KDawg

Next Day Thread: Redskins vs. Colts

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Well, here we are. Day after. Thoughts? -Rob Kelley being the power back when Adrian Peterson and Samaje Perine are on the roster is a mistake. -The read option is not a great use of Alex Smith. -Tony Bergstrom coming in at center when Scherff went down was a terrible plan. Roullier is a better center than guard and by moving him to guard and putting Bergstrom in we weakened ourselves in two places instead of one. That A-Gap was unprotected all afternoon. -Checkdown Alex came to play. I like Smith. I think he fits the Skins. But some of the check downs were on him and some were on Gruden. Have to throw the ball down the field. -Kerrigan has been invisible through two games. Makes me a touch nervous. -Ion is a bonafide stud. Just destroys people inside. Allen and Payne were spotty but okay. -I thought all in all the DBs played well. Really impressed by Dunbar and Swearinger so far this season. -Our wide receivers are MIA. But I'd like to see Vernon Davis more involved in the offense. There's only so many footballs to go around, but Davis and Reed need to be getting some of them. -The Colts defensive line is fast and athletic. -Injuries are starting to become a major concern for Trent Williams. Starting this offseason the Skins may want to look at finding a replacement. Not necessarily for next season, but if a LT prospect falls to them in the draft that they really like it's time to pull the trigger and figure out the configuration of the line after. 71 is a stud and probably my favorite current Skin just due to his longevity and how he's stuck it out. But these injuries are piling up quick for the big fella.

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We aren’t versatile on offense there’s no ingenuity in the play calling  calling out Gruden Callahan and Alex smith for this loss...

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The week after a “big” win, at home, when most pundits picked us to win. Did you expect the Skins to do anything else but lay an egg?

 

If you have been watching this team for the past 2+ decades you would have known yesterday’s outcome before it even happened.

 

Within one minute you could tell how the game was going to play out. Giving up big chunks on the ground, couldn’t stop the quick passes, losing on 3rd and longs and no pressure. Stop me if you’ve heard that song before.

 

If you have any type of intuition or gut feeling you could tell one minute in, the game was over. Should be another reminder that a wait and see approach is probably best. Last weeks win, might be like our win against the Raiders last year. Hollow.

 

 

 

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I hate to see teams stunting successfully on our OL, yet our DL stays in lanes and sucks all day. 

 

Jay seems predictable in his play calling. He abhors hurry up, yet yesterday seemed a fine time to use it, and gas some of Indy's stunting DL. I would love to see him come out pass happy for a series, to start a game. Once a year. If are going to commit to AP running, make sure to include a flea flicker or trick play out of it, and put teams on notice for it even though we all know we won't use it again. All to make it more difficult for DCs to game plan for us, and who knows, maybe some of those crazy ideas may actually work.

 

Our WR's scare no one.  Even if we brought in Dez or Gordon, they would get a snap a 2 per game and wouldn't be a difference maker.  I would like to see Thompson or Jordan Reed lined up wide more, since our depth WRs never make a difference anyways.  We have some depth at RB and TE, yet are paper thin at WR.

 

At least Swearinger reaffirmed his leadership role on D.

 

This is the NFL.  Good one week, and then look lost the next.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by RandyHolt

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Smith was a giant waste of investment, our WRs suck besides Crowder, our o-line is inconsistent, we generate no pass rush from our edge rushers, our ILBs can’t cover for crap, Norman is playing way below his pay level. 

 

There you go:

Edited by JoggingGod
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What 30 carries from Peterson week 1.

 

3 carries yesterday by half and 11 total. Game plan was garbage amd the coaching is garbage. Defense had very little pass rush, but at least they got 2 turnovers. 

 

This game was lost because Gruden and the offense are useless. WRs are real bad and after listening to Adam S today. I say trade for Gordon, he will cost a team a total of 2 million over 2 years.

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Josh Norman is paid.  He has to make that tackle in the end zone.  He got toasted a few times by Hilton.  Not earning that paycheck.

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1 minute ago, -JB- said:

Josh Norman is paid.  He has to make that tackle in the end zone.  He got toasted a few times by Hilton.  Not earning that paycheck.

He hasn’t earned that paycheck since he arrived. He’s a mediocre CB that had an outlier great season behind an elite Panthers front 7.

 

We could have had William Jackson instead of $75 million Norman and heartless Doctson.

Edited by JoggingGod
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Maybe its me, but does Smith have a really long wind-up before throwing?

 

Anyhoo, as last year and previous seasons before, I hoped the Redskins would finally come out and win at least the first few games then lose one, but its just not meant to be.

Its the same song and dance with Gruden, lack and refusal to adjust in-game, instead sticking to his game plan, not attacking weaknesses and getting ahead of the curve in the coaching battle, letting opponents take the advantage and the lead. I believe there's enough talent on this team to be a lot better than what was put on the field sunday, and that falls upon Gruden's lap.

 

Preparation, adjusting, and attacking weaknesses, offensively and defensively. I saw none of that, only individual flashes here and there by players, nothing to do with coaching.

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6 minutes ago, RandyHolt said:

 

This is the NFL.  Good one week, and then look lost the next.

 

 

Only reason they looked good week 1 is because the Cards are horrible. They got past the 50 yard line once yesterday and that was the 2nd to last play of the game. 

2 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

He hasn’t earned that paycheck since he arrived. He’s a mediocre CB that had an outlier great season behind an elite Panthers front 7.

 

We could have had William Jackson instead of $75 million Norman and heartless Doctson.

 

I agree Norman is more mouth than anything. He hasnt beem good at all in my opinion.

Edited by desertbeagle85

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3 minutes ago, skins island connection said:

Maybe its me, but does Smith have a really long wind-up before throwing?

 

Anyhoo, as last year and previous seasons before, I hoped the Redskins would finally come out and win at least the first few games then lose one, but its just not meant to be.

Its the same song and dance with Gruden, lack and refusal to adjust in-game, instead sticking to his game plan, not attacking weaknesses and getting ahead of the curve in the coaching battle, letting opponents take the advantage and the lead. I believe there's enough talent on this team to be a lot better than what was put on the field sunday, and that falls upon Gruden's lap.

 

Preparation, adjusting, and attacking weaknesses, offensively and defensively. I saw none of that, only individual flashes here and there by players, nothing to do with coaching.

He honestly reminds me of RG3 except less injury prone.

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Seriously, if we had any hope for 'change', this was the game. 

 

Unreal, same ol Skins.

 

And we don't know how good or bad Indy is, but our offense is atrocious. WR's obviously can't win matchups (or even catch very well). Our TE was MIA most of the game and when we may have fractional chance to win he fumbles (inexcusable). O line simply can't run block, forget Guice, if we had LeVeon Bell he'd average 2.9 YPC. QB is average, that's all I can say about that. 

 

D played average, made some nice plays but the 3rd TD was a letdown.

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3 minutes ago, Bonez3 said:

Seriously, if we had any hope for 'change', this was the game. 

 

Unreal, same ol Skins.

 

And we don't know how good or bad Indy is, but our offense is atrocious. WR's obviously can't win matchups (or even catch very well). Our TE was MIA most of the game and when we may have fractional chance to win he fumbles (inexcusable). O line simply can't run block, forget Guice, if we had LeVeon Bell he'd average 2.9 YPC. QB is average, that's all I can say about that. 

 

D played average, made some nice plays but the 3rd TD was a letdown.

We spend all those picks to build up the defense and they shut down Luck for big stretch of the game and it didn't matter cause you can't score. 

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This is why I was debating against this dink and dunk offense after game 1.  14-3 even at the half appears to be too much to overcome.  This offense is not only boring it's extremely limited.  

 

Sure he got aided by a BS roughing call but I'd like to point out that Kirk put up huge numbers and got the TD and 2 pt conversion in crunch time to tie the game, then led a drive that should have been a winner in OT.  Pretty good for a guy many felt wasn't clutch.  

Edited by Darrell Green Fan

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17 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

He hasn’t earned that paycheck since he arrived. He’s a mediocre CB that had an outlier great season behind an elite Panthers front 7.

 

We could have had William Jackson instead of $75 million Norman and heartless Doctson.

Right on here. We're both of them SM deals?

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Thoughts on the game:
1. Ultra conservative. Looked like they had been reading the paper this week about how dominant they were in ARI. Figured the Colts for easy, and got manhandled up front on both sides of the ball. Played to not make mistakes rather than to make plays. (Edit: reading DJ Swearinger comments, he said they probably paid too much attention to media praise this week.)
 

2. Manhandled up front on both sides of the ball. it is not often that our offensive line gets ripped like that. but shredded they were. and i think it is because...
 

3. The snap count is unbelievably predictable.
This cannot be overstated. The Colts knew it and tee'd off on it. "Rhino Rhino Ready go" isn't making anyone wonder. Their DL was moving forward before our guys were out of their stances.
Proof: we got two hard counts that easily drew them offsides. The second one .. Trent false started.. So if the snap count is SO unchanging that an obvious attempt at a hard count caused Mr. all world LT to jump... it's the SNAP COUNT. 
seems to me we had this problem with Kirk as well, so I will now look at JAY. Change the snap count. Change the cadences. 
The Colts were jumping so fast that we probably could have hard counted 6 or 7 offsides out of them before they backed off.
 

4. Everyone is going to be screaming to sign a wide receiver again. So our entire WR crew underperformed again and could not get separation again. Last year our entire WR corps underperformed and could not get separation.
I have to look hard at WR coach Ike Hilliard. When all of our receivers show the same problem,,, and then we change them out and the new batch shows the same problem.... sign all the WRs you want. If they are taught bad habits they play badly, and for 2 years they have played badly and have exhibited bad habits... you have to look over their heads.
 

5. Josh Doctson plays weak. Not just yesterday. Just in general. The boy is weak. Smith's first long pass to him went right through his fingertips, and a LITTLE effort to extend probably results in a catch. (Feet down, well maybe not,, but ball in hand is the first priority, and he made a very weak attempt at it.)

6. The Defense tightened up after getting gashed early. but had NO answer for the little crossing routes and rub routes. Thoroughly confused them all game long, and it was pretty much ALL the Colts did in the passing game. Their last TD was a prime example.. they left TY Hilton alone and 3 of them followed the 'rub' guy to the outside.. Hilton just waltzed across the line with no one covering him at all.
 

7. Credit to the Colts,, even if the Redskins did complete a pass,, no matter what they did, the Colts defense flowed to the ball and gang tackled fast. rarely did you see fewer than 5 or 6 Colts around the tackle. YAC was non-existent.
 

8. But you take a defense that is teeing off on a snap count, crashing SO hard on the line of scrimmage, moving so fast to the ball, there are ways to exploit that with misdirections, nd other tactics,, and we didn't do anything. we stuck to the same old gameplan throughout, and never adjusted to what they were doing. (and as i said above,, when a hard count causes a false start.. you aren't changing anything up to meet the defense.)

They better tighten up.

 

~Bang

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Can't start off a game by letting the other team march right down the field, running the ball down our throat, and scoring a TD. Thought we were going to be able to stop the run this year?

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First thing to immediately notice was the change in run scheme play design. The college offense that was used against Arizona wasn't used against the Colts. 

 

Probably an overthinking on the staff's part, assuming that the Colts having watched the AZ film would have game planned for it and the success from the previous week would not be there.  

 

But sometimes, as I believe, as a coach you need to occasionally call plays that your guys already understand the opponent already knows.

They know it's coming, you know it's coming, and let's find out who wins.

 

Your guys get the initial boost knowing that they had success with it the previous week, they instantaneously understand from meetings that this week's opponent would have film keys for it, but ultimately your guys understand that as a coach you are giving them the challenge of trying to win one-on-one individual match-ups, they get filled with pride, and that's always a confidence booster, knowing that your coach believes more in his guys than the other team's ability to prepare against you. 

 

They had success with both Peterson and Thompson set up in shotgun-single upback in Arizona. They succeeded in limiting the pursuit, at least delaying it initially, with the cross-face mesh action from the shotgun. For whatever reason, the edge always seemed open. Both Peterson and Thompson could just easily press the boundary on outside stretch, time again. 

 

But the o-line didn't just exclusively go with outside zones steps from that look, there seemed to be a wrinkle I saw that looked to me like power toss blocking upfront, with pulling linemen frontside and backside down blocking to cut off pursuit from that same Shotgun Single-Up look.

 

So the cross face mesh which dovetailed into read option for Smith held pursuit for a second and the blocking, like a power toss, created a lane on the edge that Peterson seemed to be able to turn up into. And that dovetailed nicely with the other times in which the same look pushed the edge on outside zone. 

 

Might be a little too generalized to call it sweep, but in essence it was a sweep, only from shotgun with a read option mesh, instead of an undercenter, double tight or strong side look, with reverse pivot to power toss sweep. That kind of traditional look would have likely created immediate pursuit from the defense and I doubt they could have beaten the defense's speed, albeit that Arizona is a poor team this year with much less talent than in year's past.

 

But the momentary delay they got from the "college offense" mesh stuff was just enough to consistently get the edge and to likewise open up the countermove of cutback from overpursuit, especially with Thompson. 

 

It seemed like from a defensive standpoint, Arizona didn't know whether it was a zone run or gap run. And if they actually did jailbreak to the edge to turn things back in on stretch, they'd get burned with a nice cutback, or next time, they wouldn't sprint for the zone look and get caught up in the gap stuff sealing them or kicking them out. 

 

Not sure if I explained that well enough. Easier with film and a clicker.

 

Then, as all teams do, wrinkle in play action and read option from those same alignment looks, which they did, and the defense was hesitant and having to think about 4 or 5 variants of things that could potentially happen from that one basic alignment.  

 

 

But, essentially, I didn't see Gruden go to the week 1 stuff, scheme wise. But there was probably good reason to at least try it out for a couple of series. Ultimately, I think everyone can see what this team is like when it does not have a complimentary run game. It was ... really evident. 

Edited by Monk4thaHALL
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As someone at the game it was actually watchable despite the offensive ineptitude until the 21-9 score at which point I said enough and started heading for the exits. This team has potential but still needs to get a lot of work done on offense. Receivers need to help out Smith more. Doctson had 2 drops on easy balls that should have been caught. Reed fumbled the football and along with it any chance of winning that game. Defense left a lot to be desired, letting the Colts drive right down the field on them in the first drive. This is a Colts D that was shredded by Joe Mixon week 1. They held Peterson in check. Baffling. 

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To me, this was the worst and most revealing loss of the Gruden tenure. In year 5, there is no way a competently coached football team comes out and lays an egg like that at home. Gruden is out of excuses. He is nothing more than a very mediocre head coach (he’s mediocre on his best days, completely incompetent on his worst). The same issues that have plagued us since the moment he got here: inconsistent play calling, abandonment of the running game too early, utter inability to make any in game adjustments and consistent red zone failures, continue to plague us five years in. 

 

We’ve seen all we need to see with Gruden. He will never be a successful head coach. He needs to go. 

Edited by skins4eva
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54 minutes ago, desertbeagle85 said:

 

Only reason they looked good week 1 is because the Cards are horrible. They got past the 50 yard line once yesterday and that was the 2nd to last play of the game. 

 

I agree Norman is more mouth than anything. He hasnt beem good at all in my opinion.

 

It should also be noted that other than a 21 point 2nd quarter outburst, they had 3 points in the 2nd half and generally took their foot off the pedal. So counting that game, you have 9 points yesterday , for a total of 12 points. That's pretty pathetic. 

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3 minutes ago, skins4eva said:

To me, this was the worst and most revealing loss of the Gruden tenure. In year 5, there is no way a competently coached football team comes out and lays an egg like that at home. Gruden is out of excuses. He is nothing more than a very mediocre head coach (he’s mediocre on his best days, completely incompetent on his worst). The same issues that have plagued us since the moment he got here: inconsistent play calling, abandonment of the running game too early, utter inability to make any in game adjustments and consistent red zone failures, continue to plague us five years in. 

 

We’ve seen all we need to see with Gruden. He will never be a successful head coach. He needs to go. 

Seriously... When McVay takes the Rams to NFC Championship gamed/or Super Bowl and we have skinny Jay locked up for a few more years the Redskins brass needs to take a hard look at themselves. Further, Kyle Lobster Jr. is probably gonna lead the 49ers to the playoffs. 

 

I'm thrilled we got the lesser of the 2 Grudens, future looking bright.

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1 hour ago, KDawg said:

. -Injuries are starting to become a major concern for Trent Williams. Starting this offseason the Skins may want to look at finding a replacement. Not necessarily for next season, but if a LT prospect falls to them in the draft that they really like it's time to pull the trigger and figure out the configuration of the line after. 71 is a stud and probably my favorite current Skin just due to his longevity and how he's stuck it out. But these injuries are piling up quick for the big fella.

:(   Trent is starting to roll down the hill pretty fast. Had to happen at some point. I agree that its probably time to stop considering LT a no need position. Not an immediate need by any means, but not off the table anymore.

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