Rocket442Olds Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I seriously doubt 'just about anywhere' people are saying he's not a 2. If anything, Cousins probably has the 'sexy pick' tag more than any potential rookie prospect or other availables. I like Cousins, but other than a few folks singing his praise on Gameday in a box, no one really has offered much, or he'd be gone already. Why would anyone throw that much towards a guy drafted in the 4th round, with this as his stats for his past year: 4TD 7INT and a 52% Comp. Not only did his completion percentage go down, his average went from 9.7 to 5.5 which is a pretty big red flag, even if part of it is the scheme. A pretty aggressive regression from his rookie campaign where he looked more poised, with less knowledge of the playbook. I don't argue its all his fault with his stats, as it never is. The issue is he got more time than RG3, and was sacked less based on average dropbacks from his rookie year as well. I just don't get why everyone is overvaluing him. I guess its because John Gruden said nice things about him before a MNF game. If he was the measure for trades, everyone would be a 1st Round equivalent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Was listening to the local Buffalo Bills radio here yesterday morning and all 3 of the folks on there laughed at giving a 2nd for Cousins, and rattled off his large drop in statistics from Rookie to the 2013 Season. I agree with them, that most teams aren't stupid enough to give up that much for him. Each of them also agreed they'd not give a 3rd Round Pick for him either. One said he didn't want him at all, the other two said for a 4th or 5th they'd be happy with him coming to Buffalo. Not hugely important, but just a bit of info from what other teams fans/pundits are thinking about him. I'm guessing it is similar around the league. He got hyped up, based on a couple throws, and has since been quite mediocre. Considering their best option at QB is EJ Manuel, I don't think they should be laughing.Edit: nevermind. Read that wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirt Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I just don't get why everyone is overvaluing him. Because he's a QB, the most overvalued position there is, and rightfully so. As long as the player isn't horribly awful, some bad team could give them a shot. Besides, you could hardly call 2012 a "campaign" for Cousins and certainly not last year. Certainly not to the point where you could identify 'regression'. He's still mostly an unknown, who has done some good things. Isn't an asshat off the field. Was picked by Shannahan, who's opinion of QBs is respected, believe it or not. Not bad. If I were a Browns fan for instance, I'd be like "HELL YEA WHATEVER GIVE THEM A SECOND ROUNDER WE NEED A ****ING QB WHO ISN'T OUTRIGHT LOUSY FOR CRYIN OUT LOUD." And some coach or GM might say the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket442Olds Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Because he's a QB, the most overvalued position there is, and rightfully so. As long as the player isn't horribly awful, some bad team could give them a shot. Besides, you could hardly call 2012 a "campaign" for Cousins and certainly not last year. Certainly not to the point where you could identify 'regression'. He's still mostly an unknown, who has done some good things. Isn't an asshat off the field. Was picked by Shannahan, who's opinion of QBs is respected, believe it or not. Not bad. If I were a Browns fan for instance, I'd be like "HELL YEA WHATEVER GIVE THEM A SECOND ROUNDER WE NEED A ****ING QB WHO ISN'T OUTRIGHT LOUSY FOR CRYIN OUT LOUD." And some coach or GM might say the same thing. I suppose we'll see what happens, and I do agree QB is the position people will give more for. I still don't think that means someone will just throw a 2nd rounder at the Redskins to get him. I hope they do, but I am quite doubtful. As far as 2013, he was given the reigns of the team the final games of the season, knowing he was going to start those games. Those are the games teams will be looking at, and well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncr2h Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I suppose we'll see what happens, and I do agree QB is the position people will give more for. I still don't think that means someone will just throw a 2nd rounder at the Redskins to get him. I hope they do, but I am quite doubtful. As far as 2013, he was given the reigns of the team the final games of the season, knowing he was going to start those games. Those are the games teams will be looking at, and well... I could be going out on a limb here, but the teams might see that in perfect weather conditions he put on a passing showcase against one of the better QBs in the league. Then, in 2 games in horrible weather, he looked about as awful as the opposing QBs did. The two games that Cousins started in decent weather conditions (Cleveland and Atlanta), he put on some of the best passing performances we've seen here in the last several years. If you want to knock him for not being able to complete passes through gusts of wind combined with rain, that's fine but I don't think it's a very accurate predictor of where he's at in his development. Tony Romo sits to pee and Eli Manning looked pretty bad in those conditions as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 That's wrong. He's an Unrestricted Free Agent in two years. He's free at that point unless he's tagged. Sorry your right - because he will have four seasons of accrued service at the end of his current contract he will be unrestricted. He is still tied to us for two more years under his current deal though so there is no particular reason for us to have to move him this offseason or risk him walking away for nothing at the me of next season. My prediction is he is our backup QB this season. That said if someone does offer us a 2nd round pick I'd snatch their hands off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Sorry your right - because he will have four seasons of accrued service at the end of his current contract he will be unrestricted. He is still tied to us for two more years under his current deal though so there is no particular reason for us to have to move him this offseason or risk him walking away for nothing at the me of next season. My prediction is he is our backup QB this season. That said if someone does offer us a 2nd round pick I'd snatch their hands off. I agree. I like Cousins as a back up. He's also a classy guy. However, Cousins' stats this season are simply not good. Arguably, if you are trading for an unproven QB, you want to take someone who has played relatively well in their short stint, as opposed to mediocre with the hope that the short sample ISN'T a representative of what's to come. Watching Cousins this year and lets say I was a fan of another team needing a QB -- I wouldn't be excited about Cousins. I think there is just a good a chance if not more that Cousins will end up as a high end backup ala Jason Campbell then he will be a good starter, IMO. I'd take a 2nd or 3rd round pick for him now. My fear is with additional play he will be devalued more. Like Patrick Ramsey where we got a 6th rounder. And for Campbell we got a 5th rounder 3 drafts later -- which is the equivalent of a 7th rounder same year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirt Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 As far as 2013, he was given the reigns of the team the final games of the season, knowing he was going to start those games. Those are the games teams will be looking at, and well... Those games were a waste of time and everyone knew it. It wasn't like getting the reigns of a team, it was like preseason when it comes to evaluation. I mean, you could evaluate him from those games in it's own way, you could watch his mechanics and everything, but overall (for our sake, I hope), he's still mostly unknown. Young dude with potential that some team may want to mold into their QB, and basically, I think those last few games don't do much for him either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jflow78 Posted February 17, 2014 Share Posted February 17, 2014 This is one of those issues that I wish would just solve itself. I wish we never had to hear/argue about it again because we traded him for SOMETHING. It would be nice not to have to talk about whether or not we'll trade Cousins. Last season I didn't think it was a good time because Griffin was coming off of the ACL injury, this year, he's coming in healthy, and the draft is deep. I'd be more than happy with a 4th or 5th, and ecstatic with a 2nd (which will never happen) or a 3rd. This draft is so deep at positions like corner, WR, and QB, we could easily benefit from a trade like this. If we get a 4th, we can pick up a guard, RT, WR, FS, CB, or DL, 4 out of those 5 positions filled with guys who should become solid starters in the next couple years. If we keep him, we'll end up missing a deep draft with lots of positions we need, and then we'll be talking about it again next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMadisonSkins Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 So if you're Houston, do you draft Johnny Manziel #1 or do you draft Jadaveon Clowney #1 and trade #33 for Cousins? Manziel to Houston just seems much sexier than Bridgewater to Houston. Heard a debate on the radio about the Rams possibly looking QB. They aren't extending Bradford, so they might be looking to go QB at #2 as well, believe it or not. Then you have Jacksonville, Cleveland and Oakland. So now, believe it or not, you are looking at the possibility of QB going 1-2-3 ... so even Cleveland at #4 could be on the outside looking in ... not to mention Oakland at #5 and Minnesota at #8 .... Just some food for thought ... but St. Louis has a bunch of picks. They could get even more if they opt to trade out of #2. I wonder if this Bradford news makes them a candidate for trading us a 2nd for Cousins. After all, they could trade #2 to someone like Minnesota for #8, #40 and #72 ... have two 1sts (8 & 13), two 2nds, two 3rd, ... I'm sure a 2nd round pick wouldn't be "as valuable" to them if they could get a starter for one and still have 5 other picks in the first 3 rounds. Just something to keep in mind this far out. We have no idea how the draft will unfold ... but trading a 2nd round pick to us for Cousins allows a team like the Rams to either keep #2 and draft a stud like Clowney or trade back and get a king's ransom AGAIN from a team needing a QB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsforlife101 Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 So if you're Houston, do you draft Johnny Manziel #1 or do you draft Jadaveon Clowney #1 and trade #33 for Cousins? Manziel to Houston just seems much sexier than Bridgewater to Houston. Being a huge Penn State fan and following Bill O'Brien he is not going to go "for the sexier" pick I could see him bring in a well seasoned vet for one year and drafting a developmental QB like Derek Carr or Blake Bortles. I would be shocked if Houston traded for Cousins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistertim Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 I guess the way I look at it is: 32 teams passed on Cousins in the 2012 draft 3 times, some 4. If you're those same teams and you look at his body of work and his film since he has played in the league, would it be enough for you to bump his value up by 2 rounds from where you graded and passed on him? Also, pretend that Cousins was drafted by another team and had the exact same stats and looked exactly the same in the same number of showings but we have no homerism towards him because he isn't on our team; right now he is just a backup QB for some other team. Obviously we'll pretend we don't have RG3 so we're looking for a starter. Given his performances, stats, and amount of experience would you be ok giving up a high 2nd round pick for him? Maybe some won't admit it but I think there would be a fair amount of head scratching going on...if not some outright frothing at the mouth about giving up a high pick for an inexperienced guy with mediocre to crappy numbers and inconsistent play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Higgs44 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000326630/article/report-skins-want-secondrounder-for-kirk-cousins Mark Maske of The Washington Post reported Wednesday the Redskins want a second-round pick in the NFL draft if they were to trade the backup quarterback, according to a person familiar with the team's planning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
USS Redskins Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 What stupid team would give up a 2nd round pick? He certainly didnt show anything during his three game stint. Mabybe they are hoping Vinny got a GM job somewhere that needs a QB. Only the Redskins are stupid enough to give a 2nd round pick for Cousins... and you know what? I wouldnt rule that completely out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 What stupid team would give up a 2nd round pick? He certainly didnt show anything during his three game stint. Mabybe they are hoping Vinny got a GM job somewhere that needs a QB. Only the Redskins are stupid enough to give a 2nd round pick for Cousins... and you know what? I wouldnt rule that completely out. I know it's alot to read, being that the thread is 11 pages long, but this has been gone over ad naseum as to why asking for a 2nd is not out of the realm of possibility and that QBs are held to a different standard. And the more I look at the QBs in this draft, the more I think that this is not a strong QB class at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HtownRocks111 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 IMO the way these QBs out of college pan out is really hit or miss. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Rams give up their 2nd rounder to obtain Cousins . He is young and comes with a few starting reps under his belt. A young QB starting fresh with Jeff Fisher should produce good results. However I've always liked the idea of trading "future prospects" to teams in the AFC but if the Rams will give us a 2nd for Kirk then I will give my blessings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 What stupid team would give up a 2nd round pick? He certainly didnt show anything during his three game stint. Mabybe they are hoping Vinny got a GM job somewhere that needs a QB. Only the Redskins are stupid enough to give a 2nd round pick for Cousins... and you know what? I wouldnt rule that completely out. you can't think like a fan. think like the Raiders GM or the new guy warming the seat in cleveland, or the new guy in Houston.. They want a QB to keep their job and turn their team around. They only have two ways of getting him... draft or trade. guys looking to pick one are evaluating QBs against college defenses, while Cousins has plenty of NFL tape. there are VERY few "sure things" in the draft, as we all know. Top QBs bust all the time. It's high risk drafting a guy so high to be your franchise. What Cousins showed in those games last year was that he's a young Qb with a lot of upside, regardless of whether a fan sees it that way or not. They are not looking at the score, or his picks. they're looking at his mechanics, his pocket awareness, his ability to make the right read and where his throws go. (Obviously some travelled to the opponent, but they want to see his entire throw, can he put it on the outside, can he hit in stride, can he make a hot read and execute in the face of an NFL rush. He has shown he can, which means he can be taught to be better at some of the other things. They are dissecting him as the QB, not the team as his. They're looking at his faults and determining if they can work with them and grow him. They are evaluating him like they do top prospects in the draft, (Which he was on a lot of draft boards) and the upside there is he will be inexpensive and he's already got two years of NFL experience doing more than holding a clipboard. He's shown ups and downs. He's made good throws and bad. But he's made good throws in the NFL and won, which is something that is always a question when looking at drafting a QB. Last year's team was awful top to bottom, and everyone knows it. No one interested in trading for a quarterback is going to consider that when looking at Cousins. A second is not unreasonable by any stretch. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Does Cousin's have more value to the Redskins over a pick worse than a 2nd? I tend to say yes. Especially if Griffin is hurt again. If they don't get a 2nd for him, then I'd rather have him on the roster and now also be looking for your backup. I agree with Bang. Don't think like a fan. While I think the Browns make the most sense with Kyle going there, loving Kirk, and the team having a ton of picks. If Cousins was available to them in the 2nd this year with 2 years of NFL experience and knowing the system.....would they take him? That's the question. You're only going to start so many rookies...even with the Browns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 A couple things that have been mentioned over the past couple months... The Redskins setting a price for Cousins (in this case, a 2nd round pick) isn't the same as the Redskins expecting anyone to pay it. All it means is that they feel he's more valuable as their backup QB for the next two years than any pick lower than a 2nd. Though I don't think it's a given that a team would part with a 2nd for Cousins, I don't think it's ridiculous either. He isn't going to be awful as he's already proven on the field in 2012 and 2013. In a way, you are buying a young player who will still improve but has also shown that has already gained experience and already shown that he won't be a bust. No one knows that yet about ANY of the QBs available in the draft. I think it's still possible that a team will opt to risk a 2nd on a young veteran and hope that he develops into a very good starting QB. If not, we keep a very inexpensive and relatively competent backup for two more years. It isn't like our starter doesn't have injury concerns that we need to mitigate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Est.1974 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 No smoke without fire. The Kirk being traded talk keeps coming doesn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Paint Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 NFL Live was discussing Cousins and if he was worth a 2nd round pick. They all said he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 I agree with TD,, and further I think that setting the second as the opening bid could allow them to leave some wiggle room to accept a package of lower picks.. a 3rd and a 4th say, and maybe something in the pocket for next year. ~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 If we get a second rounder do it. We can find a backup to Robert. Let's Hope Bruce and Co. draft well. What if we find a 10 year starter, say on the O-line with that extra second pick? The potential of that outweighs any extra money we may have to give to a backup QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bang Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Would Rex playing #2 next year be out of the question for everyone?~Bang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 NFL Live was discussing Cousins and if he was worth a 2nd round pick. They all said he was.Then they should all be fired.A guy with a career QB rating of 68.6 and a TD to INT ratio of 8:10, is not worth a 2nd round pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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