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The Insecurity of RG3 and Why It Might Matter


kleese

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The RG3 threads often get contentious and eventually locked. I'm attempting to share a fairly specific thought here and avoid some of the tired debates we've seen around here. I'm not interesting in perpetuating cliches in either direction (he's a diva, etc). I hope I'm successful. If it comes across as more of the same and needs to be merged, then my apologies and please send it where it belongs.

There are certain things about RG3 that rub me the wrong way and/or annoy me, but many of those things don't matter IMO so I ignore them and in no way hold it against him as our QB.

I also have no interest in trying to define if RG3 is a "good guy" or not. We don't really know any of these dudes. I think he seems like a nice guy overall; someone willing to give up his time for fans, charitable causes, etc. I think it's BS to try and pigeon hole him or anyone else as a spotlight grabber in those situations. Maybe he does it for selfish reasons and maybe he doesn't. I don't know. And I don't care. The fact that he does it is good enough for me, and I applaud him for gestures like the recent one with the cancer patients. He is also very aware/respectful of our military folks and I think that comes off as genuine.

So none of that stuff matters to me as I don't think it has any real trickle to the football field.

The only parts of his off field actions, interactions, and personality in general that matter to me are the parts that I believe either affect or potentially affect his play or his value to the franchise.

And I do think that his insecurity and stubbornness are playing roles here.

He posted on FB just a little while ago a message aimed at all the doubters... It was sort of cliche, listing how he's been doubted his whole life and has always proved everyone wrong. Basically a post aimed at "haters." Nothing inherently wrong with the post itself, but it does reveal some things to me:

1. He hears it all and it REALLY matters to him what people think and say about him

2. He seems to view any criticism as "hating" rather than anything that might be legitimate or reasonable

3. He feels compelled to continually "fight back" not only on the field but with his words.

After the game the other night he was pretty defiant about the sliding thing and even said he "got it right" the third time. Which he really didn't-/ as all of his "slides" were pretty ugly.

This all dates back to last year and his strange actions in preseason and beyond. When he went out in his uniform for the coin toss in the Titans preseason game last year, I found that incredibly strange. It was as if he was convincing HIMSELF he was still the captain. No one was really doubting that at the time, and he made that a very awkawsrd situation. It also set an uncomfortable and tense tone that lingered. The Operation Patience mumbo jumbo also didn't help.

The only reason you wear that t shirt is because you want the media and fans to see it. Again, it was as if he was trying to convince everyone of something that no one was really doubting in the first place.

When asked about Gruden and the new staff this year he delivered his now infamous comments about finally having two coaches that believe in him. Even after an entire off season, he still felt the need to take shots at the Shanny's even when the question wasn't about them.

There is a tension surrounding RG3. A discomfort. Some of it stems strictly from his injuries and the fear he might go down again. Not much he can do about that. But I also think his comments and actions add to this tension.

And then he goes out and looks somewhat uncomfortable on the field. Not bad by any means-- he made some really nice throws. But uncomfortable. Awkward. Mechanics all over the place. Even on the nice deep throw to Roberts he was on his back foot.

If you are a fan who watched that game and saw nothing off or odd or awkward in regards to RG3 Monday, I think you are fooling yourself.

This has nothing to do with who should be starting. There is no question there that this is RG3's job. But I like our roster and I think our backs, receivers, and right ends will be as good as any in the league. I think the defense will be much better. But I am very concerned about RG3-- and it is in large part due to the fact that HE seems so concerned.

I would just really like to see him take a deep breath, stop reacting to all the noise, and exhibit a little more humility and a little less competitive arrogance in terms of where he is and where he needs to be.

I still like the guy. I'll be sporting my #10 jersey this year for sure. I think he has the potential for a big bounce back year. But the dude stresses me out and I have a feeling he has a similar effect on teammates and coaches. And that concerns me.

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And then he goes out and looks somewhat uncomfortable on the field. Not bad by any means-- he made some really nice throws. But uncomfortable. Awkward. Mechanics all over the place. Even on the nice deep throw to Roberts he was on his back foot.

If you are a fan who watched that game and saw nothing off or odd or awkward in regards to RG3 Monday, I think you are fooling yourself.

Not really sure what the point of this thread is but let's stick with what matters (at least to me) and that's on field performance. It's also objective to a extent since it can be analysed.

I broke down every pass RGIII threw in the Browns preseason game thread. He made one bad throw (and an even worse decision) - the pick which WAS off his back foot. The throw to Roberts above you say was off his back foot wasn't. It's not even arguable - he had a nice base, stepped into the throw and hit Roberts is stride for a 49 yard pick up. If you don't see that I have to question what else you see.

His mechanics generally were sound throughout, he showed patience in the pocket, he went through reads (he hit Jackson twice when he was the 3rd read in a progression) and he was on target with his throws.

If RGIII against the Browns is him looking uncomfortable throwing the ball we are in really really good shape.

Now running the ball, that's a different conversation ...

I will leave the arm chair psychoanalysis to others.

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He's got a chip on his shoulder. That's not bad.

In addition, letting some of the criticism fuel him doesn't mean he ignores or dismisses the important criticisms--those coming from his coaches.

When we're winning, RG3's tendency to speak in cookie-cutter cliches out of the Twitter Leader Handbook will be praised. When we're losing, it will be used as an example of his attention not being where it should be, aka in his playbook and nowhere else. That's just how it is.

He's a controversial player, because he wasn't perceived as a traditional prospect, and he's got a marketing machine behind him. He's a guy other fans love to hate. We're going to be dealing with this stuff for a VERY long time, if we're lucky, because it will mean he's being successful. That's part of investing so much into a guy and making him the face of your franchise from day one.

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I watched the game and saw nothing off or odd and def am not fooling myself. I was actually giddy with excitement at how good he looked until the pick, then he came back and hit Roberts deep with the bomb. As long as we don't get in our own way with turnovers, our offense is going to march up and down the field. Griffin accounted for almost 150 yards in one quarter of football against a rather solid Browns defense. I'm not sure what you are seeing.

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You're right with your off the field assessments, but I did not think he looked off Monday night. Sure the pick he threw was a horrible decision and he needs to SLIDE. Other than that he looked pretty good and the bomb to Roberts was in no way off his back foot. Watch it again. I do get what you are saying about him maybe feeling insecure with all the haters, but as long as it doesn't affect him on the field then it's okay.

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His psychology is largely irrelevant imo. Who can say what drives a man and why? I just want results. The rest is fluff. He's got the tools he needs to succeed so it is up to him to develop or not although I think it will be easier for him as it is for most of us when he has support of the fanbase. As long as he is our guy he will have my support. When the ownership and coaching staff decide otherwise then it is on to the next, see ya later. What I don't understand is the piling on.

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Could you not have made the op shorter by writing

 

I DON'T LIKE ROBERT GRIFFIN III

 

because what seems to be a reasoned argument is really just this preconception wrapped in a lot of words. This preconception is tainting the way you see him playing on the field, where you see someone insecure and jumpy others (and with no disrespect I appreciate Martin C and DGs break down on mechanics more than most) do not. It is kind of a Washington post narrative that is coming across here - trying to convince us we should be worried because well we should...

 

Also is it any surprise that Robert is perhaps a little more prickly when addressing critics given what was said last season and where it appeared to be coming from. The week in which Kyle Shanahan comes to town and there are suddenly "rumors" that Robert is alienating team mates and cannot grasp the offense ... and those rumors get a much louder voice than those in the know... Hell you have the main paper in the area that routinely refers to Robert disparagingly as superbob... It is okay for you to say tune out the noise but you have to admit the noise is loud !

 

And then there is the criticism ... it is difficult for it not to be considered as hatting  as at this point a lot of it is not rational. Robert is going into his 3rd year in his second offense . He has a 60+% completion percentage 80+ QBR a positive turn over : TD ratio was the offensive rookie of the year 2 seasons ago he was the driving force in turning that 3-6 team around when the coaches had quit and yet one bad pass in a preseason game that resulted in an interception (against one of the best CBs in the game) and all the narrative I have heard has been overwhelmingly negative  and usually quite personal and I have to say it is along racial line - cannot process information, cannot read defenses, make poor decisions etc etc.. all sound like the same things owners were saying in the 80s when justifying why all the QBs were white ... And yet the performance on the field kind of is counter to all of it . I know people want to dismiss 2012 as a gimmick offense but is that used as a stick to beat Nick Foles with or Wilson or Kapernick all of whom run similar concepts. Tell me the offense Manning is running in Denver is not without its gimicks ..

 

Robert is not the finished article and he has to learn but you have to give him chance to learn ... one of the best in the game at the minute Drew Brees had a terrible start to his career and in his 4th year the team drafted his replacement (ironically that was also his best year for the chargers)... Rogers was still holding a clip board at this point... Rivers was getting his first chance to stat ... i just get the feeling we may be expecting too much ...

 

And then there is this perception RGIII is neurotic mess . So insecure in his position that he cannot handle criticism and that would suggest he is quite negative and self doubting which is the basis of this OP ... but again anyone who has actually met and talked to RGIII comes away with a different perception and that is he is overwhelming positive . He is also a perfectionist he expects to be great and when he isn't he is very aware of it and so when people keep pointing out the same things he may bristle but I dont see that as being insecure.

 

I think also what is forgotten last year is just how bad we were as a team. The problems in the secondary, the problems in special teams, the problems in play calling, the issues with 2 man routes that defenses were sniffing out WRs not beating the press and dropping balls  - we were a bad team even before the friction between the coaching staff the ownership/FO and the QB. The Dallas game was lost entirely on special teams (TD return and long punt return kills most teams) and yet all that seems to be forgotten and the story on last year was all the struggles were down to RGIII , or Superbob or RGME as Redskins fans like to refer to him as ...

 

I think this fan base need some perspective ...

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I think that RGIII's weakness in this context is potentially a g great strength.

 

He does want to be loved.  He wants to please.  It's part of what drives him and it's a better motivation than money or other stimuli.  I don't think it's rooted in insecurity.  He seems to be pretty confident, but it manifests in wanting to be heroic, not let his team down, let us down even on a single play.

 

Unfortunately, I think he doesn't tune things out all that well.  In a world not only of 24/7 media, but 24/7 access to fans and haters (some of whom truly are haters) on social media it is not that hard to imagine someone drowning in criticism.  Heck, look at ES which is a pro-Redskins site.  It's a damnably negative and depressing.  Read a game day thread when we're up by twenty points and you'll be sure we're an 0-16 team with no player fit to play on a JV high school team.  Orakpo is a bum.  RGIII is an inaccurate, dumb, selfish, etc. player.  These things can get into your psyche if you don't learn to tune them out, but that part of him that needs to be loved and pleased wants to interact with the fans and so he becomes subject to it all.

 

On the Shanny thing, if you've ever been really betrayed you know it's tough to let it go and takes a while to heal. 

 

Now, if you look at this young QB statistically and compare his performance with other QBs in their first and second years probably you would be shocked to hear the kind of doomsaying that follows RGIII.  One year removed from the best rookie QB in NFL history the topic on sports radio yesterday (on the station owned by the Redskins) was how long can the team afford to be patient with RGIII.

 

Stupid.

 

So, yes, RGIII needs to grow and develop some psychological callouses.  Learn to filter some things out.  But these things that drive him to distraction are also things that drive him towards greatness and should make him great clay for a coach.  He wants to be loved.  He needs to please.  That's not the worst problem to face in a QB.

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I think that's a fair assessment Burgold. It is putting a more a positive spin on basically the same points I made, and I'm not saying those points aren't valid.

But SVP made a really good point on the radio the other day... All we heard about last year was how his season and his performance wasn't really his fault and how the Shanny's jeopardized his health in a variety of ways. And then the first chance RG gets in live action under Gruden, the dude rolls out and gets absolutely annihilated. Maybe it's all physical--- maybe he just doesn't understand and/or can't grasp how to get to the ground. But I think there is some defiance there. Part if it is toughness, which I like and appreciate about RG and it's the reason I don't think his teammates will ever turn on him even if he annoys them sometimes--I think he has guts. But it also displays some hubris and arrogance and it could VERY EASILY end his season or career. I was terribly disappointed to see that the other night and frustrated to hear him only begrudgingly accept responsibility for it.

Someone used the word "fluff." I agree with that... Lots and lots of fluff, and maybe ultimately none of it really matters. But it bugs me that RG is the generator of the fluff and I sense a real tension within him that I believe filters down.

Everyone is right... Winning cures all. If he comes out and lights Houston up (or even the Ravens this week) the noise quiets and things feel much better. And I firmly believe that RG is simply too physically gifted to NOT succeed if he is healthy for a long stretch. And he is also clearly an extremely hard worker.

As far as me not "liking" Rg3... That's hogwash. But I won't waste time trying to prove it as it is futile in that some around here believe any criticism leveled at RG equals hating him. As far as underlying racial biases go... Eh, I don't dismiss that in all cases, but don't really think it applies here. The "struggles to read defenses" mantra is thrown at most QB's who run. Most of the criticism Manziel is facing right now is based around that-- not being solid enough in the pocket. If a QB moves the chains consistently with his feet in college or early in his pro career, that narrative will be tossed at him, right or wrong.

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See, I think some of this criticism about his scrambling is valid and some is a dog playing tug with a chew toy.

 

I think he scrambled three times.  On one he was heading to the sideline.  Generally, you don't slide at the sideline.  He probably could have gotten out of bounds a step or two earlier, but he didn't look like he was trying to make people miss and Barry Sanders his way past three defenders to get to the endzone.  He looked like he was on his way out of bounds and misjudged the DBs angle in cutting him off.

 

I wouldnt call that super wreckless.

 

On the other two, he slid.  Maybe they weren't great slides, but they were slides. 

 

People are upset because he got hit.  Maybe in the preseason he shouldn't look to run at all.  Maybe he should look to launch that ball out of bounds when the pocket collapses.  OTOH, it probably is good for the receivers and lineman to practice the scramble drill under live fire because when it's real RGIII will have moments where he should try to make a play.

 

RGIII should not try to become Dan Marino.  I think it is a good idea for him to be more aware when he is running, but I don't necessarily want him sliding ten yards before possible contact or taking a 15 yard gain 5 yards short because there's a chance he might take a hit.  There's a fine line between what people are calling playing smart and playing scared.

Right now, many sound like football mom's at their kids first game.  Your son is going to get hit. It's a violent game.  Don't panic so much ;)

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Some of you negative RGIII guys in here are silly, the guy is a human being before a football player. His post was specifically for Jason Reid who trashed him for 2 days after his browns performance. He specifically said "RGIII was a disappointment and he always says he'll get better but he doesn't".

 

John Kiem actually liked RGIII's performance except the interception and the not sliding. It's just hilarious how EVERYTHING RGIII does is analyzed. from his tweets, to his passes, to his press conferences.

 

Redskin fans are some of the most fickle bandwagon fans in the world. Went from praising and slobbering over the kid to turning their back on the kid when he has a bad season and needs our support the most.

 

RGIII is going to play well this year and all those fans/reporters who turned their back on him and bashed him are going to pretend that they loved him all along and never turned their back. 

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I don't think it's fair to lump that he ignores all of his fair criticisms in with a response from him to haters. The passionate hate spewed by those haters is all over his twitter and FB and any article about him so it's easy to see the difference in that and actual fair criticism.

I have no problem with him using any type of hate he receives to fuel his work ethic, put a chip on his shoulder, and further motivate him etc, it's a trait of great players in all sports.

I think that tweet showed resolve, not cracking, he wants to be great and will do what it takes.

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John Kiem actually liked RGIII's performance except the interception and the not sliding. It's just hilarious how EVERYTHING RGIII does is analyzed. from his tweets, to his passes, to his press conferences.

I think this is important. Keim sometimes seems reluctant to praise anything the Skins do, so in a way he's much more of a realist than some of the other reporters. Also Keim is better at watching tape/dissecting plays than the others. If he says someone did a good job, they did a good job.

But I will agree that RG3 tweets some eye-rolling stuff sometimes. It's very easy to avoid that, though: don't follow him, and don't watch ESPN (you shouldn't ever do the latter, anyway)

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Some of you negative RGIII guys in here are silly, the guy is a human being before a football player. His post was specifically for Jason Reid who trashed him for 2 days after his browns performance. He specifically said "RGIII was a disappointment and he always says he'll get better but he doesn't".

 

The thing about Jason Reid is that he seems determined to rip RG3 a new one now after focusing all his attention on the Shanahans previously and for the most part giving RG3 a pass. Something tells me RG3 blew him off in some kind way and now Reid is writing columns based on his hurt feelings. For the tough cat act Reid tries to put on he seems to be as moist as wet tissue paper.

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So, for three years he has listened to teammates, coaches and (because it's impossible to not hear one of the largest fan bases) fans and screaming to get down and stop taking hits, then, after a game he got up limping from a sack (which had nothing to do with him sliding) he makes a ten or so word TWEET about him working on it, he is now too sensitive?

 

This tripe should be in one of the plenty of other, soon to be locked bash robert threads. Annoying.

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I think if any of us had to have the way we breathe or pee analyzed by every media person and every fan in the country it would wear on you too. As for what he does on the field, I find it rather laughable that every person in the world gave Jason Campbell free passes for five years because he learned a new system every year, and people are saying don't worry Eli Manning will get better, after all he's learning a new system, yet Robert is learning a new one and people are complaining that he's not perfect after two preseason games and is a bust. Yeah, wonder why he might be a bit testy at times.

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Hes still learning how to be in the spotlight. Some of you act like these guys have been bred to ignore everything from birth and are able to relish in the spotlight. I am on twitter a lot and online in general some people are just nasty with the things they say and to just focus on random things he does off the field that isnt dangerous is crazy.

 

Look at how much the guys gives back to the community and treats the fanbase. People havent had this much access to these athletes ever and some of you need to realize they are humans. They hurt they get upset they vent they go and go about their days just like you and me.

 

Just relax and put yourself in that position because trust me if you we're a high class athlete i'm very sure some of the beatdowns would piss you off just as much.

 

Some of you over analyze things and arent even qualified of lack the perspective to draw such sweeping conclusions on people you only interact with from tv and reports from others.


I think if any of us had to have the way we breathe or pee analyzed by every media person and every fan in the country it would wear on you too. As for what he does on the field, I find it rather laughable that every person in the world gave Jason Campbell free passes for five years because he learned a new system every year, and people are saying don't worry Eli Manning will get better, after all he's learning a new system, yet Robert is learning a new one and people are complaining that he's not perfect after two preseason games and is a bust. Yeah, wonder why he might be a bit testy at times.

 Right. Too many people feel way to entitled to these athletes for no reason at all. Its cool be a fan but being a fanatic over everything so small is ridiculous. 

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I think its more immaturity than insecurity but time will tell.

His awkwardness is apparent every time i hear him talk, though. Its almost like he lives in some different reality where sliding isnt important and protecting himself is secondary to getting that extra yard.

He's definitely stubborn.

The good news is that if you/we are correct, this is something that can be fixed.

The real question is will rg3 grow up in time to fix it before he injures himself again?

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Humility is when you admit to the media, the fans, the coaches, and even the opponent that you need to do a better job of sliding/protecting yourself.

 

Insecurity is flicking off the opponent's sideline.

 

Every professional athlete is arrogant.  Every last one of them.  It's a matter of whether they voice the arrogance or not.  

 

Robert Griffin has a lot to learn on the field (which is to be expected at his age and level of experience) but based on what I've seen and heard he's ahead of the curve off the field.  

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