Underwater Ally Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 I still don't buy this line of thinking...We've gone 2-6 but NOT because of Brunell. He's been up and down for sure, but he was clearly out best bet this season at QB. It is becoming clear that we're not a playoff team, however, there was no way to know that even 3 weeks ago, so how can you call it a mistake to play Brunell? No, I don't blame Brunell for our losses in the sense that some blame him for turnovers and whatnot. If you want to be technical, I would even agree that playing him wasn't really a mistake, given that it seemed the best bet at the time. Given our record, there seems little difference either way in starting Ramsey vs. Brunell. What clearly was a mistake was signing him to begin with. Whatever Gibbs thought about his chances of winning with Ramsey, Brunell hasn't done any better. With both QBs already signed and on the roster, the difference between playing one or the other is minimal. Given what we paid to bring Brunell here, the direct cost (his salary) and the opportunity cost (other positions we could have upgraded with the money) is huge. It's like going out to dinner at a high price resturaunt with your wife only to have a big argument the whole time. If you are just going to fight, go to Wendy's. P.S. Post number 700. Goodbye Chris Cooley avatar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Coach Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 People tend to get lost in the numbers. A QB can complete two short passes in a row and miss on the third and his completion % is not harmed. A QB who converts a high percentage of 3rd downs can convert 4 out of 5 on the same drive and still end up punting the ball away. A QB who's team doesn't have many rushing TD's in the redzone will most likely have inflated TD numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underwater Ally Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 I agree with the Kid, Brunell is awesome. It's certainly not his fault we lost the last 3 games. very conseravtive play calling in the 4th quarter and penalties killed us. In the TB game, no offside penalty on the extra point and we would have been playing OT, and in the SD game, we were in field goal range at the end of the game until the holding call. The fact is Brunell has been really good this year. The loss of patten to take some heat of Moss really hurt, But how about Portis. Why not use CP in the passing game out of the backfield, that will make teams think twice about doubling Moss. In a roundabout sort of way I think you help make my point. Brunell has played well, not awesome, but well. The point is though, he's not playing well enough to make up for other possible weaknesses in the offense or in the playcalling. We are paying him a huge salary, despite having a lot of other needs where that money would be put to good use, to make that difference. Let me pose a question. Lets forget about the whole "Brunell is geat/no he isn't" debate. Given all the needs this team has, is Brunell's performance this year worth the contract we gave him? I just don't see how the answer is yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santanamoss89 Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 mark brunell has been much better than last year. hes having a great season besides the fumbles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 No, I don't blame Brunell for our losses in the sense that some blame him for turnovers and whatnot. If you want to be technical, I would even agree that playing him wasn't really a mistake, given that it seemed the best bet at the time. Given our record, there seems little difference either way in starting Ramsey vs. Brunell.What clearly was a mistake was signing him to begin with. Whatever Gibbs thought about his chances of winning with Ramsey, Brunell hasn't done any better. With both QBs already signed and on the roster, the difference between playing one or the other is minimal. Given what we paid to bring Brunell here, the direct cost (his salary) and the opportunity cost (other positions we could have upgraded with the money) is huge. It's like going out to dinner at a high price resturaunt with your wife only to have a big argument the whole time. If you are just going to fight, go to Wendy's. P.S. Post number 700. Goodbye Chris Cooley avatar I see your point and I agree with what you're saying. I just wish they had brought MB in for about $2-$3M per year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 People tend to get lost in the numbers. A QB can complete two short passes in a row and miss on the third and his completion % is not harmed. A QB who converts a high percentage of 3rd downs can convert 4 out of 5 on the same drive and still end up punting the ball away. A QB who's team doesn't have many rushing TD's in the redzone will most likely have inflated TD numbers. Don't get me wrong, I agree with everything you're saying here. The problem is, Brunell's completion percentage is anything but inflated. By him playing it safe sometimes, he chucks half of his incompletions into the stands to avoid sacks/turnovers. Additionally, he's been relatively accurate on longballs (as I mentioned earlier in this thread). The only point I would agree with 100% (when it comes to applying them to Brunell's numbers) is the last one. I do think he's probably thrown 3 or 4 short-range TDs when we've struggled to punch it in earlier in the year. The redzone running is actually something we've gotten a little better at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotgibbs? Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Brunell is definitely the sickest QB the skins have and he should be the one in there. keep the faith with the redskins...5-0 baby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIDETHEWALRUS Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Welcome one, welcome all, to the Mark Brunell show:Recently i have seen Mark come under a lot of critiscism on this board. And its very annoying. Brunell's ability to lead our 1-Reciever, 1-Tight end offense with its below average offensive line and Running Back who cant seem to establish the run currently, is outstanding. He has established himself as our starter when all thought he was done at the end of last year. Now his arm is fully recovered, his excellent deepball accuracy has proved one of Our major threats this season. With a reciever like moss, he is given more breathing room in the pocket, and when he rolls and throws on the run, his touch passes and his overall ability to find players for first downs is fantastic. And boy, when it all breaks down, he can startle defences by scrambling for first downs when they least expect. If Mark Brunell can lead us to a winning season, and build a foundation that Youngster Jason Campbell may take controll of next year, it will be an amzing acheivement. This post is not to critisize other players, but to Praise Magic Mark Brunell.:applause: :notworthy Sorry buddy, but it ain't week 4 anymore. He is starting to resemble MB of last year. I wish you were right, but sadly you are not. He has noticably slowed down as the season has progressed. He is letting balls sail again. His deep ball accuracy was never special. For example, the two bombs against dallas were both underthrown. had they had a safety that can cover we would have lost that game. I have ripped MB for quite some time now, and never hopped on the bandwagon when he was playing well. I will say that he has been vastly better this year as compared to last year, but unfortunately that is not enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachie Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Bravo to a great thread and to a fantastic quarterback. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIDETHEWALRUS Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 What are you talking about? Brunell could be the most accurate passer in the league! I can't think of 3 instances were he made an errant throw this year. when he gets time, he'll put the ball exactly where he wants to. I commented on his deep ball. He is very accurate with his underneath stuff and screens. This is reflected by his high competion percentage. You guys obviously don't pay attention to statistics. Brunell's completion % is 20th among passers with 200 or more attempts. That isn't exactly good. His 57.9% completion % is 10 % points behnd Palmer and Peyton. I think those guys might disagree with your assessment that Brunell is the most accurate passer in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIDETHEWALRUS Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 We are paying him a huge salary, despite having a lot of other needs where that money would be put to good use, to make that difference. Are we still paying him a huge salary? I thought he re-worked his contract in the off-season so we would have more $ to go after other guys. I respect him for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NAILBOMB9 Posted December 2, 2005 Share Posted December 2, 2005 Brunell sucks!! Plain and simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redphoenix Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 brunell isnt the reason were 5-6 ,its the ultra conservative playcalling in the 4 quarter that cost us most of our losses,as for brunell hes 5th in the nfc passing and has the least amount of ints also,its easy to blame the qb when your a fairweather fan,,hes the reason why moss and cooley will make the probowl hats off mr.brunell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawgjk9 Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 i think brunell has played very good for us...but as some people said not good enough to dominate the game. he needs so much time to throw it seems, and our average o-line gives it to him half the time. he fumbles almost everytime he gets hit and just cant make the number of plays on his own to compensate for the mistakes of the rest of the offense. i also agree with the guy that said that playing brunell was smart, but signing him to begin with was a mistake. i believe that if we would have spent that money on a DE or more DL help or a better #2 WR and have ramsey at QB, we'd be better than we are now...but thats just my opinion. that all being said brunell has been good for us and i do like him by the way, so dont jump on me sayin im a brunell hater or whatever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Good thread, good points by TD washingtond redksins and others, and good cheering by Chachie :laugh: While I was neber a fan of his, my only gripes with Brunell were overpaying (but that's on Gibbs and the FO) and that awful first season, for whatever reason. His performance has slupmed at times this year (with the rest of the team), but most of this season he's played very well indeed. Especially considering our schedule. He, like Portis, is so far down on the list of "reasons why we lost the games we did" in order of importance that it's a lot of the anti-mark talk is just silly. Sure he has some obvious shortcomings as a player, most do, but this season he has been one of our strengths overall, not one of our weaknesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Kenzo Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 All I know is that Brunell is not the reason why we have lopst six games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buck812 Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Brunnell is whats wrong with this team. We ended the season last year on a good note and then couldnt build on it. His record is what? Like 7-15 since he's been here! A whopping .318 winning percentage for a veteran QB is not good. He's a joke and this has to have been one of the worst trades in Skins history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chairmangao Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Sorry buddy, but it ain't week 4 anymore. He is starting to resemble MB of last year. I wish you were right, but sadly you are not. He has noticably slowed down as the season has progressed. He is letting balls sail again. His deep ball accuracy was never special. For example, the two bombs against dallas were both underthrown. had they had a safety that can cover we would have lost that game. I have ripped MB for quite some time now, and never hopped on the bandwagon when he was playing well. I will say that he has been vastly better this year as compared to last year, but unfortunately that is not enough. I'd have to disagree w/that. On the first pass, Brunell made a perfect throw and Santana caught it about 3 yds from the back of the end zone and rolled out of bounds. Had Brunell thrown it any farther, it would have sailed over everyone's head and out of the end zone. His second TD pass against Dallas was not underthrown either. Moss was sprinting for the end zone the whole time and did not need to slow down to wait for the ball. In Len Pasq.'s ESPN article, he quoted Moss saying something along the lines that that play was designed for Chris Cooley and Brunell always threw it to Cooley in practice, but after he started running his streak on that play, he realized that the safeties were playing really close to the line and he would have a chance to get a ball thrown to him. So you see that Brunell usually wouldn't have gone to Moss on that play, but both Moss and Brunell recognized the lack of a deep safety, and Brunell was able to make a perfect throw just beyond the reach of Glenn and Roy Williams. If he had underthrown it, one of the Dallas DBs would have picked it off or at least batted it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nflsbest26 Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 Redskins need to learn how to close out games.:logo: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrepDC Posted December 3, 2005 Share Posted December 3, 2005 It is ridiculous to claim Brunell is to blame for our struggles. People are over emphasizing his fumbles. Other than the fumbles, which have not been that bad imo, he has played great. The STATs aren't great but the on the field play is great imo. Some people are trying too hard to blame him for our problems and I don't understand why. If you look at him play he is doing great. When he is given a chance to make a play he does. He has even made some big plays on his own with his legs. I guess because he is the qb he is automatically blamed for a teams struggles, I thought that our fans had more football knowlege and could see our problems better. Brunell is not the problem, he is not flawless, but he is not as big of an issue as some would like to make it. Its not as easy as saying "we have lost 2-6 so Brunell must be bad." Brunell has been one of the positives this season imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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