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AP.How much do we miss Antonio Pierce


Dccat

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maybe alittle, but marshall is not the problem with the d.the d line is. everything starts with the line. and our ends get NO push and the big runs have been of the end.heck urlacher had his best year with ted washington and keith tralor in front of him beteen those guys no one could get to urlacher.we don't have that here so the backers are getting guards in their face.thats why i prefer bubba's (330pds) for the dt postion.though i admit that griffen is a monster.

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Of all the players that are gone from last year's team I will admit that AP is by far the most notable absence. He was like the D-coordinator on the field. Im not saying we would be 10-0 w/him but I think he has been missed. Coles, Smoot, Gardner....etc.....those were great decisions on not keeping them. We make some good decisions and some bad (every team does).....I think that if AP is the only bad decsion w/the changes that were made then we cant complain. Lets see how the Giants finish the season and how their defense ends up w/4 remaining divisional games and some tough out of division games remaining. I think AP and Strahan make everyone better.

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:doh:

Pierce was horrible in pass coverage, he gave up a number of TDs last year in that respect

Marshall is a converted DB, and he's been great in pass coverage

Oh, hum, was he smoked in coverage by a TE just a week or 2 ago right down the middle?

AP is FAR better than Marshall is in the middle, much better against the run, pass rushing and just leading the defense.

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This is the biggest mistake I've seen on the board this year. Marshall is better than Pierce. The only reason I can see for disagreeing is that Marshall doesn't pat the lineman on the ass and get them to move every down. Pierce had 1 sack last year, and 2 tackles behind the line of scrimmage, and 2 interceptions. Marshall in 9 games has 2 sacks, 3 stuffs and 1 interception.

As for the pass coverage, we are the 5th best team in the league covering tight ends. And in case you've forgotten we've played against Witten, Gonzalez, Shockey, LJ Smith already this year.

In terms of player switch offs, we've been better off with Moss over Coles, slightly better with Marshall over Pierce and worse off with Harris over Smoot.

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:doh:

Pierce was horrible in pass coverage, he gave up a number of TDs last year in that respect

That seems to be forgotten by the people who think we let go of Mike Singletary when Pierce left.

Great brain and had a bit of athleticism, but benefitted from having two solid DT's in-front of him. Lemar hasn't had that luxury and our Defensive problems are hardly the fault of the MLB position. The MLB's first job is to defend against the rush and Pierce got his lunch eaten by larger backs like Bettis.

I miss Pierce for his brain moreso than anything else, but Marshall has been playing his socks off. Not perfect, but certainly much better than anyone expected.

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Marshall is better than Pierce?

It didn't seem like he has been in on as many tackles to me, so I checked the stats.

This year, Pierce has 62 solos for the Giants. Marshall has 45.

Pierce led the team in tackles last year as you'd expect of a MLB. Marshall is tied with M.Washington this year.

The Giants upgraded both in smarts and ability. We downgraded. You can spin it all you want, but that's not good.

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This is the biggest mistake I've seen on the board this year. Marshall is better than Pierce. The only reason I can see for disagreeing is that Marshall doesn't pat the lineman on the ass and get them to move every down. Pierce had 1 sack last year, and 2 tackles behind the line of scrimmage, and 2 interceptions. Marshall in 9 games has 2 sacks, 3 stuffs and 1 interception.

As for the pass coverage, we are the 5th best team in the league covering tight ends. And in case you've forgotten we've played against Witten, Gonzalez, Shockey, LJ Smith already this year.

In terms of player switch offs, we've been better off with Moss over Coles, slightly better with Marshall over Pierce and worse off with Harris over Smoot.

Harris has had 2 bad games true, but he was great a Dallas, and has been decent until recently. Smoot's been getting killed all year. See Steve Smith.

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Marshall is better than Pierce?

It didn't seem like he has been in on as many tackles to me, so I checked the stats.

This year, Pierce has 62 solos for the Giants. Marshall has 45.

Pierce led the team in tackles last year. Marshall is tied with M.Washington.

The Giants upgraded both in smarts and ability. We downgraded. You can spin it all you want, but that's not good.

Different systems mean different amount of tackles. Also when you have Washington and Arrington on either side of you, you're going to make less tackles. Pierce made 110 tackles last year, Marshall is on pace for 96.

That and using number of tackles to measure who's a better player is useless. Well unless you consider Andra Davis and Nick Barnett to be top 5 linebackers in the league.

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There has to be some reason our D has given up a lot more points than last year. Our D is certainly not as effective.

Losing Antonio is a factor but offensive adjustments to Gregg Williams' blitzes weighs much more heavily, I think.

The Pierce factor is more important when we play the Giants, of course.

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There has to be some reason our D has given up a lot more points than last year. Our D is certainly not as effective.

Reasons:

1. Significant injuries on the DL - Griffin and Salavea have both been out or playing injured during the season. Not a lot of high quality depth behind them.

2. Holdman did not play well at WLB. Lemar Marshall was much better last year.

3. Walt Harris played extremely well last year as nickel corner. He's had greater responsibilities this year but the DL has allowed QBs more time to throw the ball. Rogers should have replaced Smoot but was out early in the season with ankle injuries.

4. We lost Pierce to free agency. Combination of Pierce at MLB and Marshall at WLB was better than Marshall at MLB and Holdman at WLB.

I hope the Skins use the next draft for the DL. Not sure if Lavar is in the long-term plans on the Skins. If not, we will need another LB (either WLB or MLB). Marshall can play either so Skins have some flexibility. Bowen may wind up being cut since his playing time has diminished but he still has a starters salary.

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Last year Smoot was one of the most consistent players on our team. This year he is much worse off for whatever reasons.

Steve Smith burns everyone!!!!

Lemar Marshall is really good at coverage. and by teh TE beating him over the middle a couple of weeks ago, you are probably thinking of Tony Gonzalez. If you remember corectly he stole a pass away from him also, but was called Def pass interference(a BS call btw).

Cornilius(sp) makes our entire defense better as does Sean Taylor.

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Honestly I don't think we miss him that much at all. Marshall has been solid.

The number one problem is without a doubt is our absolute inability to put pressure on the QB. Opposing QBs week to week sit back and have way too much time to deliver the football. This leads to a lot less turnover opportunities and also puts a lot more pressure on our secondary.

Last year our secondary played excellent and our Safety and CB blitzes were much more effective, so the scheme worked.

This year the quality of the secondary has decreased due to personnel and injury and for some reason our blitzing from the secondary has largely been unsuccessful.

We need Griffin back first and foremost, then Taylor and then we need a pulse from our DEs.

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I do think we miss him somewhat, and to say otherwise is foolish. What we probably miss more than anything is his leadership ability and getting people in the right spots. I don't know if we do that nearly as well without him.

That being said, I can't argue about the Skins decision on him. Every year, you need to make tough decisions about your roster, and of all the players that left, that was probably the toughest.

I think the Skins will be fine eventually, with either Marshall growing into the role, or someone else (McCune?) eventually subplanting him. Probably going to be the former.

Jason

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There has to be some reason our D has given up a lot more points than last year. Our D is certainly not as effective.

Yes here are the reasons as I see them in order:

1. Griffin was injured and we lacked the push up the middle and general stuffing of offfense.

2. We were forced to downgrade on #2 CB position

3. Taylor was injured and we missed his presence in the secondary

4. We were starting a LB who for whatever reason was not up to NFL standards

5. Secondary blitz is largely ineffective

6. We lost Pierce

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