Kerwin on Ramsey: Joe Gibbs should not settle for less than a 2nd round pick

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I would do cartwheels if we got a 4th round pick out of him.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

We drafted him in round one, why settle for anything less?

Because his career has stunk so far.

[AJ_Skins]

The #3 guy on the totem pole isn't a huge, huge loss. We're not getting a second-rounder for Ramsey. He's not worth it. Either the team gets something for him now, or loses him and any chance of compensation after the season.

Personally, I wouldn't look at a team that has an aging and often-injured Brunell backed up by a second year QB who's never played in a real game and feel secure at all, especially when you have a team poised to contend next year. With our situation being what it is, I think the best thing would be bascially a wide-open competition with the three QBs now on the roster. No need to set the depth chart in advance.

With Brunell, Ramsey and Campbell, you could figure you have a strong chance to fashion some kind of performance out of one of those or some combination. If you only have Brunell and Campbell, you're counting on things that are unlikely:

1) Brunell stays healthy for an entire season.

2) Campbell steps in ready to win a championship in his first year playing.

This is assuming what the whole team has indicated since the end of the season is true...that the first and foremost goal of the entire organization is to improve upon last year's finish. If that's not true, I think there are a lot of players on defense who are going to be very angry. As for me, somebody wake me up in 2007.

[ntotoro]

Personally, I wouldn't look at a team that has an aging and often-injured Brunell backed up by a second year QB who's never played in a real game and feel secure at all, especially when you have a team poised to contend next year. With our situation being what it is, I think the best thing would be bascially a wide-open competition with the three QBs now on the roster. No need to set the depth chart in advance.

And you would be wrong.

Ramsey's as good as gone. Even if he weren't, he'd have about a 10% chance of being the starter.

Coach Gibbs already said he'd be comfortable last year if he had to put in Campbell. The rules say the #2 guy has to go if the #1 goes down, though. You can't just pick which backup to put in if you lose your #1 during a game.

I know you have this giant man-crush on him and think that, for some strange reason, the 'Skins should keep him by any means necessary, but he's gone. It's a fact of life. Accept it. Whatever we get, we get. They've already given him permission to shop himself, so he's good as gone.

[TheREALJBird]

Skins need to play hardball with Ramsey, IF more than one team is interested....try to get a 3rd out of it

[flexxskins]

I still think that the reason we seem to want to trade him to the Jets is because we want Abraham but if not, I agree, if AJ Feely can command a 2nd then we damn well should get at least that for Ramsey.

I am hoping that that is the exact example that we are using in our trade negotiations with the NYJ. The fact that AJ Feely was worth a 2nd should prove to be very valuable ammunition.

[AJ_Skins]

And you would be wrong.

Ramsey's as good as gone. Even if he weren't, he'd have about a 10% chance of being the starter.

Coach Gibbs already said he'd be comfortable last year if he had to put in Campbell. The rules say the #2 guy has to go if the #1 goes down, though. You can't just pick which backup to put in if you lose your #1 during a game.

I know you have this giant man-crush on him and think that, for some strange reason, the 'Skins should keep him by any means necessary, but he's gone. It's a fact of life. Accept it. Whatever we get, we get. They've already given him permission to shop himself, so he's good as gone.

Gibbs's comments at the combine sounded to me as if he's hesitant to trade Ramsey, maybe even leaning against it. I think they're indulging his request to shop himself around, but they're not in as much of a hurry to get rid of him as some people here think. Maybe I'm wrong.

You have to look at the reality of the landscape. The only teams with any reported interest in Ramsey at this point are the Jets, Lions, and Dolphins. The Jets have the #4 pick in the draft, the Lions #9, and the Dolphins #16. On top of that, there are other more highly regarded QBs who are unrestricted free agents...Drew Brees and Jon Kitna among them...and Culpeper wants out of Minnesota. Ramsey is not going to be on the top of anybody's list in this kind of market.

[stevenaa]

He's not projected as a starter in this league. He's projected as a backup or a stop gap at best. Take the 4th and move along. That's as good as it's gonna get. He has been a stand up team guy. I say let him go.

[ntotoro]

He's not projected as a starter in this league. He's projected as a backup or a stop gap at best. Take the 4th and move along. That's as good as it's gonna get. He has been a stand up team guy. I say let him go.

I think the interest in him (or relative lack of) has shown what the opinion is of him around the league right now. It won't get any better.

[AJ_Skins]

He's not projected as a starter in this league. He's projected as a backup or a stop gap at best. Take the 4th and move along. That's as good as it's gonna get. He has been a stand up team guy. I say let him go.

In your vision, who do we replace him with if we just drop for little to no return? Some nobody, or a free agent? If so, who?

[Loxley]

Just because a consumer walks into a store doesnt mean he is going to buy from that store. Likewise, Gibbs is obviously honouring his committment to Ramsey in that he said hed explore all options. However if what is on offer for his goods isnt up to the value, he has every right to walk out and not deal.

Id be happy with a 3rd rounder i thnk, 2nd could be a long shot unless its a low 2nd but less than a 3rd is a rip off imo.

[TaylorPickSix]

If we got the Jets 2nd rounder I'd go nuts, because we would most likely get two of the three:

D'Qwell Jackson

Maurice Stovall

Cedric Griffin

WORD.

[AJ_Skins]

If we got the Jets 2nd rounder I'd go nuts, because we would most likely get two of the three:

D'Qwell Jackson

Maurice Stovall

Cedric Griffin

WORD.

The thing is, the Jets have the 4th pick in the draft, and they already have a young QB in Pennington. They will certainly have a shot at Leinart, Young or Cutler, maybe all three, and Kitna is out there, who would be perfect to plug in until one of those guys is ready.

[AJ_Skins]

Just because a consumer walks into a store doesnt mean he is going to buy from that store. Likewise, Gibbs is obviously honouring his committment to Ramsey in that he said hed explore all options. However if what is on offer for his goods isnt up to the value, he has every right to walk out and not deal.

Id be happy with a 3rd rounder i thnk, 2nd could be a long shot unless its a low 2nd but less than a 3rd is a rip off imo.

The thing that burns me is that the Dolphins were begging to give us a first round pick (#19) for him in 2004 when Gibbs brought in Brunell. We had the #5 pick in that same draft and used on Sean (now in legal jeopardy) Taylor. We could have drafted Roethlisberger outright at #5 and gotten somebody like Chris Gamble at #19, or we could have used those two first round picks to deal for Eli Manning.

Instead we kept Ramsey, put him in at the end of 2004, watched him outplay Brunell by every measure that year, then drafted Cambell and yanked him in the first quarter of week one, sending the message to the entire league that there was something horribly wrong with him as a player. When a Hall of Fame coach like Joe Gibbs sends that kind of signal, who else is going to want to him? If Joe Gibbs can't do anything with him, he must be the worst player in the history of the game.

[Jumbo]

Well, I read the whole thread. I'm gonna be pretty alone here, but his is my take:

We should take the first offer we get of a 3rd or even 4th round.

We are already getting less this year than if we had moved last year, though I understand why we didn't.

I am concerned we will continue to drop in what we will get if we play around too much, like down to a 5th or 6th rounder.

I am concerned that people here value ramsey much more than anywhere else, and they believe we are going to get rid of him anyway.

I was hoping we could package him with someone but there's no one other than Tyler or the guys we all knew would get cut that I would feel good about losing.

I cannot see Ramsey's presence in the lockeroom as the #3 QB as being best for the evolving chemistry of the team.

Plus if we kept him instead of picking up some vet, we'll get nothing for him next year. I'd rather trade his cost for a 4th and a vet now, than just keep him for another year and get bupkuss afterwards.

[AJ_Skins]

Well, I read the whole thread. I'm gonna be pretty alone here, but his is my take:

We should take the first offer we get of a 3rd or even 4th round.

We are already getting less this year than if we had moved last year, though I understand why we didn't.

I am concerned we will continue to drop in what we will get if we play around too much, like down to a 5th or 6th rounder.

I am concerned that people here value ramsey much more than anywhere else, and they believe we are going to get rid of him anyway.

I was hoping we could package him with someone but there's no one other than Tyler or the guys we all knew would get cut that I would feel good about losing.

I cannot see Ramsey's presence in the lockeroom as the #3 QB as being best for the evolving chemistry of the team.

Plus if we kept him instead of picking up some vet, we'll get nothing for him next year. I'd rather trade his cost for a 4th and a vet now, than just keep him for another year and get bupkuss afterwards.

The difference between a third or fourth round pick or less and nothing at all is not a huge difference. What we will regret painfully next year is if Brunell goes down, which he almost certainly will at some point, and Campbell is in over his head. If we hadn't had Ramsey this past year in the Giants game, we would not have made the playoffs.

[ntotoro]

The difference between a third or fourth round pick or less and nothing at all is not a huge difference. What we will regret painfully next year is if Brunell goes down, which he almost certainly will at some point, and Campbell is in over his head. If we hadn't had Ramsey this past year in the Giants game, we would not have made the playoffs.

Coach Gibbs would disagree with those comments about Campbell.

Matter of fact, he said so himself last year.

[jrockster21]

Pat Kerwin from Sirius Radio just went over all of the QBs in the draft and concluded that Ramsey is the equivalent of a 2nd round pick. He added that the Skins should put a condition on the pick that if Ramsey has a 3000 yd. year, we should get an additional pick as well. He was using the Jets as the example of a possible trading partner. They mentioned that Ramsey has thrown over 30 td's in the NFL and that NFL experience is valuable in trade considerations.

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm.........

I've been saying this for awhile...Ramsey is definitely worth a 2nd rounder. He's a known quantity...all the rookie QBs are unknowns (as far as how they'll perform in the NFL). For every Peyton Manning, there are 5 Heath Shulers.

[Om]

[AJ_Skins]

Coach Gibbs would disagree with those comments about Campbell.

Matter of fact, he said so himself last year.

I think Coach Gibbs likes to make positive comments about players, but I think it would be a mistake to bet too heavily on Campbell, or any other player who has never been in a game. Again, especially if our goal is to do better next year than we did last year, which is what everyone associated with the team has said.

As I've said before, if we can get somebody who's pretty reliable to replace him, I wouldn't have as much of a problem with it. Can we afford somebody like Kitna? Would he be able to step in and contribute immediately if needed? I don't know about that. I do know Ramsey has played well for the team in the past, and nobody is blowing us away with an offer.

[Gregpeck99]

I shudder to think of Brunell being the Skins QB next year even as a backup. Ramsey on the other hand is a capable, proven No. 2 at a very reasonable price. So what if we receive nothing for him at the end of the year ... by then Campbell will be firmly entrenched (or else). Gibbs is merely accomodating Patrick by letting him shop as he did with Gardner, but Gibbs is no ninny and will not accept token value. I think Pat will be quite willing to sit on the bench as No. 2 in B&G when he finds he has little market value and I'm equally sure that Gibbs (and Saunders) will feel comfortable with him in that role. There is no evidence, other than wishful thinking among the Ramsey haters, that Pat is good as gone. The Jets are in position to draft a QB and would probably want Kitna rather than Ramsey. The Lions are not likely to want another Harrington and the Fins probably are gonna sell the farm to get Brees. Look for No. 11 to be in DC for another year.

[Clark84]

Pat Kerwin from Sirius Radio just went over all of the QBs in the draft and concluded that Ramsey is the equivalent of a 2nd round pick. He added that the Skins should put a condition on the pick that if Ramsey has a 3000 yd. year, we should get an additional pick as well. He was using the Jets as the example of a possible trading partner. They mentioned that Ramsey has thrown over 30 td's in the NFL and that NFL experience is valuable in trade considerations.

Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm.........

Kerwin usually speaks with logic. Makes no sense to trade Ramsey just to trade him. If we cannot get at least a 3rd rounder then hang onto him for next year. As training camp approaches someone will be desperate and pull the trigger anyways.

[Hail Gibbs]

The Jets third rounder is like a low second rounder anyway, but maybe we could trade Ram and our #3 for their #2.

That is kind of what I was thinking. Since the Jets select so high in each round I think dealing our 2nd rounder and Ramsey for the Jets 2nd and 3rd could work. We would improve around 20 spots in the 2nd and get the 4th pick in the 3rd round. They get Ramsey and still have a 2nd rounder.

[Lil Kenzo]

A second round pick from the Jets does not sound to bad.

[Jon T.]

Not gonna happen. I do think that some team is going to get a bargain by trading for Ramsey. He's a steal even for a 3rd round pick. But the Redskins will be lucky to get that. There's just no market.