Jump to content
Washington Football Team Logo
Extremeskins

Redskins starting QBs Since 1991: The Revolving Door


skins island connection

Recommended Posts

The quarterback position in Washington is a dream come true, eventually turning into the nightmare on Redskin Ave.

Since 1991, when the Redskins last went to the superbowl, the organization has blown through a number of quarterbacks; 24, give or take one I may have missed. A few times, 6 different QBs had started a game in a 2 year period.

Here's the list of starting QBs since 1991. Enjoy. Or cry, if you feel the need.

 

1991 Mark Rypien

1992 Mark Rypien

1993 Mark Rypien 10  Rich Gannon 4  Gary Conklin 2

1994 Heath Shuler 8  John Friesz 4  Gus Frerotte 2

1995 Gus Frerotte 11  Heath Shuler 5

1996 Gus Frerotte

1997 Gus Frerotte 13  Jeff Hostetler 3

1998 Trent Green 14  Gus Frerotte 2

1999 Brad Johnson

2000 Brad Johnson 11  Jeff George 5

2001 Tony Banks 14  Jeff George 2

2002 Shane Matthews 7  Patrick Ramsey 5  Danny Wuerffel 4

2003 Patrick Ramsey 11 Tim Hasselbeck 5

2004 Mark Brunell 9  Patrick Ramsey 7

2005 Mark Brunell 15  Patrick Ramsey 1

2006 Mark Brunell 9  Jason Campbell 7

2007 Jason Campbell 13  Todd Collins 3

2008 Jason Campbell

2009 Jason Campbell

2010 Donovan McNabb 13  Rex Grossman 3

2011 Rex Grossman 13  John Beck 3

2012 Robert Griffin 15  Kirk Cousins 1

2013 Robert Griffin 13  Kirk Cousins 3

2014 Robert Griffin 2  Kirk Cousins 5  Colt McCoy???

 

Some QBs on this list were actually decent, if not good. A few have went on to play in a SuperBowl with another team, a few, some could argue, never got a legitimate shot due to circumstances/issues with other aspects of the team, while others simply flat-out sucked.

 

Only a few have gotten more than a year to be a starter, while others had no business tarnishing the Redskins name by suiting up. I'd have to look at Patrick Ramsey as one of those who I really pulled for to succeed, too bad it didn't, because the kid had an arm on him.

 

But, this is a good vent to get away from the Griffin/Cousins/McCoy/Gruden/Haslett talk. Feel free to add in.

 

SIC

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All other BS with this franchise aside, this is obviously a big reason of us pretty much sucking over the past 20 years. But the biggest reason why we were ever good was the brilliance of coach Gibbs. He won three SB's with three different QB's in a ten year span and got to an NFC championship with a 4th in that time. In his second stint here that lasted four years, he got us to the palyoffs with two diffrent QB's. In other words, stability at the QB position hasn't been our thing for longer than the 20 years we've sucked. It's just that Gibbs was so damn good, that he could win with anybody.

 

Could you imagine if this franchise never had Gibbs? Instead of talking about the dissapointment over the past 20 years, we would be the Cleveland Browns, Detroit Lions and any other franchise that has done next to nothing in the Super Bowl era.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All other BS with this franchise aside, this is obviously a big reason of us pretty much sucking over the past 20 years. But the biggest reason why we were ever good was the brilliance of coach Gibbs. He won three SB's with three different QB's in a ten year span and got to an NFC championship with a 4th in that time. In his second stint here that lasted four years, he got us to the palyoffs with two diffrent QB's. In other words, stability at the QB position hasn't been our thing for longer than the 20 years we've sucked. It's just that Gibbs was so damn good, that he could win with anybody.

 

Could you imagine if this franchise never had Gibbs? Instead of talking about the dissapointment over the past 20 years, we would be the Cleveland Browns, Detroit Lions and any other franchise that has done next to nothing in the Super Bowl era.

I think it may be more of a symptom than a reason.  Consider this.  When was the last time a Redskins QB played behind an exceptional offensive line?  Subjective, I know but I suppose it could be supported by a preponderance of compelling stats (sacks surrendered, QB hits surrendered etc.).  I think the answer is Mark Rypien was the last Redskins QB to play behind an exceptional offensive line.  He's also the last QB to have a SB appearance and a string of starting years with anything approaching consensus support/approval from the fans.  I loved Rypien but even a fan has to acknowledge what while he had some exceptional strengths there were also genuine weaknesses/shortcomings in his abilities testified to by his 6th round selection in the draft.

 

Gibbs I Era was great in my view primarily because 1) Gibbs adapted his approach to the strengths of his players, 2) Petitbon ran the defense and 3) Bobby Beathard was building his roster.  Removing Gibbs from the picture might have a significant effect ... but I'd think the other 2 factors would have led to some form of success ... maybe not SB victories ... but the Hogs and Petitbon's D would certainly have made them competitive ... of course a HC like Zorn or Spurrier could probably have screwed it up 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shoddy offensive line play is what did Ramsey in. Another shocking reason Steve Spurious failed in the NFL. He was suppose to be an offensive wizard but he couldnt understand that in order to pass the ball your QB needs to be protected. Yet, despite, Ramsey being on record pace to be sacked in a season he wouldnt change the O-lines blocking scheme.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tony Banks played really hard for the Skins, despite the fact that he sucked. Stephen Davis and the D carried 2001.

 

The only chance this franchise has is RG3. If that doesn't happen, I imagine in 10 years this list will grow.

 

Trent Green was the lost gem in there but Brad Johnson came in the next season and led the team to a division title and is the only 4000 passer the skins have had since Jay Schroeder. If Snyder wouldn't have tinkered with the roster in 2000, that team might have done more.

 

Seems that Skins fans constantly have to say, shoulda, coulda, woulda

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tony Banks played really hard for the Skins, despite the fact that he sucked. Stephen Davis and the D carried 2001.

 

The only chance this franchise has is RG3. If that doesn't happen, I imagine in 10 years this list will grow.

 

Trent Green was the lost gem in there but Brad Johnson came in the next season and led the team to a division title and is the only 4000 passer the skins have had since Jay Schroeder. If Snyder wouldn't have tinkered with the roster in 2000, that team might have done more.

 

Seems that Skins fans constantly have to say, shoulda, coulda, woulda

 

I did like Tony Banks but yeah, he was not really a long-term starter.  Had some great moments though and honestly a lot could have been different from that Schottenheimer tenure had they just stuck with him; who knows if they kept Banks or went with someone else but regardless, 0-5 start to 8-8 is solid.

 

Yeah and letting Trent Green walk is up there with dumb franchise decisions.  I really hope RG3 works out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah and letting Trent Green walk is up there with dumb franchise decisions.  I really hope RG3 works out.

 

Green was a FA when the Skins didn't have an owner.  JKC left the team in control of his foundation and it was up for sale.  I don't remember all the specifics but I think Casserly's hands were tied when it came to re-signing FAs pending the sale of the team. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, props to Marty for going 8-8 after an 0-5 start with Tony Banks.  That should have been worthy of COY honors.  I went to one of my only road games that year, was in New Orleans for New Year's and the Redskins were down 10-0 to the Saints, think they won 45-10.  Great pic somewhere of Marty sharing a high five and smile with Darrell Green during that game.

 

Not saying Marty would have won a Super Bowl but think we would have been competitive in a time where the NFC East was revolving door with who would win.  Probably would have a few more NFC East crowns.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

With Trent Green, I was always under the impression that he was traded.

Maybe he was traded due to contract  issues, or did he just sign with another team?

 

Brad Johnson comes to mind as one that ' coulda shoulda' went all the way while he was here, but then again I thought Jeff George would have created alot of havoc. Actually I am partially right, he did create alot of havoc, just not in a good way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What's with all these threads that simply reinforce what we already know: the Redskins have been an exercise in futility since Gibbs retired the first time around, whatever angle you look at it from.

On topic, though, I will be mercifully relieved if the Cousins to McCoy switch is not a repeat of Grossman to Beck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

All other BS with this franchise aside, this is obviously a big reason of us pretty much sucking over the past 20 years. But the biggest reason why we were ever good was the brilliance of coach Gibbs. He won three SB's with three different QB's in a ten year span and got to an NFC championship with a 4th in that time. In his second stint here that lasted four years, he got us to the palyoffs with two diffrent QB's. In other words, stability at the QB position hasn't been our thing for longer than the 20 years we've sucked. It's just that Gibbs was so damn good, that he could win with anybody.

 

Could you imagine if this franchise never had Gibbs? Instead of talking about the dissapointment over the past 20 years, we would be the Cleveland Browns, Detroit Lions and any other franchise that has done next to nothing in the Super Bowl era.

3 different QB's but the same O-line! The hogs are the reason the Redskins went to 4 Super Bowls, this is what happens when you can protect your Qb's, only 9 sacks allowed the entire 91 season, open holes for your RB's, every starting RB who ran behind that line produced over 1000 yard seasons and broke the Super Bowl rushing record in 82 then again in 87 which still stands today, you control the clock and the game with a good O-line. Since 1982 We won Super Bowls with every starting qb that decade except Jay schroeder , but even he would have beat the Bronco's in SB 22 if started, and only missed the playoffs one time out of 10 years, wow! We need an O-Line damn it!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 Looking down the list, it makes you wonder which QBs would have been keepers had the o-line been a top tier one.

 

 MS says it though; we desperately need a good o-line, and build outwards from there. It is nice having a piece [ pieces ] which can negate a bad o-line, but eventually it is exploited and ultimately defeated; but a good o-line enables so much variation of the same formation that it keeps defenses guessing.

 

 I still think about what could have been with Ramsey.

 Jeff George, wow; the dude had a friggin arm, but no control, physically or mentally.  I'd bet he could have thrown a football through a watermelon, if he could have hit it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 different QB's but the same O-line! The hogs are the reason the Redskins went to 4 Super Bowls, this is what happens when you can protect your Qb's, only 9 sacks allowed the entire 91 season, open holes for your RB's, every starting RB who ran behind that line produced over 1000 yard seasons and broke the Super Bowl rushing record in 82 then again in 87 which still stands today, you control the clock and the game with a good O-line. Since 1982 We won Super Bowls with every starting qb that decade except Jay schroeder , but even he would have beat the Bronco's in SB 22 if started, and only missed the playoffs one time out of 10 years, wow! We need an O-Line damn it!!!

Yes, but who's to say that Gibbs' coaching & system didn't turn those O-lineman into great players. The guy had a special knack for getting the best out of his offensive players, whether it be o-lineman, running backs, receivers, tight ends...plug em in and they produced. In his second tenure here, the o-line was solid, but nothing spectacular. And again, was it the players or Gibbs? He got us to the playoffs twice in four years playing a washed up Mark Brunell, a mediocre, at best, Patrick Ramsey, a career back-up in Jason Campbell and a very old, weak armed Todd Collins...and that's with Cerrato involved in the front office to boot. What your essentially saying is that Norv, Schottenheimer, Spurrier, Zorn or Shanahan all could have done what Gibbs did in both his stints here if they had the same o-lines. Maybe, but outside of maybe Shottenheimer, I highly doubt it to say the least.

 

It's no coincidence that since that guy left-- both times--, it didn't take this franchise long to go to hell. There's no argument that a great o-line is essential to winning.  But if the formula to winning is to just go out and get beast o-lineman, then why can't or doesn't everyone do it? It's because they don't grow on trees and it takes a great coach with the right staff to develop them. Gibbs and his staff were the perfect storm for us and they made the players great as opposed to the other way around. As great as our o-line was in Gibbs first tenure and as solid as it might have been in his second one, there's no way I'll ever be convinced that Gibbs success here was because the o-lineman were great to begin with and he just rode thier coat tails. But you're right, we need a great o-line to get back to where we once were. But before that, we need a great FO & head coach, because without that the former will never happen. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What's with all these threads that simply reinforce what we already know: the Redskins have been an exercise in futility since Gibbs retired the first time around, whatever angle you look at it from.

On topic, though, I will be mercifully relieved if the Cousins to McCoy switch is not a repeat of Grossman to Beck.

The good thing about McCoy is he's failed in this league before. This is Cousins' first time failing. So I think McCoy is going to take this opportunity and run with it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, but who's to say that Gibbs' coaching & system didn't turn those O-lineman into great players. The guy had a special knack for getting the best out of his offensive players, whether it be o-lineman, running backs, receivers, tight ends...plug em in and they produced. In his second tenure here, the o-line was solid, but nothing spectacular. And again, was it the players or Gibbs? He got us to the playoffs twice in four years playing a washed up Mark Brunell, a mediocre, at best, Patrick Ramsey, a career back-up in Jason Campbell and a very old, weak armed Todd Collins...and that's with Cerrato involved in the front office to boot. What your essentially saying is that Norv, Schottenheimer, Spurrier, Zorn or Shanahan all could have done what Gibbs did in both his stints here if they had the same o-lines. Maybe, but outside of maybe Shottenheimer, I highly doubt it to say the least.

 

It's no coincidence that since that guy left-- both times--, it didn't take this franchise long to go to hell. There's no argument that a great o-line is essential to winning.  But if the formula to winning is to just go out and get beast o-lineman, then why can't or doesn't everyone do it? It's because they don't grow on trees and it takes a great coach with the right staff to develop them. Gibbs and his staff were the perfect storm for us and they made the players great as opposed to the other way around. As great as our o-line was in Gibbs first tenure and as solid as it might have been in his second one, there's no way I'll ever be convinced that Gibbs success here was because the o-lineman were great to begin with and he just rode thier coat tails. But you're right, we need a great o-line to get back to where we once were. But before that, we need a great FO & head coach, because without that the former will never happen. 

 

 Well, IMO, part of the problem is the generation gap between Gibbs I & 2.

 Players have egos, but during his first run, Gibbs had a way of reaching people, getting them to believe in themselves, and having the biggest o-line in the league didn't hurt matters. As his first stint here came to an end, at SB XXVI, the Redskins had the 3rd lightest o-lines in the league. That says 3 things;

1. the appreciation for big, athletic linemen are a must

2. coaching and conditioning

3. Its a copycat league.

Now, he had his success with 3 different QBs, and they were more comfortable in the pocket because of the confidence QBs had in their linemen, thus giving them more time to focus on downfield activities.

 

Today, players are more about 'me me', and often their attitude is much more than their playing ability. The league is a win-now league, so much pressure and emphasis is put on coaches to win now that any player is expendable; well, almost every player. Many of the QBs on this list were way over-hyped, over-rated, and for the most part put into a system that didn't fit them well.

Gibbs had more assistants on his team, by far, than any other, in 1991; now, players are 'stewed' into a general training camp atmosphere; and when they're on the bubble from day 1, failure is often the result.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, but who's to say that Gibbs' coaching & system didn't turn those O-lineman into great players. The guy had a special knack for getting the best out of his offensive players, whether it be o-lineman, running backs, receivers, tight ends...plug em in and they produced. In his second tenure here, the o-line was solid, but nothing spectacular. And again, was it the players or Gibbs? He got us to the playoffs twice in four years playing a washed up Mark Brunell, a mediocre, at best, Patrick Ramsey, a career back-up in Jason Campbell and a very old, weak armed Todd Collins...and that's with Cerrato involved in the front office to boot. What your essentially saying is that Norv, Schottenheimer, Spurrier, Zorn or Shanahan all could have done what Gibbs did in both his stints here if they had the same o-lines. Maybe, but outside of maybe Shottenheimer, I highly doubt it to say the least.

 

It's no coincidence that since that guy left-- both times--, it didn't take this franchise long to go to hell. There's no argument that a great o-line is essential to winning.  But if the formula to winning is to just go out and get beast o-lineman, then why can't or doesn't everyone do it? It's because they don't grow on trees and it takes a great coach with the right staff to develop them. Gibbs and his staff were the perfect storm for us and they made the players great as opposed to the other way around. As great as our o-line was in Gibbs first tenure and as solid as it might have been in his second one, there's no way I'll ever be convinced that Gibbs success here was because the o-lineman were great to begin with and he just rode thier coat tails. But you're right, we need a great o-line to get back to where we once were. But before that, we need a great FO & head coach, because without that the former will never happen. 

every one of the Gibbs II era o-line starters was a 3rd round or better draft pick except Fabini a back-up who filled in for Thomas when he was injured.  Highest was Samuels (3rd pick).  Lowest was Fabini (111th pick) who spelled Randy Thomas (57th pick).  Other starters ... Dockery (81st pick), Kendall (21st pick), Raymer (92nd pick).  Not the hogs exactly in terms of performance but pretty good all things considered.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Shoddy offensive line play is what did Ramsey in. Another shocking reason Steve Spurious failed in the NFL. He was suppose to be an offensive wizard but he couldnt understand that in order to pass the ball your QB needs to be protected. Yet, despite, Ramsey being on record pace to be sacked in a season he wouldnt change the O-lines blocking scheme.

I remember a game against Dallas and Troy actually felt scared for Ramsey.  Ramsey was getting literelly murdered during that game.  Spurrier refused to adjust blocking schemes.  I actually believe Ramsey had the chance to be very good but was hit so many times that year he became gun shy.

 Looking down the list, it makes you wonder which QBs would have been keepers had the o-line been a top tier one.

 

 MS says it though; we desperately need a good o-line, and build outwards from there. It is nice having a piece [ pieces ] which can negate a bad o-line, but eventually it is exploited and ultimately defeated; but a good o-line enables so much variation of the same formation that it keeps defenses guessing.

 

 I still think about what could have been with Ramsey.

 Jeff George, wow; the dude had a friggin arm, but no control, physically or mentally.  I'd bet he could have thrown a football through a watermelon, if he could have hit it.

I think the biggest miss was Trent Green.  That whole death of JKC, questions about ownership, money, etc.  cost us keeping him.  He went on to KC (by way of St Louis) and played very well.  Unfortunately, the Concussion bug got to him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Losing Trent Green to FA was a disaster and could have changed the course of the early 2000s for this team

 

1) Ownership was in flux as the team had been sold to Howard Milstein but not approved by the NFL. Who was actually running the team was a bit of an issue until Taglibue said that JKC Jr and Casserly were still in charge

 

2) Losing Green to his hometown team of St. Louis forced Casserly into trading for Brad Johnson (which the new ownership group was strongly against). The Redskins trade a 1,2,3 for Brad Johnson. That extra 1 in the 1999 draft would have been HUGE as the Redskins could have added another defensive stud with Champ Bailey

 

3) Once Snyder took over, it was clear he had it out for Brad Johnson since Johnson wasn't his guy. Hence signing Jeff George the very next offseason. 

 

4) Trent Green seemed like the perfect Norv QB. While Brad Johnson started off great in 1999, his arm just fell off a cliff halfway through the year and Norv's deep offense wasn't there anymore. I think with Trent Green being the starter from day 1 in 1999 and having the physical skill set he did, some of the late season dumb losses (think the Lions and Colts games) could have been wins giving the 1999 Redskins homefield and a bye instead of the Bucs. That team may have actually won the Superbowl.

 

5) With Trent Green entrenched as your starter, and another young defensive starter (think Jevon Kearse or Anthony McFarland) Norv may have been on more solid ground going into 2000, the team as a whole may not have made the absurd moves that it did, Jeff George isn't brought in, and perhaps Green has 5-7 more very good years here behind what was shaping up to be a very good o-line with a young Samuels and Jansen as its anchors

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tony Banks played really hard for the Skins, despite the fact that he sucked. Stephen Davis and the D carried 2001.

 

 

Tony Banks was terrible. Yet, he may have thrown the best deep ball I've ever seen in the NFL. I can't fully explain the Tony Banks experience. I always felt like every pass play should have been max protect with one receiver running a deep post.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tony Banks was terrible. Yet, he may have thrown the best deep ball I've ever seen in the NFL. I can't fully explain the Tony Banks experience. I always felt like every pass play should have been max protect with one receiver running a deep post.

He was pretty good at hiding the ball on play action passes as well. I think he fooled the camera man a few times.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is what you call "slowly turning the corner"....

 

1994 Heath Shuler 8  John Friesz 4  Gus Frerotte 2

1995 Gus Frerotte 11  Heath Shuler 5

1996 Gus Frerotte

1997 Gus Frerotte 13  Jeff Hostetler 3

1998 Trent Green 14  Gus Frerotte 2

1999 Brad Johnson

2000 Brad Johnson 11

 

And then this is where you drop off the proverbial cliff...

 

2000 ****************** Jeff George 5

2001 Tony Banks 14  Jeff George 2

2002 Shane Matthews 7  Patrick Ramsey 5  Danny Wuerffel 4

2003 Patrick Ramsey 11 Tim Hasselbeck 5

2004 Mark Brunell 9  Patrick Ramsey 7

2005 Mark Brunell 15  Patrick Ramsey 1

2006 Mark Brunell 9  Jason Campbell 7


Weird, eh?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...