AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Any time a new coaching staff comes in, there are going to be changes. Players will be released and others signed. We've seen a lot of players who started for us prominently at one time come and go over recent years. Rod Gardner, Laveranues Coles, Fred Smoot, Champ Bailey...fine. All could be said to have been "me-first" players on some level, mercenaries who didn't really care about the team or the fans. They didn't want to be here, the coaches didn't want them to be here, ultimately not a net loss for the team. But now Coach Gibbs and his staff appear to be taking the same approach to Patrick Ramsey and LaVar Arrington. Whatever shortcomings these two may have, neither of them falls into the same category as the others. They've been for the most part model players. When other players on the team were staging a mutiny against Marty, LaVar bought in, and turned the season around for us. Ramsey has never spoken publicly against the team, even though he's been treated like a red-headed stepchild repeatedly. Both of them seem like basically good guys, and both of them have been totally loyal to the team and the fans. Both of them are now on the bench. Granted, LaVar made some ill-advised waves with some of his comments after his injury and with the contract dispute, and Ramsey has had some issues in his play, but both of them now seem to be on the outs with the staff on some deeper level...as if a decision has been made to "weed them out", and nothing they do is going to change it. Say what you want about Ramsey, but he has never played as poorly as Brunell did last year. Brunell got 9 games to ruin our season, Ramsey got one quarter, and then Gibbs got his "chance" to yank him for Brunell and did it. LaVar seems to be being punished, and in both cases, the staff is sending a message that seems to be "go screw yourselves". Both of these guys were first round draft picks. Unlike the other malcontents that drifted off, these guys have been great Redskins. Whatever is going on here, I hope that Coach Gibbs and the rest of the staff will reconsider what seems to be the silent death sentence they've passed on these two guys. They may need some work, but they deserve better. They at least deserve a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Enough about Ramsey. As far as Lavar is concerned he is still nursing an injury or at least the staff feels he isn't 100%. No need for alarm just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Or perhaps they just feel that Ramsey and Arrington make too many mistakes. Ramsey with his turnovers and bad decisions, and Arrington with his freelancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't think the two situations are necessarily the same. It may appear that way, but with one I think it's play, the other is a guy who whined about being brought back too soon, and now there are some concerns because he did have to have his knee drained and they want to make sure he's 100%. I hope so, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 LA will be back in when he is deemed 100% physically and mentally. Hopefully it will coincide with some points on the board from a revitalised O so he can be let off the leash. When that day comes he will inspire and set the level for some ball stealing/head stomping/QB humping action. I don't expect him back until GW can see in his eyes that when he calls a play he can trust it will be implemented. Remember GW calls a play to set up stopping a drive over 4 downs. LA playstyle is to stop it in one. Hopefully LA can see that GW's calls work and fit within then bring his added zing to the table. Think chess and set up the killer move. I'm interested in what happens when we get more than 14 in front. I bet GW has a bunch of plays that will utilise the individual talents of the players at his disposal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't think it's fair to assume that anything like that is being done. I think the staff is doing its best to get the best football team on the field each and every week...regardless of whether that includes all the "names" from the previous regimes. To me, that is refreshing. I'd prefer we had an entire team of nobodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autographcollector Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Can someone tell me HOW do we keep Lavar after this year with our cap situation? I think we are playing who will be here next year, and it aint Lavar.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't know...the more I see of this, the more I think it's some kind of a battle of wills. Both of them were kind of entrenched before Gibbs got here, and maybe he doesn't feel like they're "getting with the program" the way he wants them too. If that's the case you don't play a passive-aggressive game with them, benching them on false pretenses and then waiting for them to figure it out on their own. You bring them in, sit them down face -to-face and tell them, "I need you to get with the program". Regardless of how anyone has played, there was just something wrong about the way Gibbs handled Ramsey, the way he made that move. Something about it just seemed....cowardly. Now that LaVar is apparently right there in the same situation, I think there is definitely something else going on in both cases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood2k3 Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I really don't have that much simpathy for Ramsey because he's too turnover prone and i'm tired of people makin' excuses for him like he's a rookie. I don't care how many coaches he's had, in your 4th year in the NFL you should be better than you were in your 1st. Ramsey still doesn't look like a starting NFL QB IMO As far as LaVar, I totally agree. If they are tryin' to send some kind of message I hope they're done with that. Because plain and simple, if LA is healthy then he should be on the field, PERIOD! But if it's a matter of the staff thinkin' he'll hurt the D by his freelancing, then put him in and give him a shot to prove he can stay within' the system. I think LaVar is a Redskin at heart and he's played his heart out for us, he deserves a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarb Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 We're seeing a pattern alright, AJ. You have no respect for a Hall of Fame coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autographcollector Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 We're seeing a pattern alright, AJ. You have no respect for a Hall of Fame coach. :notworthy :notworthy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neophyte Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I am sensing a trend in your posting AJ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Can someone tell me HOW do we keep Lavar after this year with our cap situation?I think we are playing who will be here next year, and it aint Lavar.... That could be it. Gibbs made "executive decisions" in the offseason (see Campbell) that both of these guys won't be here next year, and he's just letting them twist in the wind instead of telling them the truth. "Oh yeah Pat, you'll get a chance to start"..."Oh yeah, LaVar...we just want you healthy". If so, that's cold-hearted as hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't know...the more I see of this, the more I think it's some kind of a battle of wills. Both of them were kind of entrenched before Gibbs got here, and maybe he doesn't feel like they're "getting with the program" the way he wants them too. If that's the case you don't play a passive-aggressive game with them, benching them on false pretenses and then waiting for them to figure it out on their own. You bring them in, sit them down face -to-face and tell them, "I need you to get with the program". Regardless of how anyone has played, there was just something wrong about the way Gibbs handled Ramsey, the way he made that move. Something about it just seemed....cowardly. Now that LaVar is apparently right there in the same situation, I think there is definitely something else going on in both cases. Where are you getting the standard for how to bench players? Coaches have their ways of doing it. If Gibbs would prefer to save a player publicly than to come out and say "Lavar isn't a team player" or "Patrick is too mistake-prone" then I'm all for him being that type of coach. Gibbs has never been the type of coach who will call a player out publicly so this "passive-aggressive" approach is all he's got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 We're seeing a pattern alright, AJ. You have no respect for a Hall of Fame coach. What do you mean no respect? It's not a matter of respect or no respect. It's a matter of trying to understand what's going on here, because something doesn't smell right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHUBAKAH Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 We're seeing a pattern alright, AJ. You have no respect for a Hall of Fame coach. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooka Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't see what Lavar has to do with Gibbs. Lavar started against Dallas. How much he plays is up to Williams. If Greg Williams wants Holdman in there right now then I'll support it. As for Patrick... He got his shot and he blew it. Gibbs gave Ramsey one last chance to start after a mediocre pre-season and Pat didn't step up his game. If he had played better against Chicago he would've kept his starting job. Stop blaming Gibbs. Ramsey could've kept the job but he gave Gibbs an excuse to go back with Brunell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 the coaches are playing who they feel gives the team the best chance to win. right or wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Where are you getting the standard for how to bench players? Coaches have their ways of doing it. If Gibbs would prefer to save a player publicly than to come out and say "Lavar isn't a team player" or "Patrick is too mistake-prone" then I'm all for him being that type of coach. Gibbs has never been the type of coach who will call a player out publicly so this "passive-aggressive" approach is all he's got. The problem with that is, based on both of their reactions, he hasn't let them in on his reasons either. Maybe he has. I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autographcollector Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 That could be it. Gibbs made "executive decisions" in the offseason (see Campbell) that both of these guys won't be here next year, and he's just letting them twist in the wind instead of telling them the truth. "Oh yeah Pat, you'll get a chance to start"..."Oh yeah, LaVar...we just want you healthy". If so, that's cold-hearted as hell. Now you do know Lavar whined and moaned and blame the coaches for bringing him back too fast and they caused further injury....and he wasn't coming back this time until he was ready....well he got what he wished for... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 I don't see what Lavar has to do with Gibbs. Lavar started against Dallas. How much he plays is up to Williams.If Greg Williams wants Holdman in there right now then I'll support it. As for Patrick... He got his shot and he blew it. Gibbs gave Ramsey one last chance to start after a mediocre pre-season and Pat didn't step up his game. If he had played better against Chicago he would've kept his starting job. Stop blaming Gibbs. Ramsey could've kept the job but he gave Gibbs an excuse to go back with Brunell. Uh huh...one simple question...why did Brunell get 9 games last year and Ramsey only got one quarter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 What do you mean no respect? It's not a matter of respect or no respect. It's a matter of trying to understand what's going on here, because something doesn't smell right. Good God...then go sniff a different team man. I sit through WAY too long an offseason to sit here and second-guess every single personnel decision on a 2-0 team. Do the Skins have flaws? Absolutely. But I'm happy to enjoy the season while it's here. Why don't we resume the QB discussion when we have 8 months of offseason to deal with...for now, let's just back our guys and root them on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooper Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Right or wrong, Gibbs and Williams are simply playing the guys they think give the team the best chance to win. It's that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ_Skins Posted September 27, 2005 Author Share Posted September 27, 2005 Now you do know Lavar whined and moaned and blame the coaches for bringing him back too fast and they caused further injury....and he wasn't coming back this time until he was ready....well he got what he wished for... Yeah, but there should be conversations...explanations to the players that we expect this, that and the other with regard to X, Y and Z. The way both of them have reacted suggests that hasn't happened. It seems like they just rubbed Gibbs the wrong way one time, and they've been on death watch ever since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
autographcollector Posted September 27, 2005 Share Posted September 27, 2005 Right or wrong, Gibbs and Williams are simply playing the guys they think give the team the best chance to win. It's that simple. parroting Bubba tonight???? :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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