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The Cordial American Political Discussion Thread


Fergasun

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I'm tired, and need to sleep, but I've been wanting to start this thread for awhile.  I've had many discussions in the Tailgate on politics -- earliest ones I recall were with DjTj and we sparred on immigrations (needless to say, marrying into an immigrant family has changed my opinion a little).  From the debts, deficits to immigration, defense policy and even gun control-- there are a lot of topics that are ripe for cordial discussion.  So post your wacky, zany, political ideas in this thread, but above all be cordial.  I will consider this thread a success if it can go on for 6 months without getting derailed. 

 

I will start out with a list of reforms that I would like to see enacted in the US Government:

 

1) A law that triples the current size of the House of Representatives from 435 to 1305

Why?  Did you know that in 1911, the apportionment act set the size of the House to 435?  Did you know that when that Act occurred, there were 200,000 constituents per representative?  Currently that number is 700,000. 

 

Originally in the Constitution the minimum number of constituents capped per representative was 30,000.  However, the founders did not provide any guidance on  maximum constituents per representative.  There are a couple of reasons I find this proposal beneficial today:

a) Inherently makes representatives more responsive to constituents

B) It would allow more local politicking and more vigorous local elections.  Having to convince only 100,000 voters to go your way on election day is easier than spending the resources to convince 350,000 voters (extreme cases, sure). 

 

2) Anyone who represents me as a Senator or House (or other legislative body) has to be grilled in public, much like the way they grill witnesses in public. 

 

I pay attention to Congressional Hearings, and a lot of it seems to be preconceived grandstanding. Since my Congressman and Senator get to grill witnesses in hearings, I should be allowed to grill them prior to voting for them.  This law at the local level would require prospective candidates to sit in  front of citizens and answer questions over a period of time (5 days maybe?).   That way I can ask away and see how competent they really are. 

 

3) All lobbying must be done in public.  This is obvious -- unlike some, I don't think lobbying is bad per se (there is a baby with the bathwater issue going).  However, I despise the fact that my Congressman is getting lobbied, and I have no idea who/what/why/when/where how they are being lobbied, but I wanna see what companies are asking him for!  I want to know if the local bread company is lobbying for some type of special protections on their wheat supply (I don't know...) I want to know if a cigar company is lobbying for more open trade to Cuba.  I want to know.  This guy is supposed to represent me, but I never feel representative in more than a token - "I will send a generic e-mail to any inquiries into my office." 

 

4) FOIA applies to Congress as written (Constitutional amendment)

Enough said... if it is good enough for their oversight, why is it not good enough for my oversight as a citizen? 

 

For all the positions I take (gun control, immigration, etc) I think that an open government is really the first step to making us, the citizens feel more empowered about our government. 

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I would disagree with #1. You can barely get a majority to agree now. Tripling the size of the House, would just make it worse.

I think you need to get money out of politics. Right now the government is paid for by the corporation, controlled by corporation and for the corporation.

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Yeah, I'd be wary of increasing the size of the House too. What I'd like to see is an end to gerrymandering. There ought to be a way to get natural districts and a fairer representation of the state. Campaign finance is a biggie too. I also really like the idea of automatic voter registration. If everyone has to register at 18 anyway in case there's a military need, why not just add that aspect in. Registering to vote should be easy, free, and accessible.

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Yeah, I'd be wary of increasing the size of the House too. What I'd like to see is an end to gerrymandering. There ought to be a way to get natural districts and a fairer representation of the state. Campaign finance is a biggie too. I also really like the idea of automatic voter registration. If everyone has to register at 18 anyway in case there's a military, why not just add that aspect in. Registering to vote should be easy, free, and accessible.

In VA, every time I move I get a voter registration packet (includes change of address) in the mail within a week of moving in. Fill out a form and return it postage free and your registration card comes in the mail a month later. Not exactly sure how much easier it could be in VA. I guess you could make it a law that any change of address triggers a mailing to that address?

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In VA, every time I move I get a voter registration packet (includes change of address) in the mail within a week of moving in. Fill out a form and return it postage free and your registration card comes in the mail a month later. Not exactly sure how much easier it could be in VA. I guess you could make it a law that any change of address triggers a mailing to that address?

Sounds like VA is doing that right in that regard! I don't think all states are as good.

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@Fergasun, thanks for starting this thread.  I've had the same thought about a thread like this and am happy you started it.

 

I do agree with you that an open government, at all levels, is very much needed.

 

Agree 100% with Redskin4ever about term limits.  I believe that government 'leaders' should be there for a short time and back to their "real jobs".  It would be so much harder for lobbyists or PACs to influence a Senator or Congressman when they only have a couple terms.

 

Nice to see that so far the posters here have been very respectful.  Hope it stays (if it does, it will be one of my favorites).

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I think that every American citizen should receive free health care. I don't know how it's done, but that is my biggest political belief.

I think that we spend way too much money on the military. Not that we should decrease our forces, just that there is so much wasteful spending that we could probably cut in half what we spend and still operate exactly the same.

I think that there needs to be more trust busting going on these days, specifically with the banks that are "too big to fail".

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What's wrong with at the moment you register for the draft you are simultaneously registered to vote? I don't see why that should be a controversial thought?

 

Trying to disenfranchise females?  ;)

 

Opening the draft to females could be part of it though.

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A couple of thoughts:

 

1) I don't think combining draft registration and voting registration will have the level of usefulness we think it might.  First off, you only register for the draft once, when you turn 18.  You have to reregister to vote every time you move, and at 18 years old, its almost certain you'll move somewhere in the next 5 years, so the amount of time your registration lasts is pretty limited.  Beyond that, as someone pointed out, this only helps guys.

 

2) Gerrymandering is a pretty fascinating topic. While the basics are pretty easy (maximing your party's seats), the underlying mechanics are pretty complex.  There are fulltime consultants that work with parties to gerrymander so that certain popular politicians have easy elections, other popular members of the same party are forced into the same district and have to run against each other, and certain racial groups are guaranteed representation.  There are actually a number of computer algorithms out there to make redistricting a fair process, and obviously, they'll never get any traction because gerrymandering is the only direct control the states have over the federal government. Here is one example of a computer algorithm someone has come up with: http://rangevoting.org/GerryExamples.html

 

Also, if you're bored at work, here is an interesting game that lets you try gerrymandering a fictional state in various ways: http://www.redistrictinggame.org/

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I forgot about gerrymandering... wondering if there is anyone who wants to make the argument against that unbiased algorithm?

Another thing I will mention is that we do a borrible job of demanding local political news. I have no idea what is going on at my city council or county supervisors.... heck it doesnt even look like the CA Legislature has a regular public record available I can read through.

There arenpublic meetings and hearings and you can see legislatures biases on display, but I don't think many regular folk pay attention.

I am not convinced term limits are a good answer. Maybe with other open govt initiatives.

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I forgot about gerrymandering... wondering if there is anyone who wants to make the argument against that unbiased algorithm?

Another thing I will mention is that we do a borrible job of demanding local political news. I have no idea what is going on at my city council or county supervisors.... heck it doesnt even look like the CA Legislature has a regular public record available I can read through.

There arenpublic meetings and hearings and you can see legislatures biases on display, but I don't think many regular folk pay attention.

I am not convinced term limits are a good answer. Maybe with other open govt initiatives.

Local papers are almost all bust. TV local news is 40% weather, traffic, and sports. They've tightened up the newsrooms too much. You want local news you need boots on the ground and have to be willing to pay for it. Social media and civilian journalists have taken up some slack, but quality and access is lacking.

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I forgot about gerrymandering... wondering if there is anyone who wants to make the argument against that unbiased algorithm?

 

I don't agree with the arguments for it, but here is what's often said:

1) Gerrymandering allows veteran representatives to focus on making great policy and doing good things for the state, and not on the time-consuming and expensive process of getting re-elected.

2) Gerrymandering maintains the cultural cohesiveness of neighborhoods, especially ethnic parts (i.e. imagine if Chinatown was split in half by a computer algorithm; its suddenly not as important a voting block in either district as it would be together).

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Local papers are almost all bust. TV local news is 40% weather, traffic, and sports. They've tightened up the newsrooms too much. You want local news you need boots on the ground and have to be willing to pay for it. Social media and civilian journalists have taken up some slack, but quality and access is lacking.

Thank you for saying it so I didn't have to.

 

This also goes for public broadcasting outlets. We're very short staffed and we have to be very, VERY choosy about our stories. Hell, folks like John Oliver and Jon Stewart have been picking up some of that slack, too.

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Great idea, Ferg. :) A few years back I had an idea for a second gameday thread each week for as a refuge for those wanting to avoid the spazzy, constantly****ing, monotone agenda type posters. This reminded of that when I saw the title. Looks likes it's going well. I enjoy the option of reading thoughts on policies from regs, whether I agree or disagree, when expressed without the pedestrian partisan bickering.  B) 

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I don't agree with the arguments for it, but here is what's often said:

1) Gerrymandering allows veteran representatives to focus on making great policy and doing good things for the state, and not on the time-consuming and expensive process of getting re-elected.

2) Gerrymandering maintains the cultural cohesiveness of neighborhoods, especially ethnic parts (i.e. imagine if Chinatown was split in half by a computer algorithm; its suddenly not as important a voting block in either district as it would be together).

Both of which would be closer to being fine if we had (going back to the OP) more representatives. Right now we've got a situation where one party can win 51% of the popular vote for House seats, but come away with only 45% of those seats.

So either getting rid of gerrymandering or increasing the number of representatives would probably help.

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I don't agree with the arguments for it, but here is what's often said:

1) Gerrymandering allows veteran representatives to focus on making great policy and doing good things for the state, and not on the time-consuming and expensive process of getting re-elected.

2) Gerrymandering maintains the cultural cohesiveness of neighborhoods, especially ethnic parts (i.e. imagine if Chinatown was split in half by a computer algorithm; its suddenly not as important a voting block in either district as it would be together).

 

minority district representation is required by law which kinda gums up the unbiased algorithms

 

term limits would be nice, as mentioned having to get reelected is a burden

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For a big change, I'd like to change everything to a four or six year term. I think 2 years is two short. With two years, they start the reelection campaign almost before they find the shoe closet. 

 

There's something attractive to me about them all be tied together. Presidents, Senators, Reps, Governors, all waiting for judgment at the same time. After all, the election is a verdict on how well government functions and that really means the whole.

 

Add in term limits and I think my ideal would be either two 6-year terms or 3 four year terms with all elected officials terms being synced.

 

I know this would never happen, but I think it would improve things.

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minority district representation is required by law which kinda gums up the unbiased algorithms

 

Honestly, the actual stipulation for Majority Minority districts is pretty stringent, although politicians from both sides have used it far more broadly to gerrymander to their favor.  You could easily make an algorithm that pre-seeds certain approved majority minority districts and uses an algorithm to redistrict everything else around it.

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I'd prefer a retirement age over term limits.

 

Seriously, there's a point where the damage of age overcomes the wisdom of age.

Kind of agree, but for so many offices, the it seems the staff does all the work, thinking, and writing and the Senator and Rep are there strictly for speeches, to cast a vote, or for photo ops.

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Honestly, the actual stipulation for Majority Minority districts is pretty stringent, although politicians from both sides have used it far more broadly to gerrymander to their favor.  You could easily make an algorithm that pre-seeds certain approved majority minority districts and uses an algorithm to redistrict everything else around it.

 

certainly, but it does introduce bias 

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