Brian Orakpo: Current most over hyped Redskin? Or as good as advertised?

[skinny21]

We can do better for paying less for LB Jason Worilds of the Steelers. I would take him over Orakpo as I THINK he would cost less and produce just as well as Rak. He has been injured a lot less than Rak and is younger as well. I like Rak but he will cost more and we have a lot of other holes to fill. JMO.

This got me thinking. Playing Devil's advocate...

1). We've seen, over the years, plenty of complaints of letting guys walk that we should have kept around - Pierce, Rogers, Clark, Landry et al. So now we have a fairly young, homegrown player that would like to stay, has a great track record as a team guy, has produced quite well and we're talking of getting rid of him.

2). 'Rak hasn't produced - it's easy to say this, but it seems to me that Orakpo is probably our best defender at this point. His run game (particularly as the season wore on and he shook off some rust) has improved greatly and his sack % is on par with the elite players at his position.

3). There are too many other holes to fill to afford Orakpo - Do we need to fill all of our holes? What I mean is that every team has holes/weaknesses. What about building primarily through the draft? We're not going to the Super Bowl next year whether or not we re-sign Orakpo. So why not let some younger guys (including draft picks from 2014/2015) compete to fill some of these other holes?

4). Recently, many have lamented the lack of 'impact' players on defense. So, does not re-signing Orakpo (arguably the closest player we have to being an 'impact' player) to be able to afford 2-3 'solid' players change this?

In response to 3) and 4), I would say I like DG's suggestion of signing cheaper 'stopgaps' as bridge players for our youth. While I'm not enamored with stopgap-type players in general, I think this does help us build through the draft while not forcing us to rely on unproven players.

[bedlamVR]

The problem with signing stop gap players and hope youth develops is it doesn't make any sense . Especially when you are talking about a young player who has developed and has delivered is the guy you don't want to sign so you can sign 2,3 2nd/3rd tier starters that you know you are going to have to upgrade next year with your youth development players - or from outside - it is as if you are constantly running in place . 

 

Becasue lets look at this a little closer . You want an incomer to be able to take a starting slot, but he has to learn the system and get comfortable with the players around him and you have to hope he will fit in the locker room in a hurry and that is an investment in both time and resources - but then you want to also develop a younger player as well . So your starter cannot be too good as from the day he signs the clock is ticking .... but still the incomer will require more teaching time and familiarization as an player already on the roster ... so that will take time away from the youth players development because you spend money on someone and displace an existing team player you have to justify your investment ... and then if the youth player develops to the point he is above average, he is going to be at the end of his rookie contract and bam lets not resign him because well we will have holes on the team and we can afford 2-3 players who are not as good as him but can be stop gap replacements while we develop talent ...

 

It actually not unlike how we have been running the team for years, enamored with the next big thing, it was the reason Fred Smoot, Champ Bailey and Antonio Peirce went for the $$ rather than stuck with the team that gave them their chance because we were and are not a team, just a bunch of guys who wear the same clothes every sunday and they new no matter what they did for the team the team would never repay them ... so they left ... and the FO shoved them out the door illustrated best by how the team treated Ryan Clark

 

And what is crazy is the people who have been most vocal in the past for how stupid the FO is and we have to build through the draft are the ones who are the most vocal when it comes to paying the guys they build around in the draft .

 

Orakpo is as good as a player there is on the market this year - If he is not signed I would be very disappointed if he was not franchised it is absolute crazyness to develop a player whos play gets him accolades and then cheap out on him ... When I watch 98 even in games which his critics are the most critical I see a player who is hustling and never giving up ... in short he is a player I want on the team ... and okay how about this ...

 

As crazy as it might sound why save 2-3 million on not signing Orakpo to sign stop gaps - when we could just give our players opportunities to play and compete for those holes we have on the roster .. guys like Compton and Jenkins who are cheap and young and might actually fit in well with the team and systems we ask them to ... use what you have and you can save those 2-3 million $$ by not spending it on players you don't really want and focus the cap $$$ at areas to bring in marquee players who we really want .. Just a thought

[SWFLSkins]

http://www.csnwashington.com/football-washington-redskins/talk/redskins-orakpo-ranked-3rd-best-available-free-agent

 

If the Redskins are well know for wanting all of the sought-after free agents out there. This year one of their own will be among the most coveted players when free agency starts on March 11.

Chris Wesseling of NFL.com ranked the top 25 players expected to be available as free agents and Redskins linebacker Brian Orakpo came in at No. 3. Saints tight end Jimmy Graham tops the list and defensive end Greg Hardy is second.

[98ORAKPO98]

Yes! Rak is heading to his 3rd Pro Bowl, well deserved, he should have been selected to the Pro Bowl without having to have been an alternate.

 

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/114039/brian-orakpo-will-play-in-pro-bowl
 

 

Brian Orakpo's strong finish could result in a hefty contract this offseason. Turns out it also will result in a trip to Hawaii.
 

Orakpo was named to the Pro Bowl team as a replacement for San Francisco linebacker Ahmad Brooks, who pulled out of the game Tuesday. The 49ers had eight players chosen for the Pro Bowl this season, but none of them will play in Sunday's game. The 49ers lost to Seattle in the NFC Championship Game this past weekend.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

The question whether to re-sign Orakpo will come down to dollars and cents.  I find it hard to believe Allen is going to break the bank for the guy, though he probably wants him back at the right price.

 

The thing is that there are too many holes to fill if you burn up a significant portion of your cap room on 1 guy.  Really any guy.  

[skinny21]

The question whether to re-sign Orakpo will come down to dollars and cents. I find it hard to believe Allen is going to break the bank for the guy, though he probably wants him back at the right price.

The thing is that there are too many holes to fill if you burn up a significant portion of your cap room on 1 guy. Really any guy.

Yeah, this is why I'm leery of guys like Mack and Byrd - love what they'd bring but that's a lotta dough in one guy. If 'Rak weren't a homegrown, great work ethic solid citizen I would be totally against (re)signing him.

[Heathen]

If the Redskins are well know for wanting all of the sought-after free agents out there. This year one of their own will be among the most coveted players when free agency starts on March 11.

 

I can never finish articles that start out this grammatically poorly. Good Lord.

[98ORAKPO98]

Redskins' Haslett wants Orakpo, Hall to be re-signed

http://www.csnwashington.com/football-washington-redskins/talk/redskins-haslett-wants-orakpo-hall-be-re-signed

 

Haslett on Wednesday named four current Redskins when asked which players he considered “priorities” as the team decides who to re-sign. And while it’s always possible he overlooked a player or two, it is noteworthy that he singled out linebackers Brian Orakpo and Perry Riley, versatile lineman Chris Baker and cornerback DeAngelo Hall.

“I think ‘Rak is, obviously, a priority [as well as] Perry,” Haslett said, speaking at the Senior Bowl. “And we’ve got some other guys on defense: Chris Baker did a good job [as did] D-Hall.”

 

[98ORAKPO98]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2014/01/23/bruce-allen-redskins-will-be-active-in-free-agency/
 

 

“We’ll have some room,” Washington GM Bruce Allen said. “We’re gonna have some room to do some things. But we have some players who are free agents, and we’re going to talk to them first, to try to retain them. But we have the ability to maneuver around, and we’ll be active in free agency.”

 

[Slateman]

Still say it's in both parties' best interests to franchise him. Redskins get another year of Orakpo without having to compete against the NFL. Orakpo gets another year to prove he can stay healthy and be productive the whole season.

[SkinsTillIDie]

Whatever contract Orakpo gets this offseason will look like a bargain 2 years from now when Aldon Smith, Von Miller, Robert Quinn, et al get theirs.

 

Lotta good posts here, don't have too much to add except that it boggles my mind that:

a) We desperately need impact players on defense

Our fans desperately want impact players on defense

c) So many fans don't want to bring back our best impact player on defense (who's in his prime at 27)

 

 

We sure as hell won't win a Superbowl by letting Orakpo go and spreading the money he would've made on 2 or 3 lesser veterans. We'll win a Superbowl by drafting and developing impact players on rookie deals, getting contributions from role-playing veterans on role-playing deals, while our big-money stars (RGIII, Garcon, Orakpo, Williams) make big-money plays.

[98ORAKPO98]

Welcome to this thread TheKyle1591, after reading through this entire thread, tell us how long it took you. BTW it's good to have another Orakpo supporter on this thread.

Counting the days until Rak re ups on that Redskins contract extension.

[Thekyle1591]

Orakpo is our best defensive player and we need to lock him up. PFF rated him 3rd in run support and 2nd in pass coverage and 3rd overall. So while the big money guys rush the passer the majority of their snaps, Rak is a much more complete player and is one of the reasons the defense improved down the stretch when he started to round back into form. The way I see it, we have a handful of guys who will make big money in the future. Kerrigan, RG3, Trent Williams, Garcon and Rak. I didn't include Morris because nowadays RB's don't make big time money, and you can bet he won't be hardballing the Redskins for a jumbo contract. If we can actually hit on draft picks and sign quality free agents to reasonable deals (Broncos do this very well) then our team will get better. We won't ever be serious contenders if we let our homegrown, impact players go in favor of signing "quality starters". We also won't get better if we overpay for guys like Jarius Bryd or Alex Mack. You ever see the Pats sign someone to a jumbo deal? Very rarely if at all. 

Welcome to this thread TheKyle1591, after reading through this entire thread, tell us how long it took you. BTW it's good to have another Orakpo supporter on this thread.

Counting the days until Rak re ups on that Redskins contract extension.

Thought i'd add my opinion before reading through this giant thread haha. 

[98ORAKPO98]

Orakpo is our best defensive player and we need to lock him up. PFF rated him 3rd in run support and 2nd in pass coverage and 3rd overall. So while the big money guys rush the passer the majority of their snaps, Rak is a much more complete player and is one of the reasons the defense improved down the stretch when he started to round back into form. The way I see it, we have a handful of guys who will make big money in the future. Kerrigan, RG3, Trent Williams, Garcon and Rak. I didn't include Morris because nowadays RB's don't make big time money, and you can bet he won't be hardballing the Redskins for a jumbo contract. If we can actually hit on draft picks and sign quality free agents to reasonable deals (Broncos do this very well) then our team will get better. We won't ever be serious contenders if we let our homegrown, impact players go in favor of signing "quality starters". We also won't get better if we overpay for guys like Jarius Bryd or Alex Mack. You ever see the Pats sign someone to a jumbo deal? Very rarely if at all. 

Thought i'd add my opinion before reading through this giant thread haha. 

Well said and I agree with your assessment that Brian Orakpo is a very well rounded player. IMO, he is a top 10 defensive player in the NFL.

[Thekyle1591]

Jenkins will have a year of learning under his belt so maybe not. 

 

Hail. 

Facepalm. 

Well said and I agree with your assessment that Brian Orakpo is a very well rounded player. IMO, he is a top 10 defensive player in the NFL.

I wouldn't go that far. I would say he is a top 10 OLB in the NFL. 

[98ORAKPO98]

Facepalm. 

I wouldn't go that far. I would say he is a top 10 OLB in the NFL. 

Top 10 NFL defensive players in no particular order.

 

Brian Orakpo

J.J. Watt

Robert Quinn

Von Miller

Luke Kuechly

NaVorro Bowman

Richard Sherman

Darrelle Revis

Patrick Peterson

Earl Thomas

 

HM: Geno Atkins

[Thekyle1591]

Top 10 NFL defensive players in no particular order.

 

Brian Orakpo

J.J. Watt

Robert Quinn

Von Miller

Luke Kuechly

NaVorro Bowman

Richard Sherman

Darrelle Revis

Patrick Peterson

Earl Thomas

 

HM: Geno Atkins

I'd say

1. JJ Watt

2. Von Miller

3. Geno Atkins

4. Gerald Mccoy

5. Revis

6. Quinn

7. Sherman

8. Aldon Smith

9. Bowman

10. Eric Weddle

In that order. 

[98ORAKPO98]

I'd say

1. JJ Watt

2. Von Miller

3. Geno Atkins

4. Gerald Mccoy

5. Revis

6. Quinn

7. Sherman

8. Aldon Smith

9. Bowman

10. Eric Weddle

In that order. 

Suh > Mccoy

Thomas > Weddle

Aldon Smith is an overrated one trick pony who has Justin Smith eating up blocks for him.

[Thekyle1591]

Suh > Mccoy

Thomas > Weddle

Aldon Smith is an overrated one trick pony who has Justin Smith eating up blocks for him.

Being a bigger name doesn't necessarily mean he is a better player. Weddle is the most versatile safety in the league and Mccoy had 3 more run game stops and 5 more sacks. Aldon Smith might be a 1 trick pony but he does his one trick as well as anyone in the league. 

[98ORAKPO98]

Being a bigger name doesn't necessarily mean he is a better player. Weddle is the most versatile safety in the league and Mccoy had 3 more run game stops and 5 more sacks. Aldon Smith might be a 1 trick pony but he does his one trick as well as anyone in the league. 

We're all entiteled to our own opinion, but do you not agree that Orakpo deserves to be mentioned with the likes of these guys? If Rak was allowed to rush the passer more he would have the gaudy sack numbers that some of the these other pass rushers get. But Rak does way more than just pass rush, he defends the run as well as just about any outside linebacker, he drops into coverage very well, he makes big plays like the pick 6 and the nine tackles for loss he had this season. He needs to force more fumbles but he does go for the strip sack and just didn't have any luck this season, I expect that to change next season. Rak should have his name mentioned as a potential top 10 defensive player.

[TexasSkinsFan]

I'd say

1. JJ Watt

2. Von Miller

3. Geno Atkins

4. Gerald Mccoy

5. Revis

6. Quinn

7. Sherman

8. Aldon Smith

9. Bowman

10. Eric Weddle

In that order. 

 

How many of the people saying not to re-sign Orakpo realize that he had .5 sacks LESS then JJ Watt last year? Or had more sacks then Aldon Smith? Guys who generally are considered "better" pass rushers then Orakpo?

[Thekyle1591]

We're all entiteled to our own opinion, but do you not agree that Orakpo deserves to be mentioned with the likes of these guys? If Rak was allowed to rush the passer more he would have the gaudy sack numbers that some of the these other pass rushers get. But Rak does way more than just pass rush, he defends the run as well as just about any outside linebacker, he drops into coverage very well, he makes big plays like the pick 6 and the nine tackles for loss he had this season. He needs to force more fumbles but he does go for the strip sack and just didn't have any luck this season, I expect that to change next season. Rak should have his name mentioned as a potential top 10 defensive player.

I think his numbers would be better if he had more opportunities, but you cannot pass a player like Aldon Smith who makes the most of his opportunities up for someone who has the potential to be better. That is all I'm saying. I think Rak is a top 10 3-4 OLB, maybe even top 5, but comparing him to a safety or corner is a useless gesture.  

How many of the people saying not to re-sign Orakpo realize that he had .5 sacks LESS then JJ Watt last year?

Watt also plays 3-4 end.. and had 85 total pressures. Rak had 51. The real value in Orakpo isn't his sack numbers but his run defense and pass coverage ability.

[TexasSkinsFan]

I think his numbers would be better if he had more opportunities, but you cannot pass a player like Aldon Smith who makes the most of his opportunities up for someone who has the potential to be better. That is all I'm saying. I think Rak is a top 10 3-4 OLB, maybe even top 5, but comparing him to a safety or corner is a useless gesture.  

Watt also plays 3-4 end.. and had 85 total pressures. Rak had 51. The real value in Orakpo isn't his sack numbers but his run defense and pass coverage ability.

 

Of course. I said in another thread today that Orakpo had 43 solo tackles which was only bested by JJ Watt, Terrell Suggs, Oliver Vernon, and Robert Quinn from the players who had 10 or more sacks like he did in 2013.

[KDawg]

Watt also plays 3-4 end.. and had 85 total pressures. Rak had 51. The real value in Orakpo isn't his sack numbers but his run defense and pass coverage ability.

 

Watt is also able to rush the passer much more than Rak is due to the nature of the position. Given Watt's alignment, it's tough for him to get pressure, which is why his numbers are beyond impressive. But comparing total pressures of a guy who rushes nearly every pass attempt versus a guy who drops into coverage fairly often is a poor measuring stick.

[Thekyle1591]

Watt is also able to rush the passer much more than Rak is due to the nature of the position. Given Watt's alignment, it's tough for him to get pressure, which is why his numbers are beyond impressive. But comparing total pressures of a guy who rushes nearly every pass attempt versus a guy who drops into coverage fairly often is a poor measuring stick.

Yeah but for his position his pass rushing snaps this season were actually behind most of the other guys at the position. Almost a 100 less than Calais Campbell and 30 or so less than cam jordan and Kyle Williams. So when you compare him to his peers, his numbers get even more impressive.