FootballZombie

This thread needs more visual gags.

Oh no! A source with absolutely no name attached seems to be making stuff up. Who woulda thunk it.

I guess that depends on what your expectations are. Nobody should be expecting CJ Stroud pt 2. If a rookie plays plus football in year 1 they are generally hailed.

Nope, same definition of pressure. Those were the numbers provided by PFF for plays vs pressure, not vs blitz. It was the result of passes thrown when defenders were close. Obviously, they were pretty good. JD has demonstrated a great ability to dissect a D from the pocket vs pressure. Especially when compared to the other top prospects who noticeably struggled in the same department. What JD has not shown is a strong enough tendency to pass if he breaks said pocket. He ran like 90% of the time in those situations. He will have to throw more often in the NFL rather than tucking it when he does bail. And beyond that even on the plays where he chose to keep it himself, its not like he didn't murder-ize teams w/ his legs vs pressure, its more of a case of what is a good call in college not being as much of one in the NFL. We know directly from the horses mouths that in college, he was instructed by his coaches to run. We have posters here who broke down film that came away with the conclusion that the designed "Hot" read for a play was Jayden's legs by design. At the next level you want him throwing more passes. We will have to see if he can do that at a higher clip. As I said he did not do it a lot so I can't just blindly award him the ability. But all that said, I like Jayden's play vs pressure a lot more than the other top prospects overall. He's got stuff to work on, but who doesn't

Jacoby did not play a lot, but he took zero sacks. and if your so afraid of a QB that you have to demolish your own defensive identity to that extent then the battle is already halfway won. I've changed your defensive philosophy away from whatever it was you do best to something your likely not as good at. Its hard enough to succeed in the NFL doing what you do best. Furthermore vs pressure dude had a 124 NFL passer rating, threw no pics, had an 11% big time throw rate w/ an 82 PFF Offensive grade last year. Giving him easy reads is like leading lambs to the slaughter.

Pretty much. Pro QBs can't even determine correct order of operations on film. We don't know what the player is instructed to do. Kurt Warner hits this all the time in his breakdowns "That's not how I would read it, but that may be what he was told to do" What I can say is that if a QB looks at a guy, notices he is covered and then subsequently rifles thru following progressions until he finds someone open, that is generally a good thing. If a QB takes forever to move thru his progressions, that is a bad thing. If a QB is throwing to guys who are not open, without making multiple reads, that a very bad thing. There is even value in hitting your first read if hes open. If your going out there pre-snap and figuring out that option "X" is gonna be open because they are likely playing "Y" defense, good on you. U gotta get that prospect in a film room, ask him what he saw and why he did what he did on any given play, and we simply are not privy to that info.

Can't make that kind of comparison my guy. That is woefully oblivious to the idea that a QB that is a fast processor and gets the ball out will face less pressure than a guy who historically stands there and holds the ball for an eternity. JD improves the Oline in front of him just by being on the field. Logan Paulsen has hit on this repeatedly. You can't rush him the same way, or as fast. I would not expect JD to face as many pressures as Howell did last year playing behind the same Oline. Kinda like how Brissett looked different in the same environment. If blanket covering methodology like that was acceptable we'd be seeing lines of thinking like: If JD threw as many passes as Maye did last year his numbers would be so gawdy other countries would decry his use in games as a war crime. Pre snap reads are looking over the D formation before a play and either getting yourself into a favorable playcall against said D (audible), or figuring out the order of operations when it comes to your own progression tree. What may be read #1 vs some Ds, could be read #3 vs others. Post snap reads are both your progressions thru your passing tree and identifying any changes the D makes, and reacting accordingly. A lot of the better Ds in college will show you one thing pre-snap, only to completely change their D post snap. If say a pressure package was well disguised but you pick it up post snap, your hot route could become your new #1 read on a given play. Post snap reads are obviously more time constraining but it can be hard in general to gauge aptitude in college as players do not face the same complexities w/ some guys going against more advanced adversaries on average that throw more at the QB. Some QBs facing easier teams simply don't take the same test as others.

You always leave the door open to godfather offers. Problem is somebody has to offer it. The chances of that deal coming across the table is slim to none. The kind of compensation needed to move us or the Pats off our spot is astronomical. You'd pretty much have to be a moron to pay that price. But if someone wants to get froggy and do something royally stupid? Doors open.

I saw someone posted the rankings, but I don't think I've seen anyone post the vid w/ associated explanations. Unfortunately there are no timestamps in the vid but someone in the comments posted this so you can jump around to the prospects your interested in. Its not a long watch if you only review the sections involving WIlliams, Daniels and Maye like me. 8:35 Caleb Williams 14:48 Jayden Daniels 16:36 J.J. McCarthy 18:38 Drake Maye 20:55 Michael Penix Jr. 24:02 Bo Nix 27:05 Jordan Travis 27:46 Joe Milton

I agree for the most part. If you want to say a guy was hurt or suffered from "X", fine whatever. But it does not give you the right to claim a newfangled reality where a prospect is the complete opposite of whatever problem was displayed. That is simply giving credit for things a prospect did not display, show or earn, and is pure wishcasting. Its also a good way to get hella burned. You wanna know when you can say Maye is a good decision maker that does not hero ball it all the time? When he puts it on film. You wanna know when JD can be a guy you rely on to protect himself properly? When he puts it on film. Sure there are surrounding circumstances that add to those issues an likely made them worse, but you are what your film says you are. I'm not bringing in Maye with the thought that he is some high level quality decision maker in the same way I don't expect JD to be a sliding savant. I'd do everything in my power to accelerate the learning process around these issues (see previous posts involving Rafiki and Da Slide Coach) but I don't give them the stamp of approval until I see it on the field.

I don't agree w/ that. The game plan changes radically when your facing a high impact duel threat QB. You can't rush the passer in the same manner as rush lanes and rush discipline takes priority. DBs have to be able to keep their eyes in the backfield to help assist on the outside, making trail technique more risky. Spies are almost mandatory Makes the play truly 11-on-11 when the QB fakes/runs. That is nightmare scenario for DCs as you are likely taken out of playing the way you want to before the kickoff even occurs. We have heard this from coaches from virtually every level as well.

Even harder to see a trade down happen at pick 2 in a draft w/ 3 blue chip prospects. Pick #3 is the pressure point to get into the party. I agree that is exceedingly unlikely we move off the spot and I got chances of us getting JJ in the Caleb range. I just need the Pats to hold their water and take the 3rd guy so the Giants don't get the oppo to. I'm pretty sure New England will but a Godfather deal is a Godfather deal.

Mariota checks a ton of boxes. We could not just grab any vet QB. -Had to be a guy who would have to provide a positive impact on a rook and help him come along. That requires some level of history working alongside young talent. You absolutely don't want a guy who will simply be there to compete for his own personal interest and have the "its no my job to mentor" mentality. (See Tannehill-Willis, its bad for everybody) Mariota has worked alongside young talent in the shape of Ridder and Hurts and we have had positive takeaways from his work with them. -Had to probably be a guy who would have to be comfortable not being given a handshake deal to start given our situation in the draft. Mariota in his opening presser made very clear he is willing to do whatever the org wants him to. If they need him to be big bro and mentor a dude he is game, if he has gotta come in and start he'd do it to. -If your want to run a playbook with a lot of QB runs, similar to what Kliff and Johnson have done in the past, then you need a guy who can run. Mariota can run. -Willing to come for 6 Mil. Pretty cheap. -He has a history of working with some of our staff as recently as last season. Makes the transition easier.

So many players have to fear for their job security lol. Triple A guys r killing it.

I'm pretty sure we will bring in Maye for a Top 30 visit too which will make this line of thinking look silly but aside from that, this has gotta be one of the takes of all time. You can't see any good reasons to bring in a QB your considering w/ a top #2 pick? Not one?

He goes out of his way to say his sources on Maye and JD are from around the NFL. but that JJ stuff pretty much HAS TO come from a primary team source.

This is still carrying me thru this offseason.

News guys, twitter even mocks... The last week has shown a clear shift in group think. Even a month ago the numbers were super close. Now a gap is forming. https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/mock-drafts/2024/consensus-mock-draft-one-week-2024 (I set the scale to 1 week) Of course this aint concrete data or nothing. Just for fun.

1st story on ESPNs sidebar. Orioles prospects light up for 26 runs in record-setting show https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/39871935/orioles-prospects-26-runs-record-setting-show Heston Kjerstad went 5-for-7 with two home runs and 10 RBIs Kyle Stowers had three homers, four hits and seven RBIs Jackson Holliday had four hits At what point do you bench guys as a favor to the other team?

Don't think I saw this posted. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39872515/sources-caleb-williams-visits-bears-ahead-nfl-draft Sources: Caleb Williams visits with Bears ahead of NFL draft USC quarterback Caleb Williams was inside Halas Hall on Wednesday for his pre-draft visit with the Bears, sources confirmed to ESPN. Williams, the presumptive No. 1 pick in the NFL draft, dined with Bears brass Tuesday before taking his prospect visit Wednesday, sources said.

Whoa If your gonna dream, dream big I guess...

I don't think any of these guys who have been saying we are leaning towards JD have claimed to have information from our team. Not that I have seen anyway. Most of them go out of their way to let us know that our brass is being airtight, or to let us know that they are not 100% confident in the info. From what I can gather, anyone who made some kind of attempt to cite their sources went with the line of thinking that when polling the rest of the league, the selection is JD over Maye by some significant margin. Enough so, that you would think the average NFL team (that would be us) would probably align with said consensus big board. The only person who claims to have inside info is that un-named former NFL exec from Twitter who somehow has the scoop on what multiple teams are going to do and totally has a girlfriend in Canada... and Keim when he specifically says JJ at 2 is seriously unlikely. That has to come from a team source.

Looks like in terms of Top 30 visits Jayden and Penix are still the only QBs who has a confirmed visits w/ us. I expect that to change at some point, but they are clearly taking their dear sweet time in that department. Also interested to see who the Patriots are looking at (don't want some guys leaking their way to the Giants) Cherry picking, they have visits set up w/ Jayden, Drake and JJ and I have seen reports of Bo Nix as well. I don't think JD has actually met w/ anybody Top 30 wise yet. The Giants met w/ Maye in house already, I think that is the only one he has actually completed.

God tier trivia question for the future.

Sounds like Schefty is about where Keim is. He probably hears enough from around the league that you would think the average team would mirror it and lean towards Daniels, but not enough from the right places (the team itself) that you can lock it in w/ all confidence. I can live with that, and feel good about that. I don't have JD and Maye separated by a lot if anything myself so I don't discount the idea that its a hard choice.