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tHE eAGLES ARE 1 ACL TEAR AWAY FROM 3-13


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Originally posted by Kilmer17

Very true, but if Davis goes down we may be in the same boat.

They wont break .500 with McNotaQB so Im sure they would suck even more without him.

The whole McNabb is not a QB thing is getting pretty old. So lets see, just because he's a good runner, he is not a good QB. Very intelligent thinking.

:finger:

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Originally posted by Kilmer17

Actually I base it on his 57% completion rating. His inabilty to throw "touch"passes. His slow read progressions. And his insistance on staying in the pocket trying to prove to the world he can be a pocket passer. He cant.

You're right, we should release him and sign one or two journeymen quarterbacks who can light it up in the preseason.

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Youve been trying to do that with every other position this year.

McNabb is certainly better than any other QB in the East. But his stats last year didnt even break the top 10 in yds, 3rd down conv, He was saved over and over by his defense. (Remember the second Skins game?) And this year his Defense has lost 4 out of the previous years starters.

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Sorry, but without McNabb there is no way in hell the Eagles could even come close to breaking .500. McNabb IS the Eagles offense. Their backup QBs are a joke and Deuce isn't the back that can carry an offense anymore.

You have to question the Eagles wisdom of not spending the cap dollars available to bring in some decent backup QB.

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Originally posted by laurent

Sorry, but without McNabb there is no way in hell the Eagles could even come close to breaking .500. McNabb IS the Eagles offense. Their backup QBs are a joke and Deuce isn't the back that can carry an offense anymore.

You have to question the Eagles wisdom of not spending the cap dollars available to bring in some decent backup QB.

True, the Eagles would take a huge loss if McNabb was hurt. What team wouldn't take a big hit if their starter went down? Other than the Redskins of course b/c there really isn't much of a difference between #1 and #3. But seriously, do you think the Redskins quarterbacks are much better than most backups in the league? AJ Feeley would probably push to be the starter this year.

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I hate seeing 'Skins fans rip on McNabb. Like we wouldn't want a guy like him on our team?! C'mon now.

McNabb has some accuracy issues, yes. But he still has plenty of room to improve, and I believe he will. Remember, he played in an option system in college, and there were doubts when he came out that he'd be able to adjust to the pros. I'd say under the circumstances he's adjusted quite well to the pro system, and also keep in mind he's operating the west coast offense, which can take a few years to master for any QB.

So lay off McNabb, 'Skins fans. Are you going to honestly tell me you'd take Matthews or Wuerffel over McNabb??!

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Thats a stupid comparison.

I would take the following QBs ahead of him

Manning

Warner

Garcia

Culpepper

Favre

Brunnell

Brady

Gannon

And would treat the following as equals

Dilfer

Jim Miller

Couch

Just because he is the best in the NFC East, doesnt mean a thing other than the NFC East has ****ty QBs.

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Originally posted by mattyk72

I hate seeing 'Skins fans rip on McNabb. Like we wouldn't want a guy like him on our team?! C'mon now.

McNabb has some accuracy issues, yes. But he still has plenty of room to improve, and I believe he will. Remember, he played in an option system in college, and there were doubts when he came out that he'd be able to adjust to the pros. I'd say under the circumstances he's adjusted quite well to the pro system, and also keep in mind he's operating the west coast offense, which can take a few years to master for any QB.

So lay off McNabb, 'Skins fans. Are you going to honestly tell me you'd take Matthews or Wuerffel over McNabb??!

Finally someone with some sense. I can understand that you guys all hate McNabb, you should, you're Skins fans. But don't pretend that he's not good. He's been to the Pro Bowl twice for a reason, and not as a running back, as a quarterback.

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Originally posted by mattyk72

So lay off McNabb, 'Skins fans. Are you going to honestly tell me you'd take Matthews or Wuerffel over McNabb??!

McNabb wouldn't fit in this system... he's a WCO QB and he's not suited for Spurrier's style of staying in the pocket and reading a defense... so in answer to your question, i would take Matthews and Wuerffel over McNabb IN SPURRIER'S OFFENSE...

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I guess Troy stirred up a hornets' nest in Philly with similar sentiments to Kilmer. This from an article on ESPN today:

It was the second quarter of last Friday's preseason game between the Eagles and the Ravens, a snore-fest played in front of half-empty Veterans Stadium, and the most compelling moment of the evening came when these words tumbled out of the mouth of Fox game analyst Troy Aikman: "Donovan (McNabb) at times is one of the least accurate passers I've ever seen," said Aikman. "And I know at times it drives Andy Reid crazy."

McNabb can still be very dangerous despite not being the most accurate passer around, however if the defense is able to keep him in the pocket by using a LB to spy (i.e. Lavar last year) then we have seen that he becomes very average.

Here are some other interesting tidbits from that ESPN article:

In the preseason, the Eagles' first team offense has been plagued by poor execution, dropped balls, missed opportunities, and almost no production. After two preseason games, head coach Andy Reid -- who rarely offers a negative comment about his team -- said: "We still have time in training camp to fix things. And they will be fixed."

But in the third preseason game, last Friday night's 13-12 loss to the retooling Ravens, the Eagles' first team offense was 0-6 on third down conversions and failed to find the end zone. In fact, in three preseason games, the first team offense did not score a touchdown against their opponents' first team defense. Against the Packers' second team D, they scored one running TD, meaning that McNabb has no touchdown passes in this preseason.

The argument from the Eagles is this: the preseason offense has been vanilla. There has been no game planning for the opposition and no red-zone package was installed prior to any game.

Of course, that logic doesn't wash. Why use the preseason to evaluate every other position on the field except the offense? And why, after the loss to Baltimore, did the Eagles feel compelled to finally sign free agent wide receiver Antonio Freeman, install him as the third wide receiver and, in the process, demote Freddie Mitchell, last year's first-round draft pick?

You don't demote a guy who has been your No. 3 receiver for the last 16 months unless you're unhappy with what you see on the field.

And the rationalization of a vanilla game plan doesn't explain this: On Friday night against Baltimore, McNabb's performance on third down consisted of holding onto the ball too long even though two receivers were wide open; throwing the ball over wide receiver Todd Pinkston's head; a sack; a completion to running back Dorsey Levens that resulted in a one-yard loss; an overthrow to Mitchell; and a pass that hit tight end Chad Lewis on the shoe tops, incomplete.

Then, in the two-minute drill at the end of the first half, McNabb found Pinkston on a crossing route that looked like a potential home run. Pinkston was running free and, with his speed, might have scored. But the ball was thrown too high and behind Pinkston. He had to stop to catch it and was tackled immediately.

So, the stark contrast between what was said before training camp and what the Eagles showed in the preseason games is what really created the nervousness -- especially considering that this preseason's offensive performance was a carbon copy of last year's regular season.

Last year, the Eagles offense converted just 30 percent of its third downs -- that ranked 29th in the league. Only Carolina and Arizona were worse. And in the first and third quarters, where the Eagles offense was less a function of McNabb's improvisational running ability and more Reid's scripted passing game, had a tough time scoring points. Philadelphia scored just 58 points in the first quarter -- 8th among the 12 playoff teams last year; and only 40 points in the third quarter -- 11th among the 12 playoff teams.

It was the Eagles defense that usually bailed out the team. They gave up only 208 points last year, second best in the league. In fact, the Eagles "D" gave up seven points or less in the first half nine times; they won eight of those games. Otherwise, they were 5-5.

So, which offense will show up? The suspense is killing this town. And everybody will have to wait. Reid has decided to sit McNabb in the final preseason game Friday night against the Jets at the Meadowlands.

I'm really anxious to see how things play out Week2. The pressure is all on Philly. If they live up to their billing and beat us, then that is what they are supposed to do. If SS and ML exploit their weaknesses and we beat them in front of a national audience, then we've taken a huge step toward winning the division, and Philly will have to do some serious regrouping.

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Mcnabb is a great QB. I'd start to worry if Philly ever goes to a more vertical passing attack. Then Mcnabb's short comings wouldn't be so obvious. He really is a young Randal Cunningham. Did anyonbe happen to notice what happened to cunningham when he went to a down the field passing attack with the Vikings? So long as the Philly OC continues to believe that a QB must make plays from the pocket, he will continue to limit Mcnabb's success. I'm alright with that. It's all about fitting the system with the personnel. IN this case, the match isn't perfect. Good.

As for hte QB's listed above, I'd point out Brunnel and Gannon are old, and a few others like Farve and Dilfer aren't young anymore either. As a GM, I'm not sure I'd trade Mcnab for them. However, if I were GM of Philly, I'd dictate that the OC better put in a system more condusive to a big mobile strong armed QB. Then I'd send the OC several game tapes of the Vikes and the Titan's offenses to copy.

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Originally posted by THiTo48

McNabb wouldn't fit in this system... he's a WCO QB and he's not suited for Spurrier's style of staying in the pocket and reading a defense... so in answer to your question, i would take Matthews and Wuerffel over McNabb IN SPURRIER'S OFFENSE...

McNabb's not even a West Coast QB...that's why he gets so much criticism.

Did any of you WATCH McNabb in college? He's a longball kinda QB. He played in an option attack at Syracuse, and when he threw the ball, he threw mostly medium-long range passes with some absolute BOMBS mixed in. Those kinds of QBs are NEVER the most accurate, but if you run a vertical offense, they are DEADLY. 57% completion out of a QB in an offense like that is more than Perfectly acceptable. Hell, as much as Donovan "Struggles" to play the QB position, he still throws for 3000+ yards and 25 TDs. Imagine what he could do if andy opened up that passing game, or junked that WCO all together. McNabb would be very Cunningham-like, indeed...probably better.

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Bingo - He's a potentially phenomenal QB who's hampered by an ill-suited system (why do all these teams keep copycatting the WCO regardless of their personnel) and a dearth of receiving talent.

As a WCO QB, his accuracy is quite suspect; but if Denny Green got a chance to run Philly's offense, I'd be crapping my pants like a Dallas DT...

By the way, I am sooooo Happy the Cowgirls wanna go WCO - Watch their O crash and burn, regardless of their premier draft.

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Kilmer ...

Jim Miller? Trent Dilfer? Ugh.

Look, if you think McNabb is overrated that's one thing, but to consider taking either of those journeymen over a 25 year old pro-bowler is crazy.

Either McNabb is the reason the Eagles offense goes or he isn't. I happen to think he IS the reason that offense works. Miller and Dilfer are simply caretaker QBs, who don't screw up long enough to let the rest of the offense do it's thing. I'd take McNabb over both of them put together.

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I said equal with. Starting from scrath Id probably choose McNabb over either of them. Both of them worked with less o talent than McNabb has had and Dilfer won a Superbowl. Sure his defense carried him theri, but McNabbs put him in the same position last year and he choked it.

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Originally posted by wildbill

Chris, Gus Ferotte made the prowl bowl also, and regardless of what you say, somewhere down deep you know if McNabb goes down you're looking at a below .500 record. Those are the facts brother, welcome to finally being a contender.

Eh? I hope you aren't talking to me, i think you have me confused with someone else. I didn't say anything about McNabb going down and the Eagles still contending. And im NOT an Eagles fan......

If McNabb goes down, the Eagles are in trouble. Any team would be if their #1 went down. Id say the Eagles would be looking at 7-9 or 6-10 minus McNabb.

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Originally posted by Henry

Kilmer ...

Jim Miller? Trent Dilfer? Ugh.

Look, if you think McNabb is overrated that's one thing, but to consider taking either of those journeymen over a 25 year old pro-bowler is crazy.

Either McNabb is the reason the Eagles offense goes or he isn't. I happen to think he IS the reason that offense works. Miller and Dilfer are simply caretaker QBs, who don't screw up long enough to let the rest of the offense do it's thing. I'd take McNabb over both of them put together.

Henry,

I see what you're saying. The problem is that the Philly offense just isn't very good. The Eagle defense is able to keep the opposition's point total low, plus give the offense the ball in advantageous field position, if not producing points itself. This allows McNabb to make a few plays to get the 17-21 points necessary to win the game.

Sure, he makes the offense go. But, being the straw that stirs a bland drink isn't stuff superstars are made of. The fact is, if the Eagle defense gave up another TD a game, the Eagles would be a sub-500 team, McNabb or not.

McNabb deservedly gets props because he is a winner and a leader. That offense would just be dreadful w/o him, but he is able to will it just enough to win ballgames. This works when the defense is as good as the Eagles defense is. The good thing about that approach is that defense is not prone to slumps like an offense is. But, if the defense has an off-game, the Eagles offense is incapable of bailing it out.

I like my QBs to be able to pick apart a defense. As such, I'm not a big fan of McNabb (for other than the obvious reasons). I respect his skills, but his passing ability remains questionable to me. So, yes, I would take a Dilfer (but not Miller) in an offense that demands QB accuracy over him, as I would Matthews in SOS' offense. I just don't see McNabb as having a natural feel for the passing game.

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