they would turn him full heel because he is beyond stale, but we know they don't make the best choices. And if they are setting up a trilogy like it appears they are going to do Cena will get his revenge.

[RichmondRedskin88]

I said if they were smart they would turn him full heel because he is beyond stale, but we know they don't make the best choices. And if they are setting up a trilogy like it appears they are going to do Cena will get his revenge.

Having to watch three Cena-Rock matches might be as painful as this match tonight. I hate to say it but Cena definitely carried that match. Rock didn't look like his old self and his moves looked pretty bad sometimes(especially the Rock Bottoms). If I have to see Cena carry two more matches only to job to Rock its gonna be pretty damn painful. To me it was like watching a young established superstar taking on a superstar that can't accept his time has seemly come and gone. I loved the Rock growing up but seeing him pop up time to time for a few matches seems pointless to me. Its like people desperately hanging on to the Attitude Era. Cena might be viewed as a cream puff by some for his repeat moves and such but at least he is there every night and doesn't try to play the crowd. Rock at one time could be a heel but that will never happen again due to history and hollywood. Cena will have his haters(mainly attitude era fans) and his supporters(Kids and young people). Honestly I don't completely understand the Cena hate. He was asked to become the face of the WWE. Is he suppose to say no? Anyone who knows about the wrestling business knows you say yes to opportunities or you will find yourself on the unemployment line. People were fine with Rock as the face because of the era he wrestled in(trash talking & great storylines). Cena is the face of a WWE that tones down language, storylines, and targets young crowd. Hell Cena use to write his lines but now they make him read a prepared script. The fact is the hate for the New WWE is directed at Cena because he's the face of it. Everyone loves Rock cuz they remember what era he's from. Change what era Rock-Cena wrestles in and we'll see who gets booed.

[spjunkies]

Having to watch three Cena-Rock matches might be as painful as this match tonight. I hate to say it but Cena definitely carried that match. Rock didn't look like his old self and his moves looked pretty bad sometimes(especially the Rock Bottoms). If I have to see Cena carry two more matches only to job to Rock its gonna be pretty damn painful. To me it was like watching a young established superstar taking on a superstar that can't accept his time has seemly come and gone. I loved the Rock growing up but seeing him pop up time to time for a few matches seems pointless to me. Its like people desperately hanging on to the Attitude Era. Cena might be viewed as a cream puff by some for his repeat moves and such but at least he is there every night and doesn't try to play the crowd. Rock at one time could be a heel but that will never happen again due to history and hollywood. Cena will have his haters(mainly attitude era fans) and his supporters(Kids and young people). Honestly I don't completely understand the Cena hate. He was asked to become the face of the WWE. Is he suppose to say no? Anyone who knows about the wrestling business knows you say yes to opportunities or you will find yourself on the unemployment line. People were fine with Rock as the face because of the era he wrestled in(trash talking & great storylines). Cena is the face of a WWE that tones down language, storylines, and targets young crowd. Hell Cena use to write his lines but now they make him read a prepared script. The fact is the hate for the New WWE is directed at Cena because he's the face of it. Everyone loves Rock cuz they remember what era he's from. Change what era Rock-Cena wrestles in and we'll see who gets booed.

There is no question that Cena would have to carry the match since Rock hasn't been in a singles match in 9 years he was bound to be rusty. I think the guy did a hell of a job in the match for this being his first real match in forever. Cena is no spring chicken himself since he's only like 5 years younger than Rocky so it's not like he went over Cody Rhodes or something.

I think the Rock did bulk up too much and if he does indeed Wrestle at Summerslam he should be 10-15 pounds lighter and that should help his pacing tremendously.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

Having to watch three Cena-Rock matches might be as painful as this match tonight. I hate to say it but Cena definitely carried that match. Rock didn't look like his old self and his moves looked pretty bad sometimes(especially the Rock Bottoms). If I have to see Cena carry two more matches only to job to Rock its gonna be pretty damn painful. To me it was like watching a young established superstar taking on a superstar that can't accept his time has seemly come and gone. I loved the Rock growing up but seeing him pop up time to time for a few matches seems pointless to me. Its like people desperately hanging on to the Attitude Era. Cena might be viewed as a cream puff by some for his repeat moves and such but at least he is there every night and doesn't try to play the crowd. Rock at one time could be a heel but that will never happen again due to history and hollywood. Cena will have his haters(mainly attitude era fans) and his supporters(Kids and young people). Honestly I don't completely understand the Cena hate. He was asked to become the face of the WWE. Is he suppose to say no? Anyone who knows about the wrestling business knows you say yes to opportunities or you will find yourself on the unemployment line. People were fine with Rock as the face because of the era he wrestled in(trash talking & great storylines). Cena is the face of a WWE that tones down language, storylines, and targets young crowd. Hell Cena use to write his lines but now they make him read a prepared script. The fact is the hate for the New WWE is directed at Cena because he's the face of it. Everyone loves Rock cuz they remember what era he's from. Change what era Rock-Cena wrestles in and we'll see who gets booed.

i don't think you know what "carrying a match" means...Cena has never carried anyone...EVER. And he botched the hell out the top rope leg drop and nearly murdered Rock. It wasn't a great technical match but Rock looked good to me

Edited April 2, 2012 by BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

I thought Rock and Cena were fantastic. That was a good match. I'm not a fan of Cena's but they put on a good show. Rock with his groundwork early, then Cena working the body. Rock had great timing with his kickouts, not even twitching before kicking out right in the nick of time. I knew Rock was going to win this, but some of his kickouts had me saying "oh ****!". He was overall technically savvy, you could tell he drilled a lot for this match.

It being in Miami, there could have been a riot if you don't give Rocky that match. The only way you give Cena that match is if you plan on making him a mega-heel. Like freakin' Iron Sheik heel, like throw trash in the ring at him heel. That, I admit, would have been awesome. However, his fanbase is made up of 90% children, so that's obviously out of the question.

Cena wins that match while "attempting" to stay face, regardless of the venue, and you devalue Rock's character while Cena becomes even more polarizing. Trust me, you can push Cena on the public all you want, half of wrestling's fanbase will just never be in to it.

They're on the verge of gaining me back as a fan. Along with other Rock fans, I'll be watching RAW tonight, which is something I rarely ever do.

I hear Brock has signed a 1 year contract with the WWE, things could get very interesting.

Edited April 2, 2012 by d0ublestr0ker0ll

[NewCliche21]

I don't see how people were happy with that Rock match. I'm a massive Rock fan since the NOD days, and that was just, eh. Maybe too much hype, but the ending was such crap. Best Rock match I've seen is against Hogan. *THAT* was epic. Yeah the wrestling itself sucked, but the feeling was just tremendous. All I could think about after this one was, "Well, at least the rappers stopped."

And seriously, WTF was with the following:

1) The twelve-man match 'o jobbers/jobbers-to-be.

2) Women in a wrestling ring.

3) The Funky Four, errrr, Clay and "Mama" being anywhere near the state of Florida at all whatsoever?

4) Diddy?

5) Diddy's love child between Eminem and Stretch Armstrong?

6) Flo Rida?

Those things really just tainted the night. Even Punk vs. Jericho was disappointing for the first 2/3. Definitely not the best Wrestlemania I've seen. Not even top ten.

[Grinder]

This is why the best wrestling matches are via YouTube.

The WWE talent well is so dry that Rock, HHH, and Undertaker can pull off the bubblewrap once a year and headline their biggest PPV.

Now they have completely devalued their own champion via a clean loss to a guy whos wrestling is more hobby than livelihood.

Give me the older Mid-Atlantic, Georgia, hell even the old AWA stuff over this $65 a pop crapfest.

[KDawg]

I was actually extremely entertained all night.

Brodus Clay was stupid, but it was hilarious. Maybe it's because I'm 27 and I embrace the fact that things happen to entertain everyone as far as wrestling fans go.

I think the guy who did Cena's entrance is an idiot, he talked trash to Miami about their hometown guy and wore a "Cleveland" shirt. Dude's sales went downhill

The worst part of the night, BY FAR, was the 12-man tag. Khali has no business in the ring. Otunga did literally NOTHING in that match. Was just a bad match, and it started with them all coming out to the show theme songs and wearing t-shirts.

Sheamus winning in 18 seconds started the night off awesome, I thought. There's going to be more to that, so, I don't think it's going to kill Bryan.

Jericho/Punk was a good match. It was entertaining and it told a story.

HHH/Taker/HBK STOLE the show. Those guys were awesome. HHH/Taker's backs were both totally purple from those chair shots. When the three of them were together at the top of the ramp, I got chills.

Rock/Cena was awesome. I'm a huge fan of the Rock, but Rock winning doesn't do any harm. It can help by keeping some of his fans around. I didn't think he was going to. I thought Brock was going to cost Rock the match and set up a match for next year between the two.

I also don't think you're going to see a series of three matches, either. I think you'll see Rock do the job to Cena the next time around and they'll call it even. WWE doesn't want to downplay the Attitude Era, and they don't want to hurt the current era. Cena WILL beat Rock. Rock winning last night just made sense. Bringing him back just to lose does nothing. If they build a rematch correctly, they accomplish a ton of goals: 1) They keep Cena out of the world title picture. 2) They make the Cena character transform. Maybe not full fledged heel, but maybe doing things a bit differently. More of a reckless abandon attitude. Everyone that was over my house went nuts when Rock won. It just made sense to have him win.

Cena will get revenge and look great in the process. Especially if those two actually have any kind of real animosity towards each other. If that is the case, I'm sure neither would have signed on for the program if they weren't going to pick up a win. I gained a TON of respect for Cena last night. I always respected him, but I never liked him much. I changed that opinion. The fact that he was willing to have Rock go over last night was huge. And knowing Rock has never refused to do a job, unlike other superstars, Rock will have Cena go over him at some point.

---------- Post added April-2nd-2012 at 08:17 AM ----------

And, let's not forget, that Cena beating Rock last night would have been Cena beating an out of shape wrestler who he was supposed to beat. By having Rock go over, they built him up as being THE ROCK and not just a guy coming to wrestle once.

If WWE plays this right, and plays that angle, and Cena beats Rock next time, now Cena looks better having beaten The Rock and not Dwayne Johnson. But the key there is WWE has to play this right.

Again, I'm a HUGE fan of Rock. But I think he knows that Cena has to go over him now, and if WWE does it right, he will. Again, Rock has never refused a job.

[RichmondRedskin88]

Its sad how "meh" this wrestlemania was. Undertaker-HHH was awesome. Chris Jericho-CM Punk was not that great. Jobbers for GM match was just a excuse for Eve to kick WOO WOO in the balls. Sheamus Bryan was funny.Orton vs Kane was a disappointment. Especially when Kane hits two chokeslams and you don't see the RKO once.Big Show vs Cody was pretty expected. Cena-Rock=One guy carries the match and than jobs at the end to avoid a riot.

---------- Post added April-2nd-2012 at 09:46 AM ----------

i don't think you know what "carrying a match" means...Cena has never carried anyone...EVER. And he botched the hell out the top rope leg drop and nearly murdered Rock. It wasn't a great technical match but Rock looked good to me

If there was a botch(which I didn't see one) it was because Rock taking 5 mins to get up every dang time he got knocked down. From what I saw Cena hit Rock's upper back on the leg drop. Highly doubt that will kill him.

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

And, let's not forget, that Cena beating Rock last night would have been Cena beating an out of shape wrestler who he was supposed to beat. By having Rock go over, they built him up as being THE ROCK and not just a guy coming to wrestle once.

If WWE plays this right, and plays that angle, and Cena beats Rock next time, now Cena looks better having beaten The Rock and not Dwayne Johnson. But the key there is WWE has to play this right.

Again, I'm a HUGE fan of Rock. But I think he knows that Cena has to go over him now, and if WWE does it right, he will. Again, Rock has never refused a job.

Exactly. Cena will have his time, it's a good thing that the WWE treats their legends right. Wrestlers look at the match result and see that Rock earned this moment through a career of hard work and dedication. Cena has a moment or two like that coming to him. Relax Cena fans

I'm baffled that some of you think he should have won. Cena could win the tag team, intercontinental and world championship in the same night and it would draw in a grand total of 8 more viewers to RAW the next night. I'd go as far to say that it would drive more fans away from the product. It isn't a win that Cena needs, it's a character (attitude?) adjustment. They are simply afraid to do anything drastic with him because he's firmly established in his niche of being Mr. PG.

Cena's fanbase will forgive and forget, especially since they're kids. They've been trying to put Cena over for years and years now, I thank God that he didn't win last night...As Rock says, "FINALLY." No shame in losing to an all-time legend, a fellow good guy, the kids will get over it, and you'll bring a ton of interest back to the industry. People were talking about it on my way to work, co-workers have been talking about The Rock this morning. It's an Adrenaline shot for the industry, as opposed to the same old spoon fed baby food we've been getting with Cena.

Again, I have nothing against Cena's abilities in the ring, he impressed me last night, I gotta commend him, he'll have a legendary moment in his hometown one day, bet the house. He will have earned it just like Rocky has.

Edited April 2, 2012 by d0ublestr0ker0ll

[KDawg]

If there was a botch(which I didn't see one) it was because Rock taking 5 mins to get up every dang time he got knocked down. From what I saw Cena hit Rock's upper back on the leg drop. Highly doubt that will kill him.

Actually, if you watch the replay, Cena hit Rock's back in an odd way, and the top of Rock's head bounced off the canvas in a strange position. Could have been bad. But it wasn't, and I wouldn't say it was a botch just on Cena. Rock shouldn't have had his neck in that position, either.

[spjunkies]

Rock just said he wants to go after the championship talk about a swerve

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

That beginning segment was great, although I've never liked the way Rock just stands there sometimes letting the fans chant after every 3rd sentence. I loved the knock on the fan who whistled at him.

The way they set up John being all depressed and wanting to call out Rock makes it seem like he might turn full-heel. Oh please be true, I think he'd do a great job since he's already disliked by a lot of people. Talk about needing a revamping, this is a perfect time for a heel turn.

Santino Morella is hilarious

Edited April 3, 2012 by d0ublestr0ker0ll

[DM72]

This is why the best wrestling matches are via YouTube.

The WWE talent well is so dry that Rock, HHH, and Undertaker can pull off the bubblewrap once a year and headline their biggest PPV.

Now they have completely devalued their own champion via a clean loss to a guy whos wrestling is more hobby than livelihood.

Give me the older Mid-Atlantic, Georgia, hell even the old AWA stuff over this $65 a pop crapfest.

Yeah, the NWA in the 80's couldn't be touched.

[RichmondRedskin88]

Right now its looking like the call out will be short considering they stuck the Miz Ryder match in.

[spjunkies]

The return of Lesnar plus an EPIC crowd = great RAW!!!!!

Raw was War tonight folks!!!!

[d0ublestr0ker0ll]

Lesnar is back!

Cena proceeded to come out and firmly establish himself in the G rated upstanding citizen role, then asked Rock to come to the ring to shake his hand. Lesnar enters instead, takes his time getting to the ring, starts talking **** to Cena, F5's him.

It's very weird for me to see, because just a couple months ago he was fighting in MMA. Good to see Brock is doing well, though. Wish him the best, and I will again be tuning in to RAW next week. This is unprecedented for me.

Edited April 3, 2012 by d0ublestr0ker0ll

[FSUSkins24]

Just stopping in to say that I watched the WM 28 today (a day late yes), and it was great! The truth about it though is to me the best matches were still by the same guys that have been doing it for years (Rock, Undertaker, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Orton).

WM really won me over and I think I'm gonna give WWE another shot, but I would be completely sold if they would get rid of Cena's character. I understand the whole role model thing, and that's dandy, but it's tired and it's gotta go. I just wish wrestling was edgy again.

Edited April 3, 2012 by FSUSkins24