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illone

DT/DE free agents.... Who should we target?!

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Maybe Brunell can play DE?? His ridiculously overpaid "butt" is the reason we've lost and are going to continue losing players account the salary cap. Put Campbell in at QB and see if Brunell can cause some TO's....we all know he's pretty good at turning the ball over himself.

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I've said it several times before on this board: Darren Howard is the player we should target. He's got the size (275) that neither Abraham (258) nor Mathis (235) possess, and that Gregg Williams/Greg Blache obviously covet in their DEs. Unlike Abraham and Mathis, Howard is strong against the run. He may not be the pure pass-rusher that those players are, but he can also pressure the QB. He can even move inside and play DT on passing downs, which we have seen out of Wynn and Evans particularly in GW's scheme, and should be appealing.

The question is, how affordable and available will Howard be...

As has been previously mentioned, he was franchised last season. This means two things: A) It's certainly conceivable that the Saints will simply franchise him again, and he'll be completely off-limits and B) He will be looking for some pretty big-time money. As to him being franchised again, I think it's unlikely. The Saints have Charles Grant and Will Smith to hold down those spots, and with so many needs, I can't see them committing another 6+ million to a rotation DE. As to his price, I think he'll be looking for something like 5-6M per year. That's a large amount, but I personally feel we can justify it for a guy who will give our defense a huge boost. That should, after all is said and done, leave enough money to sign our picks and probably a decent nickel CB (that isn't Walt Harris) and a backup OG; neither of those positions should be particularly expensive to fill with a veteran.

That would leave us with a 2nd and 3rd round pick to use on a WR and on a rotation DT. At WR in that range we should be looking at guys like Martin Nance (Miami-Ohio), Mike Hass (Oregon State), Demetrius Williams (Oregon), Derek Hagan (Arizona State), Jason Avant (Tennessee), Todd Watkins (BYU), Sinorice Moss (Miami), and Skyler Green (LSU). Those guys can all play, although it seems unlikely any of them will step right in and make a difference as rookies. At DT in that range we are looking at possibly Gabe Watson (Michigan), Jesse Mahelona (Tennessee), Claude Wroten (LSU), Babatunde Oshinowo (Stanford), Orien Harris (Miami), Dusty Dvoracek (Oklahoma), and Steve Fifita (Utah). Again, probably not DROYs there, but very probably we could come up with a solid rotation guy who could develop into a good starter. Please note I'm not saying all those guys will be available Round 2-3, because they won't. I'm just throwing out some possibilities.

I think, then, if you save your FA money for Howard, a nickel CB, and a versatile OL backup, and get some solid depth at WR and DT with our first two picks, we then have needs really only at TE and perhaps a backup RB if Ladell Betts hits the road in FA (unlikely, IMO).

How do we address these holes, you ask? The magic of the compensatory pick. With the losses of Smoot and Pierce to FA, and the only real additions in FA being Rabach and Patten, we are in line for some pretty decent comp picks, quite possibly even a 3rd and a 4th. Just another little side benefit to being a bit more frugal in the FA market.

Thus, I'm looking at an offseason with the following additions:

DE Darren Howard

A solid vet nickel CB to backup Springs and Rogers

A versatile OL, preferably mainly an OG

A WR/DT/TE in the second round

A WR/DT/TE in the third round

A WR/DT/TE with a compensatory pick

Late round picks used for secondary, WR, and OL depth

That's pretty reasonable, I think, and would really improve the team.

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e16bball,

I wouldn't be opposed to going after Howard I just think Abraham is a prime target due to his current situation w/ the Jets. Either of those players would be a considerable upgrade. I figure both would be about the same price so you definitely have a solid point.

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Robert Mathis #98

Definitely Robert Mathis #98 of the Indianapolis Colts. We should go after him like no other player. He is by far the best man in the defensive free agency.

After 10 weeks of foot ball here are Mathis's stats::applause:

32 Tackles

09 Asst. Tackles

07 Forced Fumbles (That takes care of TO ratio right there)

01 Pass Defended

:logo: :point2sky :eaglesuck :gaintsuck :dallasuck :point2sky :logo:

Don't see any sacks on that there list.....

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e16bball,

I wouldn't be opposed to going after Howard I just think Abraham is a prime target due to his current situation w/ the Jets. Either of those players would be a considerable upgrade. I figure both would be about the same price so you definitely have a solid point.

Yeah man, I definitely agree that they can both play some football. There are two factors that make me prefer Howard.

First, he has the size necessary to hold up against double teams. Abraham, with the Jets, is playing opposite Shaun Ellis, who happens to be an extremely good DE in his own right and next to DeWayne Robertson, who is a beast as well. With the Skins, a DE will be the main pass-rush threat, with only Griffin there to really attract any other attention. Abraham, if faced with double teams on passing downs, will have trouble holding up, I think.

Second, I think Howard's current team situation is actually more conducive to him being attainable. The Saints actually have his replacement on the team (as opposed to the Jets, who would have to pick up a replacement) and they are team in flux, even more so than the Jets, I think. They simply have to go in a new direction, and will need money to spend on perhaps QB, WR, OL, DT, OLB, CB, and S.

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Oh, and I should add, I agree with the people who earlier mentioned Aaron Kampman as a solid backup plan. The guy plays with a lot of heart, and a non-stop motor. I like him, definitely.

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Dwight Freeney.

I don't think Indy is going to be able to resign all of their big name free agents. I think Freeney will be resigned by them, but if he doesn't, we need to make a play for him. Freeney+Griff+Salave'a+Wynn/Daniels/Rookie = Money DLine.

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Dwight Freeney.

I don't think Indy is going to be able to resign all of their big name free agents. I think Freeney will be resigned by them, but if he doesn't, we need to make a play for him. Freeney+Griff+Salave'a+Wynn/Daniels/Rookie = Money DLine.

I just feel like Freeney will be too expensive for us. We are not exactly overflowing with cap room, and we have some holes other than DE that we really need to fill.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Freeney and he'd be an amazing acquisition. I just don't know if we can justify the cost.

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I just feel like Freeney will be too expensive for us. We are not exactly overflowing with cap room, and we have some holes other than DE that we really need to fill.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Freeney and he'd be an amazing acquisition. I just don't know if we can justify the cost.

Cash beats cap, my friend :)

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Cash beats cap, my friend :)

I totally agree, with a hefty signing bonus we can sign just about any FA out there. Sign either Mathis or Freeny. Then make a huge play for Wayne. Pick up some value picks in the draft (OL, DL) and sign a few role players in FA. That would put this team on track. FILL THE HOLES JOE, FILL THE HOLES!!!

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Okay, okay, maybe we can afford to sign Freeney. If we can, believe me, I'm the first on his bandwagon. I love the guy.

But let's not even think about going after Robert Mathis. His stats are impressive, but you have to view them in the context of what happens ON THE FIELD. He simply can't play on possible running downs, because he's way too small to hold up at the POA against huge OTs. He's a 3rd down pass-rush specialist exclusively, and I really don't think we should spend a load of money on a guy who won't play every down, especially one who is only outstanding because of the guy playing opposite him. Additionally, he's a RFA, and the Colts will obviously tender him; thus, it would cost us a pick in addition to excessive amounts of money.

I don't know if any of the cap specialists will look over this thread, but if one of you happens by, could you please clue me in as to the likelihood of us clearing enough space for Freeney?

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Something to think about, maybe. Why would Freeney want to come here? The big pay day is only reason I can think of. He is already on the best team in the league and on one of the best defenses (as of this year) in the league. As of right now, I can't think of one team that can beat the Colts. Besides a massive payday, why would he want to leave a Superbowl caliber team?

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Elvis Dumervil from Lousville has 20 sacks or so right now he's pushing for Suggs NCAA record. In the draft he or Kiwi would be the best bet but we would have to get a first rounder which would severly handicap us for the rest of the draft.

A pass rushing end being as tough as it is to find one it might be better to just break the bank for Abraham. A proven commodity is worth a whole lot especially when you weigh his contract vs that of a high round pick.

But I'm just rambling I'm sure the coaches know what they need and will address that.

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Something to think about, maybe. Why would Freeney want to come here? The big pay day is only reason I can think of. He is already on the best team in the league and on one of the best defenses (as of this year) in the league. As of right now, I can't think of one team that can beat the Colts. Besides a massive payday, why would he want to leave a Superbowl caliber team?

Ty Law?

It's all about the $$.....

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Elvis Dumervil from Lousville has 20 sacks or so right now he's pushing for Suggs NCAA record. In the draft he or Kiwi would be the best bet but we would have to get a first rounder which would severly handicap us for the rest of the draft.

A pass rushing end being as tough as it is to find one it might be better to just break the bank for Abraham. A proven commodity is worth a whole lot especially when you weigh his contract vs that of a high round pick.

But I'm just rambling I'm sure the coaches know what they need and will address that.

But he got a third of those sacks in one game against a horrible Kentucky team.

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Offseason BUMP.

Time to shore up the pass rush this off-season. Phillip Daniels is servicable but not a long term answer.

We need a pure pass rushing end! Time to step to the plate, GW and Gibbs. Let's get it done this year.

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I want to know what our salary cap numbers are after we cut Ramsey (inevitable) and if Arrington restructures his contract or gets cut.

Evans needs to take over for Wynn, that much is obvious. If Daniels resurgence continues we might not need a high priced FA, but I do want to start drafting DE's.

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If Daniels resurgence continues we might not need a high priced FA, but I do want to start drafting DE's.

Yea, what a fluke occurance. Nobody could have predicted that. 4 sacks in the Dallas game? Maybe he started on the juice;).

I've been wanting to draft DE's for a few seasons now.

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Yea, what a fluke occurance. Nobody could have predicted that. 4 sacks in the Dallas game? Maybe he started on the juice;).

Its about time!! :D Kidding ;)

When Daniels was in Chicago, he was effective . . . when he was healthy. Problem is, he had trouble staying healthy

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I think the key is getting a defensive end to add youth, because right now the defensive ends are starters Renaldo Wynn (31), Phillip Daniels (32), and backups Nic Clemons (25) and Demetric Evans (26). Evans really came on late in the season and there is a chance he could be part of the answer as a pass rusher, but I am not sure about that. Clemons, to my knowledge, didn't play a great deal, only recording two tackles.

Phillip Daniels is 32, but last year his 8 sacks were excellent, and he really came on starting with the Dallas game, and its clear that he has found a place in Washington. Renaldo Wynn is not spectacular but doesn't make mistakes, and it would be possible to have Wynn be in there starting along with Daniels, but to add someone in the 2nd round of the draft who is an edge rusher and who could come in on passing downs.

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