PokerPacker Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 whatever, you know ceiling cat is better than pancake bunny :laugh: i agree :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 more stuff on my cat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamingwolf Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 an associate degree for you too for ignoring the rabbit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Judges Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 this thread is a setup. using this theory, i'd like to see you democrats in the room name 8 things clinton excelled at? not gonna happen. Why 8? Are you admitting Clinton was a better President than Bush? You asked for it 1. The economy was good 2. Wellfare reform 3. Helped take out Milosevic 4. Beneficial Small Business laws 5. Active Participation/Did what they could for the Palestinian/Israeli conflicts 6. Raised Minimum wage 7. good foreign relations with traditional allies 8. Turned defecit into a surplus man that was easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 ok, last stuff on my cat, but this one's good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamingwolf Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 ok, last stuff on my cat, but this one's good! GED for joo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokerPacker Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 and i believe this is what you wanted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamingwolf Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 and i believe this is what you wanted you are free to get any education you desire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drums and skins Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 This is hard... Any successes will be viewed as something that Bush wasn't really responsible for. Any failures will be place on him immediately. I'm not saying that is right or wrong, but anyone who disapproves of the administration will likely feel this way. Its the nature of the beast. And to the "let the historians debate" comment. Oh please. Could you possible even think that perhaps within the 50,000 people here that someone IS a historian? What if we have intelligent member who read the works of such historians? Would they be uncredible for regurgitating their interpretation of what they've read by said historians? Don't forget that historians have opinions too. Putting historical events into context is largely a matter of opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 Stirring up leftist kooks/dictators Wiping out *******s Driving the stockmarket to new highs Tax cuts Driving the Dem Party into oblivion A screwed up immigration policy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 Bush has over 2 1/2 years left on a four year term. It's a little early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The 12th Commandment Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 I know you want to fight me, but that has been my point from get go. So ineffect you are fighting me cause you agree with me. Wow. Edit: I guess should add, he instigated this fine piece of debatery. Way to go dubya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 1. Tax relief after 9/11 saved Virginia with Airlines/Restaraunts/hotels going down in flames quickly... 2. Didnt talk about it, Minority appointments to the Highest positions in America period. 3. The tort reform bill 4. No Child left behind exposing all kinds of bad schools. 5. Perscription Drug coverage... I don't like it but everyone was ****in about it and trying to buy American drugs from canada, who were cutting it off as more attempted. 6. Stem Cell pause: I'm glad we didnt go headlong into embryonic stem cells when SOOO many other options are available: Placenta, Adult, Testicular... 7. Abortion reform, Partial birth being attacked is fantastic.. Dont run with them in the house and don't use them on a 1/2 born child. Parental Consent.. 8. Killed the Kyoto Global Warming tready no Country but the US and Brittain would actually follow: AND I have shown charts its going to get colder anyway... 9. Taking on Terrorism Head on, Afghanistan, Iraq, Lybia totallyfolded, Syria leaving Jordan, Pakistan kickin in greatly... 10. Put someone in the U.N. that will not rubberstamp every idiotic move they make.. 11. Action Today, A Foundation for Tomorrow People are alive today because the United States has turned its words into action. At the time President Bush announced the Emergency Plan, only an estimated 50,000 people in all of sub-Saharan Africa were receiving life-extending antiretroviral treatment. Yet after just two years of implementation, PEPFAR supported treatment for approximately 401,000 people in the 15 focus nations (395,000 of them in the 12 sub-Saharan African focus nations), as well as approximately 70,000 additional people in other nations I'm sure it would be just as easy to do for Clinton.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted May 12, 2006 Author Share Posted May 12, 2006 Man, I didn't think it would be the kind of task almost no one was up to. Was it really that hard? I think the let History decide rhetoric is terrible. It's true that History will come up with different conclusions, because of hindsight and additional information, but is it your position that we never judge in the moment? Never analyze our stregnths to see what has been done well, so that we can continue in an even more positive direction? The thought that it is impossible to find six things done well or that turned out better because some might find fault with your list is a sad testimony. Sarge gave a half-hearted effort, but I think even his answers had a lot of merit. I think it is difficult to argue that under Bush two military exercises were executed brilliantly. We trounced Afghanistan and Iraq in a matter of days. Midnight Judges had a decent list of things that turned out well including the Libya thing (that is potentially a great side effect of the Iraq War.) It's probably true that there would be disagreement, though no one yet has disagreed with the Judges' Clinton list. Given no restrictions, the only answer that could be arranged is to turn it into a joke thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted May 12, 2006 Author Share Posted May 12, 2006 Thanks Thiebear. That was a good list. You got me while I was typing my response to what I read overnight. The overnight crew is right that there are some choices on your list that I would quibble with, but it's a good list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 #1 He did a generally good job of rallying the US after 9/11. #2 Tax cuts seemed to have stimulated the economy, even if the didn't he didn't make the economy worse, and that is the best you can hope for out of any President. #3 He has been supportive of immigration reform #4 His defense of the UAE port deal was impressive #5 He has tried to reinvigorate the space program #6 His handling of Iran was the best that could be hoped minus the Axis of Evil thing #7 He hasn't tried too hard to fix the Palestine/Israel conflict, and that is fine by me, no President can fix that mess #8 Last I heard he was trying to cut a lot of farm subsidies, and that's impressive #9 Libya gives up Nuke program #10 killed a lot of terrorists, and there haven't been any terrorist attacks on U.S. soil #11 He has been supportive of a lot of new political movements near Russia, like Ukraine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 #1 He did a generally good job of rallying the US after 9/11.#2 Tax cuts seemed to have stimulated the economy, even if the didn't he didn't make the economy worse, and that is the best you can hope for out of any President. #3 He has been supportive of immigration reform #4 His defense of the UAE port deal was impressive #5 He has tried to reinvigorate the space program #6 His handling of Iran was the best that could be hoped minus the Axis of Evil thing #7 He hasn't tried too hard to fix the Palestine/Israel conflict, and that is fine by me, no President can fix that mess #8 Last I heard he was trying to cut a lot of farm subsidies, and that's impressive #9 Libya gives up Nuke program #10 killed a lot of terrorists, and there haven't been any terrorist attacks on U.S. soil #11 He has been supportive of a lot of new political movements near Russia, like Ukraine. Example for ALL!!! Just because you don't like a President doesnt mean you can't be an independant person and TRY.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 lol... you got me. I thought that was an awful quick response. You are absolutely right about this one. Honestly, I decided to ask this because I am feeling more and more cynical about our government and don't want to. I can probably list four things that I think they've done really well that worked out... but, after that it is a strain for me. This really isn't meant as a trap thread.1. The rallying of America's morale following 9-11. I think Bush did a great job of pulling America together and getting us all through some pretty tough days. 2. Jobs- Well, a little tap dancing here because they have redifined the definition of unemployed several times to sweeten the numbers, and the quality is shifting, but factoring in the disasters natural and un, the employment level of this nation seems to be doing okay. 3. Beating the snuffing out of the Taliban. Again, I will dance just a little because I don't think it is "Mission Accomplished" until Bin Laden is caught or killed, but we certainly blew them apart really well. 4. The Stock Market has done, especially energy stocks have done really well during the Bush Presidency. I'd disagree with some of your assessments, but for various reasons. 1) I'd consider the PR reaction to 9/11 to be about the worst response imaginable. My reasoning: The purpose of 9/11 was to scare the american people. Those targest weren't chosen because the terrorists thought that if the WTC were destroyed, GW would stop making cars, or that if the Pentagon were destroyed, the USS Nimitz would vanish into thin air. They were picked because of the emotional effect those symbols would have on an american audience. In short, 9/11 was a publicity stunt. And W was the only person in the world who had the ammo to respond to a publicity stunt of that magnitude, on the battlefield of public relations. Bush didn't have the ability to capture Bin Laden that afternoon. But Bush did have the ability to dictate what CNN put on TV. (Not to dictate directly. But he could have dictated it simply by his actions.) Bush should have immediatly headed for the White House, and addressed the nation from the Oval Office. Even if there might be another airplane out there, somewhere. (He should have sent Cheney to an "undisclosed location", somewhere, and maybe the rest of the cabinet.) But the only "trump card" that would have made CNN stop showing rerun after rerun of the collapsing tower, is the image of the President at his desk. No one else in the nation could have done that. 2) As far as I'm aware, the rules for how to count unemployment haven't changed. Yes, the method used does have the effect of counting people who got fired from their $60K job and are now working at McDonalds as "employed", but AFAIK, that's always been the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The 12th Commandment Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 Ok ok. I actually came up with a couple that I thought were reasonable. Damn DW (jk) took the wind out my sails because you can argue with almost every one of em as to whether they are really good. I should have left out my weak disqualification of his electability. So, a more serious effort: 1. He's approachable. The average voter (me) would feel comfortable, and enjoy talking with him. He's eliminated the unwelcome pomposity that, say, Kerry would have brought to the office. 2. He supports the right to access and profitably use public land. 3. He isn't succumbing to those in his party that want to build a wall 4. He has admitted and publicized our problems with oil even though he is an oil man 5. He communicates especially well with latinos (even before the immigration flap) 6. He supports the rights of sportsman and protects the right to bear arms 7. He doesn't waiver in the face of the environmental lobby with regard to global warming I think that's a fair list and they're things I support too. I would be curious to see a right wing discussion of what he has done wrong that was taken with the same level of earnestness as is being asked for here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Monk Fan Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 2) As far as I'm aware, the rules for how to count unemployment haven't changed. Yes, the method used does have the effect of counting people who got fired from their $60K job and are now working at McDonalds as "employed", but AFAIK, that's always been the case. It balances out: they also count the guy who leaves his $60K job to do the exact same thing as a consultant, making even more money, as "unemplyed." :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted May 12, 2006 Author Share Posted May 12, 2006 Bump. Just want to give give this a better chance since the "Fail" thread is doing so well. Notice that even while there has been some disagreement in the "Fail" thread, those who predicted it would become a flame war seem to be completely wrong so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Judges Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 It balances out: they also count the guy who leaves his $60K job to do the exact same thing as a consultant, making even more money, as "unemplyed." :2cents: You sure about that? My company employs 70 independant consultants and I would be surprised if any of them classified themselves as unemployed under any circumstances. Not to mention many people who take consulting jobs are already retired. Do retired folks count as unemployed as well? Somehow I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Monk Fan Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 You sure about that? My company employs 70 independant consultants and I would be surprised if any of them classified themselves as unemployed under any circumstances. Not to mention many people who take consulting jobs are already retired. Do retired folks count as unemployed as well? Somehow I doubt it. It's the basis for the difference in the two indicators of employment. Dems like to use the indicator based on reports from companies. If I leave my company, they'll report a job loss, but no company will report my hiring if I work for myself as a consultant. Republicans like to use the indicator where folks self-report their employment. A lot of real estate agents and others like them don't get counted in the first, but show up in the second, that's why it usually shows fuller employment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Predicto Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 I will give them Afganistan. They used force appropriately and effectively there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted May 12, 2006 Share Posted May 12, 2006 I will give them Afganistan. They used force appropriately and effectively there. They did but they didn't complete the job 100% to my satisfaction. There are so many conflicting reports about how we let Osama get away. They used force appropriately in Iraq as well based on the evidence they had at the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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